Author Topic: Battery question? (Read 1649 times)

LoopsAndLogic · « **on:** March 02, 2009, 11:10:38 AM »

I know it's been asked before, but my battery seems to be around 50-75% charged, after checking all the cells.

Can the 400F run on this without damaging anything?? What I should say, is will it put a strain on the electronics?

If so, which ones?

I was hoping with longer rides, it might come back to normal, but I'm not sure if it will.

Getting geared up for riding season.....so either I use it, or fork over another $50 bucks this season.

And I know it isn't that much, but I like to save where I can.

P.S. Always leave your battery on the trickle charger....lesson learned.

number13 · « **Reply #1 on:** March 02, 2009, 12:19:11 PM »

I wouldn't risk riding with only 50%
of a battery. You may be able to go short distances,
but that is not enough power to run the bike
with the headlights on.
Have you determined if your charging system is doing its job?
It is easy enough, just start the bike and clip a voltage meter
to the battery, you should see the voltage rise as the RPMs rise.

Also, I doubt there will be any significant damage to the bike by running
a low battery, but it may screw up an electronic ignition if you have one.

eldar · « **Reply #2 on:** March 02, 2009, 01:57:40 PM »

Is this common for people with the smaller bikes to have to put on a trickle charger after rides?
I would think that honda would have designed the system to fully charge the battery on a ride. Seems kinda odd to me.
How much charge does your battery hold after you charge it? It might just be a bad battery and might not have anything to do with the bike.

number13 · « **Reply #3 on:** March 02, 2009, 02:08:06 PM »

I know in my instance I have to occasionally use
a trickle charger because my rides are typically
very short, to work and back. Throw in using the electric starter and lights on the ride home each night and a battery can get depleted faster than the bike's
charging system will replenish.

gregk · « **Reply #4 on:** March 02, 2009, 02:30:50 PM »

I have the same problem with both my 400F's. Around town, the battery will get drained. Out on the road it seems to work fine. I don't think that the charging system on these bikes very good to start with.

Greg

eldar · « **Reply #5 on:** March 02, 2009, 02:40:22 PM »

Are you all still using the old mechanical vreg? Maybe switching to an electronic one might help?

LoopsAndLogic · « **Reply #6 on:** March 03, 2009, 10:22:33 AM »

I should have rephrased that...what I meant to say was, after my battery has been sitting in my house for
the whole winter without being charged, it's only taking a 60-75% charge.

Still can't reach 100% charged.

It is a 3 year old Wal-mart battery, but I'm trying to see if I could be damaging anything by running my bike with this battery.

My electronics are in fine shape. And I never have to use a charger in the season even on short rides.

You might want to check your 400f's stator....those have a tendency to go out around 20k miles.

Thanks for the reply number13

Cheers

eldar · « **Reply #7 on:** March 03, 2009, 01:02:21 PM »

OK now we got it. Replace the battery. I have gone through a couple of the walmart batteries. They seem to have a short life span. they are good in a pinch but only make it about 3 years it seems.

Bob Wessner · « **Reply #8 on:** March 03, 2009, 01:15:22 PM »

Loops,

I'm assuming you checked the level of the electrolyte?

TwoTired · « **Reply #9 on:** March 03, 2009, 01:32:43 PM »

Quote from: LoopsAndLogic on March 03, 2009, 10:22:33 AM

I should have rephrased that...what I meant to say was, after my battery has been sitting in my house for
the whole winter without being charged, it's only taking a 60-75% charge.

Still can't reach 100% charged.

It is a 3 year old Wal-mart battery, but I'm trying to see if I could be damaging anything by running my bike with this battery.

My electronics are in fine shape. And I never have to use a charger in the season even on short rides.

Cheers

I ran my Cb550 for two years while commuting with a weak battery. It doesn't hurt the bike. Any hurt is going to be psychological for the rider.
FYI, I would only run the headlight at night. Kick start only. The 74 550 has a headlight switch. >>Do<< keep the fluid level up.
A voltage check should tell you if you have a dead cell. If you have a dead cell, it is definitely replacement time. Report the battery voltage after charging and a 2 hour rest period.

Quote

Still can't reach 100% charged.

How did you determine this? A voltage measurement, or a charger assessment? Was this a load test, or is the assessment voltage based? IS the charger for MC batteries or autos?

Cheers,

eldar · « **Reply #10 on:** March 03, 2009, 01:43:42 PM »

A charger is a charger. What is important is the amperage and voltage. An mc batt should be charged around 1 - 2 amps or so. I suppose an anal person could insist on trickle but again that is just the amount of charge being applied and nothing more. Of course 12 volts will be used but you have to check, some chargers do 6 volts.

Easy way to look at it. A 14 Ah batt should take about 14 hours on 1 amp if it is completely dead But very few batts come back from completely dead, if any. You can only shove so much charge in a battery and the older/cheaper it is, the less it will take. Walmart batteries are pretty cheap.

LoopsAndLogic · « **Reply #11 on:** March 03, 2009, 03:12:02 PM »

Ok, I hope I answer everything....

I check the voltage across the terminals = 13.33v when off the charger and then 24hours = 12.66v.

I charged it at 2 amps and then at 1.5amps and then I put it on a automatic trickle charger that shuts off when it reaches it's peak voltage.

I used the hydrometer but the F'n thing is in accurate. I'll get a 50% reading on one cell, and then try it again, and the same cell then reads 75%, then again it reads 45%.

These mini hydrometers are crappy period!!

And I can't fit the car hydrometers because they suck too much fluid in order to read it. The cells don't have enough fluid plus the
cells get in the way for sucking up fluid.

So, I'll just run it for the beginning of the season then midway, replace the darn thing.

And your right TT, it would be a psychological thing for the rider! lol

Cheers

LL

TwoTired · « **Reply #12 on:** March 03, 2009, 03:37:13 PM »

The voltage checks ok. If your hydrometer is dodgy, it could be lying about anything and seems unworthy of trust.

The only other test would be to load test it. (Fixed load vs. time)

Otherwise, if it starts the bike, use it, I say. Take deep breaths in an out slowly. Admire the wonders of nature and relax.

ooohhhmmmm.

Cheers,

LoopsAndLogic · « **Reply #13 on:** March 04, 2009, 05:16:31 AM »

LOL

Thanks

LL

HondaMan · « **Reply #14 on:** March 04, 2009, 05:35:11 AM »

Most batteries today will not last as long as batteries made prior to 2000, if you're getting the ones from Wal-Mart, Checker Auto, etc. The Chinese have been recycling lead, not too purely, and it is finding its way into the lower cost batteries. The result is batteries that only live about 2/3 to 3/4 as long as they used to before the virgin lead is saturated with oxide.

Typical example: my 750 has always received 4-5 years per battery. Since 2002, when I bought the first of the "Made in China" batteries, it's on #3, 2nd year, and the post-charger voltage is only 12.6 instead of the more usual 13.0 volts.

If you can find Yuasa's brand, or if you can fit one of the AGM types, you might find bettter life in the long run.

eldar · « **Reply #15 on:** March 04, 2009, 06:00:37 AM »

Loops, why dont you charge the batt and then take it somewhere to get it tested? If anything, at least you will know then. Most places will test a battery for free or minimal cost.

78CB750CAFE · « **Reply #16 on:** March 04, 2009, 06:46:20 AM »

beware having your m/c battery tested in an auto parts store, their testers are made for the higher amp load of a car battery and if an employee who doesn't know what he is doing you can at best get a false/bad reading, at worst they can ruin a good battery.

eldar · « **Reply #17 on:** March 04, 2009, 08:27:47 AM »

His mc shop should be able to do it.

LoopsAndLogic · « **Reply #18 on:** March 04, 2009, 11:04:11 AM »

Good point...my MC shop should be able to do it.

Definitely going to look into a AGM battery. I've heard nothing but good news from them.

LL

Bodi · « **Reply #19 on:** March 04, 2009, 07:20:42 PM »

I'm not convinced that AGM batteries are made to provide the starting motor current. The ones I see have 1/4" spade terminals, while "real" bike batteries have hefty metal bars poking out with 6mm bolts to connect the heavy gauge starter cables. Is there some other kind of AGM battery available, I only see the kind normally used in emergency lights, UPS units, and electric riding toys?
The 5 ball mini hygrometer is inherently quite accurate but in use has some problems. The balls can stick together just from surface tension I think. Tiny gas bubbles can stick to a ball too, making it float when really it should sink. I tried checking several using salt water and found they were reading exactly the same after I tapped on them to eliminate the bubbles and sticking.
My 400F (with Dyna 5 ohm coils + Martek ignition and a 55/65W H4 headlight) will just not keep full charge in city riding with the headlight on. Highway work will but it's marginal. Installing some sort of lower power daytime running light and turning the headlight off in daytime is my next project in trying to eliminate trickle charging. I have the Oregon regulator and a LED tail light.

eldar · « **Reply #20 on:** March 04, 2009, 07:50:45 PM »

http://www.batteriesplus.com/p-34344-xtreme-permaseal-high-performance-agm-powersport-battery.aspx

This is the batt I got. Has over 204 cranking amps, almost double a standard batt. It is the real deal.

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Author Topic: Battery question? (Read 1649 times)

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