Topic: Question for painters

[TRPLE]

I just learned to paint in the last couple weeks. I am an engineering student with access to the department paint booth. I did 3 sets of my own stuff, and taught my roommate on his CB450 stuff. I recently wet sanded my CB500 tank with 1000 grit paper. I was told that using a mild Meguires (or was it Mothers? Well it was a 5 on their scale of 10 in terms of aggressiveness) polish would take out the sanding marks. Not so. I was wondering what you guys used to finish out base/clear paintjobs on your projects?

 - Matt

[Terry in Australia]

G'Day Mate, what did you paint it with, acrylic laquer, enamel, or 2 pack? (2K) 1000 grit is particularly fine, so the scratch marks should be minimal, I wouldn't use either of the products mentioned if they contain silicone (most do) as it'll block the pores in your paint and cause it to blister. If you've already done that, then wash it off with "prep wash" and a clean cloth, then rinse off with water.

Get yourself some "cutting" or "buffing" compound and using a damp balled up old T shirt and a couple of drops of the stuff, rub it in until your arm falls off, then put your arm back on and rub it in some more until it starts to look like your staring into a mirror, and you'll be done. If you've got your tank firmly secured to a stand, use a buffing machine with a foam pad, it's a lot quicker and the foam pad won't "burn through" your paint as quick as a sheepskin pad will. Cheers, Terry.    

[kghost]

Spot on Terry.

Remember to let the paint Cure before using wax or silicion base products. Volitile chemicals will continue to Flash out (or out Cure) of the paint for a while. How long depends on the process used. Polyuretane can take up to 30 days if my Dupont Directions are correct.

Terry is K2 the same as a Base/Clearcoat system?

[Quail "Owner of the comfortable k8"]

What part on the drivetrain was painted from the factory,  was all the polished alum coated with somethin from the factory, how about the valve covers?

[kghost]

Yes, some of the aluminum was. Thats why it turns yellow and gets dirty underneath. With what I dont really know. Probably Lacquer?

[Terry in Australia]

G'Day Guys, yeah 2K is that basecoat/clearcoat stuff, really good stuff like a hardened enamel to prepare and paint, only harder again. Kasper (the friendly KGhost?) is quite correct with the assumption that Honda used clear acrylic laquer to coat all their polished alloy. I heard a rumour (which I beleive to be true) that the factory actually painted the tanks and sidecovers without primer, which probably explains a lot, ha ha! Cheers, Terry.

[schmidbc]

Has anyone tried to repaint their calipers?  I've just acquired a kit that is specially meant for brake calipers; however, I'm not sure of the best way to remove the old paint and prepare the surface for new paint!

Unfortunately, I need a bit more pedestrian method than our engineering friend, my resources don't include a wet-sander.

[kghost]

Schmidbc- wet sanding doesn't use a machine. You use wet type sandpaper and water. The paper doesnt desolve and better yet doesnt clog up nearly as fast.

I powdercoated my brake caliper. Works great resists all sorts of chemicals (DOT-3 brake fluid). Also powdercoated several polished aluminum pieces with clear, Just wanted to see how it would hold up.

Terry, Yeah the basecoat/clear is about all I use now. Sure is easier fixing little problems before the clear. And yes that would be correct with the K, not so funny in elementary school but I developed. (only a little).

[Quail "Owner of the comfortable k8"]

So the engine block and trans case was painted a silver/grey color and all the bolt on parts are chrome or polished.  Is powder coating expensive? What kind of prep does it require?  Do you have to tear the engine down?  is it better than 2K?   

[Terry in Australia]

Yes that would be correct with the K, not so funny in elementary school but I developed. (only a little).

G'Day Kasper, well I like Kasper for a name mate, so f*ck 'em, I reckon! Ha ha, kids can be crueller than cops.

Powder coating is definately the way to go, cheaper than paint and lasts (almost) forever. I just went around to an AJ (Army Jerk) friends home here on base, he showed me a Triumph engined chop he's building, he had a couple of Honda hubs laced to old rims that he had powdercoated fire-engine red, and I tell you what, with the white wall Avon tires, it looks brilliant! Total cost for powder-coating both rims, $60.00.

There's not much you can't get powdercoated, an my local shop does hot-tanking and beadblasting on site, so it's a one stop shop. I'm gonna get my spare F2 M/C and both spare front calipers powdercoated, I painted the M/C with caliper paint, and it lasted until I spilled brake fluid on it the first time, even though I beadblasted it first, etch primed it and baked the smelly crap on in my wifes kitchen oven and let it sit for a week to cure.

I'm seriously thinking about stripping my F2 engine back to the last nut and bolt and powdercoating the cases, but it is a strip down to nothing, "Hot Tank" (degrease paint strip) deal. don't beadblast engine cases unless you want to spend a week flushing every last bead of blasting grit out of every oilway, and praying silently that you've got them all out, knowing that just a few will be enough to destroy your bike, your bank account and your marriage.

My only worry with powdercoating is that it fills so well that it's a bugger to get out of threads and other tight places, so you have to be extra careful to esure it is perfectly masked before they start blowing the powder on. Cheers, Terry.

[kghost]

For wear and resistance to chemicals powder coating is far better than paint. My Engine cases are powdercoated.

What they do is spray it on in a powder form. The gun and the piece are electically charged. The charge sucks the powder onto your piece. Then they bake it in an oven. The results are a hard durable surface much more resistant than paint. To prep it they usually bead or sand blast the part to bare metal (great for getting rid of greasy, grime and rust). The powder is sprayed on the bare metal.

What it costs depends on the powdercoater near you. Mine is a real bargain.

One bit of advice.... Powdercoating aluminum that has been cast or pressure molded requires pre-heating of the piece before the powder is applied. The pre heating gets the aluminum to oven temp to prevent later out gassing from the aluminum.

If anyone would like a picture of the engine cases on my bike and how I did them let me know and we'll start a new thread.

[heffay]

tell us powdercoated... do you see any differences in running temperature: powdercoated vs. stock metal

[Terry in Australia]

If anyone would like a picture of the engine cases on my bike and how I did them let me know and we'll start a new thread.

Sign me up Kasper, I wanna see it! Cheers, Terry.

[Quail "Owner of the comfortable k8"]

I would love to see it.

[kghost]

Ok, Here are the pictures.

[kghost]

More pictures

[kghost]

And here's the story on how I powdercoated them......

 First I washed them in the parts washer until they were good and clean. Blow dried with compressed air. Then set them in the sun to dry. Important to start clean and dry if not media sticks everywhere.
Then,I bead blasted them.
  Yeah I know everyones concerned about the media getting in all the little nooks and holes. To avoid most of this I used Aluminum Tape to cover all the holes. This tape is what is commonly used here to put air conditioning ducts together. You can buy it at most hardware stores. It will not stand up to continual media blasting but will work for a quick pass to get the paint and grunge off. Don't point the nozzle directly at it for any long period. Just do the outside of the cases.

If the hole was a through hole I didn't worry about it. If it had a thread it got covered. After the cases were clean I ran them through the parts washer again. I sprayed Carb Cleaner in all the nooks and holes to clear any media or dust. Ran bore brushes through all the holes and passages. Blow dried with compressed air again.

Then I taped them off with fiberglass tape. This is what the powdercoater uses and I got a roll from him. All the mating surfaces were taped and all the little holes. A razor blade and hobby knife really help for this. I then assembled the cases with two bolts and put the side plates on (with one or two bolts). This was just to keep it together until after the powder was sprayed on it.(didn't want inside powdercoated.

Took it all to the powdercoater. Pre heated the cases in the oven at his shop. After it cooled we sprayed them. once the coating was on I very carefully disassembled the cases and side covers. It wasn't too bad because the left side covers weren't getting done (later chromed). Hung the parts back up on the rack. Pushed it in the oven.

Pulled all the tape after it baked and cleaned all the inside and mating surfaces again. Ready to assemble.

Questions?

[Terry in Australia]

That looks magnificent Kasper, I love the bike too, you've done a bit of work I see, oil pressure gauge, oil cooler, electronic ignition, very nice indeed. Tell me, how did you avoid getting powdercoat on the insides of the crankcases? Cheers, Terry.

[kghost]

As mentioned above......

I put the cases together with two bolts. Just enough to keep the together. Then put Alternator, shift mech. cover, Clutch cover, and points cover on.

After powder was applied and before it went into the oven I disassembled it. The Alt. cover, Shifter cover, and points cover I wiped clean of powder. It comes right off if you don't bake it.

Left the cylinder and head bare as I am running the Weisco 836 pistons with th 10.25 comp. and a Web 41a cam. Did this on the advice of a buddy that is the head of the local honda shop. He used to drag race the 750 back in the day. Probably forgot more about them then I'll know.

What to see a picture of the Aluminum Leaf on the fuel tank?

[Terry in Australia]

Beautiful work Kasper, yeah, more pics please, did you remove all your cylinder studs, or just mask around them? I'm still going to opt for the chemical strip because I'm a chicken, I did get my cases blasted on my CB350F resto but I spent days with bore bushes, pipe cleaners, hot soapy water, thinners, compressed air etc and NEVER want to do that again, even though it leaves your cases looking factory new.

I'll assemble my cases as you suggest, but I'll leave the covers on and get them powdercoated black. I'll just mask off the circle on the alternator cover once I've polished it. Thanks for the heads up mate, excellent work! Cheers, Terry.

[kghost]

Nah, just left the studs in. I know what you mean thought I must have like 25 hrs. into the case prep. But, It keeps me out of the Bars.

Tank pics.