Author Topic: Deteriorating spark plug wires  (Read 1277 times)

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Offline rollypoli

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Deteriorating spark plug wires
« on: July 06, 2022, 10:53:03 AM »
So the coils work perfectly fine on my 550k but the wires coming out of them are in bad condition and though it’s working fine I would like to replace the wires. Is that possible on stock style coils or do I just have to buy all new coils. Can you take the casing off the coil? Are they attached with a normal connector? And info would be great. Having to buy dyna coils with the replaceable wire ports would suck when the coils work fine

Offline PeWe

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2022, 11:13:04 AM »
I replaced the wires on my K6 original coils back in the 80's.
I cut the wire about 3-4 cm from the coil and crimped a new wire. I had crimp tools, crimp socket (butt splice connectors) and shrink hose at my job. Wire too, red matching the bike ;)
« Last Edit: July 06, 2022, 12:03:34 PM by PeWe »
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
CB750 K2 -1975  build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
Carb jetting, a long story Mikuni TMR32
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,179479.msg2104967.html#msg2104967

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2022, 11:50:41 AM »
There is info out there about cutting the coil, removing the wires, replacing the wires then epoxing the coils
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline vames

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2022, 12:29:33 PM »
I replaced my coil wires on the old 400F coils years ago and they're still going strong. I think I heard about doing this on this site, but don't remember the post. 

1) Clipped the old wire at the coil housing, then drilled about 1/4" of the remaining wire inside of the coil housing.
2) I made a ~3/4" spike of solid copper wire (from romex).
3) Pushed one end of the spike into the center of the remaining old wire inside the housing, and the other end of the spike into the center of the new wire.
4) Kept Pushing the new wire over the spike and into the into the empty 1/2 inch deep hole that I made in step 1.
5) Put epoxy around the edges to seal it up and hold it together.

 

Offline MauiK3

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2022, 02:09:33 PM »
Are the plug wire ends like the CB750 with resistors that go bad?
1973 CB 750 K3
10/72 build Z1 Kawasaki

Offline TwoTired

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2022, 04:46:36 PM »
The stock coil leads are steel stranded core.  This makes a more durable connection for the screw on plug caps. 

NGK makes ignition lead splicers that allow you to cut the lead near the coil and then splice on whatever lead you chose to go to the spark plug boots.  This works only if the lead insulation at the coil is properly intact.  If it cracks there, then an operation to cut into the coil is required.  Tedious, but doable if you have the prowess.

I can't find steel core ignition leads.  (Well, unless I order 10,000 ft of it.)  The best alternative seems to be copper stranded core.

I don't think the resistance wire normally commonly found in the stores is any good for use with the screw on plug caps used for the SOHC4.  That screw has to bite into the core of the wire, and I would be concerned about long term connectivity.

The modern resistance wire is fine (even required) for high energy ignitions, to quell radiated energy high frequencies.  The SOHC4 doesn't have that.  And only needs the plug cap resistors to make the system work properly.

My 550s all use the stock 10K plug caps.  Not sure you can get those anymore. I think NGK only offers a 5K option these days (or zero ohms).  Pretty sure that 10K at each plug was used to extend the run life for the hotter plug used in the 550.  It will run with less resistance of course, but there is no real need to do so.  The resistance only has any effect when current actually flows, and has no effect on actual spark voltage, which is set by the spark gap and atmosphere in the combustion chamber.

I find there are few people that actually know how the ignition circuit is designed to work.  While very simple, it uses concepts that are not simple.

Cheers,

Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline Stev-o

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2022, 08:13:16 AM »
My 550s all use the stock 10K plug caps.  Not sure you can get those anymore. I think NGK only offers a 5K option these days (or zero ohms).

Appears like they are still available...

https://www.ngk.com/ngk-8349-lb10e-spark-plug-cap

rollypoli - it may be easier to just find another set of coils with good leads.

Forum member Bobco has these...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/155026406568?fits=Year%3A1974%7CModel%3ACB550&hash=item24184b3ca8:g:ny0AAOSwgHhinh-n
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline bryanj

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2022, 09:16:07 AM »
If you go to the UK forum and look in Alladins cave a member has an excellant write up on how to repair Honda coils, please dont ask for a link i cant do those!
Semi Geriatric ex-Honda mechanic and MOT tester (UK version of annual inspection). Garage full of "projects" mostly 500/4 from pre 73 (no road tax in UK).

Remember "Its always in the last place you look" COURSE IT IS YOU STOP LOOKIN THEN!

Offline TwoTired

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2022, 01:47:55 PM »
My 550s all use the stock 10K plug caps.  Not sure you can get those anymore. I think NGK only offers a 5K option these days (or zero ohms).

Appears like they are still available...

https://www.ngk.com/ngk-8349-lb10e-spark-plug-cap


I don't believe the right angle plug caps will fit the CB550 engine.


Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Online Don R

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2022, 02:58:22 PM »
 I believe hondaman said he has had some luck with these. Scroll down to the stock replacements.
https://www.vintagecb750.com/products/5/electrical/36/ignition-systems-ignition-switch-coils-plugs-contact-points
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Offline Stev-o

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #10 on: July 07, 2022, 03:53:18 PM »
My 550s all use the stock 10K plug caps.  Not sure you can get those anymore. I think NGK only offers a 5K option these days (or zero ohms).

Appears like they are still available...

https://www.ngk.com/ngk-8349-lb10e-spark-plug-cap


I don't believe the right angle plug caps will fit the CB550 engine.




My 550F has the right angle caps on cyl # 1&4 but straights on 2& 3, so not sure?
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline dave500

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2022, 11:19:27 PM »
depending on your leads length,i have near 90 degree caps on all four,these are ngk XDO5F caps,i have different coils with removable leads on this bike,ive done the cut/and solder new leads on stock coils before and it turns out fine,give yourself a little more length lead.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2022, 11:21:07 PM by dave500 »

Offline Little_Phil

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2022, 01:21:27 AM »
I've replaced the leads on coils for a couple of bikes. The bumps in the potting pretty much tell you where the joints are. Remove material carefully and solder new lead to pin. One lead goes a long way into the potting and you don't need to remove it all the way. Once you unsolder it will pull out through the hole as they are loose with age. The fine wire on the coil secondary obviously joins at the same place and take care not to damage. You need suitable material to repot.

Offline RAFster122s

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2022, 01:55:23 AM »
Epoxy putty is usually what folks use when repotting the new lead you soldered in...
David- back in the desert SW!

Offline PeWe

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #14 on: July 10, 2022, 04:20:20 AM »
I replaced the wires on my K6 original coils back in the 80's.
I cut the wire about 3-4 cm from the coil and crimped a new wire. I had crimp tools, crimp socket (butt splice connectors) and shrink hose at my job. Wire too, red matching the bike ;)
This how my old coils look like.
I changed wire mostly for the color and everything needed free of charge. Wire close to coils not bad.
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
CB750 K2 -1975  build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
Carb jetting, a long story Mikuni TMR32
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,179479.msg2104967.html#msg2104967

Offline Stev-o

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Re: Deteriorating spark plug wires
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2022, 08:22:12 AM »
depending on your leads length,i have near 90 degree caps on all four,these are ngk XDO5F caps,i have different coils with removable leads on this bike,ive done the cut/and solder new leads on stock coils before and it turns out fine,give yourself a little more length lead.

Good info, Dave. Thanks
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........