Author Topic: Will's '77 CB550F build  (Read 5007 times)

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Offline Will

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Will's '77 CB550F build
« on: April 21, 2009, 12:08:41 PM »
Ok, Here it is I bought this '77 CB550 for  five hundo from a neighbor last year.
The previous owner had attempted some carb work and had intended to rebuild before he lost interest and severed ties. This left me with a barely running, backfiring, smoke-breathing, oil spilling, leaky carbed mess of a bike. And a box of gaskets that were never used. So, a year later, I have kicked off on the adventure that is bike building. I want a bike that runs well, looks good, and has some classic appeal. This is my first project so I am setting the bar high, but will take the time to do it right.
I haven't made any final decisions on style yet, but the way I see it the bike's style will be developed from the decisions I make along the way. I know that I am not going for the "OEM" original parts restore, and I am not going for a chopper, or bobber. My vision is to maintain some of the original character of the CB550F, while adding some cafe style highlights, and general improvements to obsolete and failed parts.
The laundry list is as follows:
- Strip down degrease and clean all parts. This bike hasn't had a bath since 1977.
- Remove obsolete parts.
- Frame work.
- Tank and Seat work.
- Replace parts.
- Paint, polish, powder coat.
- Reassemble.

Targets for Improvements:
-Electrical System -all new headlight, LED lights, Harness, Switches, Ignition, Gauges, mounting/routing, battery location.
-Carb Work, remove airbox, install pods, thorough cleaning, replace worn parts, possibly re-jet, tune.
-Engine - haven't made any decisions yet. I'll take a look at the condition first and make the call to replace/repair parts as I see them.
-Brakes - new master cylinder and brake line/switch, We'll see about the front caliper. rear needs cleaning.
-Wheels - maybe new wheel sets depending on the hub wear. At the very least new spokes, bearings and polished rims.
-Suspension - Staying stock for now. we'll see if i can polish out some of the rust on the rear springs. if not, new rears might be in order.
-Tank - acid wash, coat, strip, re-paint. new fuel lines/filter. keeping stock tank, but I am missing the locking cover for the top.
-Frame - remove all unneeded tabs and mounts. Add rear bracket, plate mount, tail light mount. New battery and electrical system mount. New Seat mounts. Powder Coat.
-Swing arm - New bearings, powder coat.
-Steering - new bars, drag, clubman, clips, or maybe just the stock bars. ( kinda like the riding position with stock bars). new tapered bearings on the tree.
-Seat - build custom leather seat.

Ok, Thats the list for now. watch it grow.  :-\

« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 11:52:53 AM by Will »

Offline Will

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2009, 12:49:44 PM »
Some pics mid teardown:

notice the leaky bowl on #1 carb.


Say goodbye to the mustard stallion!


The good thing about it never getting a bath, is that now I know where all of the leaks are!




The dirty ass-end.


I removed the cover here, and about a cup of oil came spilling out from under the oil pump. Maybe a new O-ring will do the trick?


The previous owner had plugged the leak with some sort of silicon caulking. I'm pretty sure that is not the recommended technique, please tell me if I'm wrong. Also found some silicon caulk around the kick spindle as well, hopefully this is not symptomatic of an underlying problem. my guess is that someone went wild with a caulk gun trying to fix a leaky oil pump o-ring.



Thats it for now. I'll get out to the shop tonight to finish the teardown and grind some frame!
 ;D
later,
-will

Offline martino1972

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2009, 01:03:18 PM »
welcome to the forum.......your kissing our behinds already good with lot's of pictures..!!!!  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
will be following this closely,looks interesting.....
Marti, I want you to know, I like you an awful lot, but guys have said far less and left wearing their drinks on their shirts.
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=36933.0  (my bobber)

Offline MMICAFE

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2009, 10:20:37 PM »
you might want to inspect the oil pump and make sure there are no scoring marks on the o0ring surface if not start looking to make sure no silicone got into any oil passage if that happened it gonna be a pain getting silicone out of the oil holes
1974 Honda CB450 super sport (sold sniff sniff) (my first bike)

1979 Honda CB650 (we have a love hate relationship)

2008 Honda metropolitan (sold kinda miss it for the gas mileage)

Offline Will

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2009, 09:28:52 AM »
Thanks for the tip on the O-ring. I'll keep that in mind. To be honest I am a little scared of what I might find inside that motor. With any luck it won't be too bad.
Ok, so I spent a few more hours out in the shop last night. I finished the tear down, and sorted some parts. I chopped most of the electrical, airbox, and seat mounts from the frame. I did some grinding on the frame to smooth out the old welds.
I also started to mock up the rear bracket from some scrap steel that was sitting around. I don't have any bending or rolling tools at this shop yet, but we are moving most of our metalwork tools down here in a few weeks. The shop I am working in was a casting foundry for large statuary, we bought it and moved a bunch of crap into it as a where house. Our plans are to have a full metal shop in there by next month. Most of the big tools are about 20 miles north for now. That being said, I had to hand bend this rear bracket using a vice and a metal pillar. So the radius isn't exactly how I want it, just an idea.
So without further blab, here are the pics from last night:


Parts bin! most are for e-bay, but I'll keep them around till I'm done in case i change my mind.


fuzzy closeup of the silicon goo surrounding the bottom edge of the oil pump.


same nasty stuff surrounding the shifter spindle. Anyone seen this before?


Ok, so while taking off the exhaust manifold, some joints came off easier than others. A few of the 6mm studs were outright stripped, no thread left. One had a completely botched helicoil on the cylinder head... bummer. I'm thinking the best solution here is to find some 8mmx40mm studs,  retap the header and start all over. Anyone delt with that before?


keeper parts.


motor on dolly.


everything that is coming off this bike is this dirty. I've got some cleaning to do.


missing the locking cap cover on the tank. Anyone want to sell a spare? I may have to make one. cmsnl want 80 f-ing euro!!! that's like a million bucks.


drum looks ok to me... I'll clean it up and see.


these will need some serious cleaning... but I doubt they will ever shine again. the money pit gets deeper...  :-\


rusty swing arm in need of a blast, pc, and some new bearings.


I'll be replacing with tapers.


Not a bad Tree, it's going to get blasted and coated though.


Say goodbye to these nasty coils! electronic ignition and new coils are some of the improvements that i am most excited about right now.

Tail section:

I hacked off all of the tabs in what used to be the electric mount, airbox, and battery mount. Fender and seat mounts were cut off as well. Ground the welds smooth too.


Got my workout in bending this sucker cold by hand. I'm not sure about the shape yet. I might just go with a continuous radius instead of the double bend. I do kinda like the tail to be flat though. I'll have to take a look at some LED taillight kits and base the decision on the shape of the light.


Zipped it to the frame to check it out.


Cleaned up and called it a night.
Next I'll be doing a crap load of cleaning, parts ordering, engine work, carbs, and frame work. It is going to be a big build for me, but I just got a rediculous tax return so I think I'll pay for it with that!   ;D
I'm headed out to the Utah desert for a week of cayoneering, rock climbing, mountain biking, and debaucherous shenanigans with a bunch of college friends. So next update will be in May.  Take care everyone, and of course I welcome any and all advice or comments on my project!  have a great week.
~ will

Offline luder

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2009, 10:27:41 AM »
Have a great weekend. I will be watching your build...later luder

Offline Will

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build - parts are coming in!
« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2009, 01:01:43 PM »
Ok, It has been about a month since I started this project, and I have been waiting patiently on parts from all over the place. Most of the stuff has come in, but I am still waiting on all of the small parts for engine and carb work. I placed an order with honda parts direct, and they have taken over a month to get the parts to me. I have called them a million times but they have given me the run around every time. Last time I called, I was promised a call back in 5 min.... it has been a week. They have charged my credit card so i am about a week away from calling my credit card company to file a complaint. Anyway, as you can tell, i am royally pissed at those a-holes, and my project has been set back a bit.
But I have gotten some cool stuff in, and I almost have a complete electrical system ready to wire up. I have finished the tail end, electrical mounts, and battery mount. Seat pan is about half done, but I will most likely finish the whole seat on sunday.
I have been de-greasing like crazy, cleaning and setting aside parts for paint, powder, and polish...
This is all taking way longer that I had thought, mostly because the parts are taking forever to get. but also because i have taken a bunch of time off to travel, and I am in the final stages of getting my private pilot certification. Now that summer is here though, I have added motivation to get the ball rolling.

Anyway, here are some pics of recent progress:

Electrical mount:

electrical mount taped in place for mock up.






battery mount:





seat pan:





This weekend I should get around to finishing the seat pan, sculpting the foam, and maybe I will get the leather on, but I'm not convinced on the leather I got. I bought a hand tanned sheepskin from upstate new york, I has a great look, but it is really thin, so I may back it with a waterproof backing of some sort. I don't know a ton about leather working, but I'm sure it'll work out somehow.
Also on the list for this week: Strip the paint off the tank, give it an electrolysis bath,  paint it, then kream it. If i get my carb parts in, i will rebuld them, and if I get the parts in for my oil pump and clutch, i will rebuild those... other than that it is still clean, clean, clean, getting ready to send everything off to the powder coater soon.
Anyway, have a great memorial day everyone, and I'll get back with an update later next week.

Offline Will

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build - starting engine clean up, More parts in!
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2009, 12:52:25 PM »
SO, I finally got those parts from Hondapartsdirect.com The invoice was printed on april 22 and they arrived at my door on june 1. I looked at the paking slip, and it looks like the box was packed in early may! it was kicking around their shipping department for almost a month, while I was calling once a week. Some service! Those guys are really nice, but I get the feeling that they have been very disorganized recently.

Anyway. I have tons of parts sitting on the table. I'll have to take a pic, I can't wait to start putting it all back together. But first I have some more work to do! the last few days I have accomplished the following:

- I finished the seat pan, it is ready for powder coating.
- I drilled the lighting mounts on the tail. ( tail light, rear signals, plate lights)
- I spent like 2 hours trying to get the valve head off of the cylinders, and the cylinders off of the crankcase.
- I realized exactly how much carbon builds up on valves and pistons over 30 years of running WAY too rich. (PO did some tuning, lets just say he got it wrong.... and left it there)
- 3 days of soaking valves and pistons in chemdip.
- Found out that you need 3 arms to remove valve springs in a drill press. (still looking for that retainer, last spotted at an altitude of 10 feet going southbound at 20 knots)

Everything is looking "ok." meaning that I haven't found anything that is a total show stopper. But some things are a little less than optimal inside the motor. since I don't have much experience with these motors I will need some advice on cam wear, rocker wear, and what the acceptable tolerances are. I have a manual, but it just says to measure the parts to acceptable tolerance. where do I find those numbers?
Do these look excessively worn to you:



sorry about the blurryness, I will try to get a better pic tonight.

other images from the last week:

not even kidding... all four pistons looked like this, or worse! noting a little chemdip can't solve though

This is for everyone that asks about how to get carbon off of pistons; chem-dip and a gloved finger!

all better!

Intake valves were awful!, I soaked them for 24 hours, spun them in the drillpress with a wire brush, coated them in lapping compound, ground them with the compound, wiped them off and.... now they are back in the chem-dip for another 24hours! they are way worse than I thought, but i'll get em clean.

valves out.

oh, shes dirty.

surprizingly the cylinders were not too worn, I am going to put off the overbore for a few years if i can... we'll see, maybe i will give in and bore it out.

covers are off, I am currently weighing my options. either:
1) polish the crap out of them myself, for free.
2) send them off to browns to be chromed out! for lots of dollars.
I am leaning toward polishing the covers myself. just because of the money it will take to get everything chromed. but chrome would look tight! we'll see.

Thats what the lights are going to look like. I got some LED turn signals, LED tail light, and led plate lights from custom dynamics. (by the way they are a great company to deal with!)


testing the lights in place. looks good to me!

ok, thats it for this update. I got in a ton of parts today, but I can't really touch them till I reassemble. all in due time. For now, it is more cleaning, polishing painting and replacing parts. getting ready to send stuff out for powder coating.

Here is a question for the few that read this post:
what are the pros and cons of Powder coating cylinders and crankcase?
I am going to split the cases anyway, because I have some inspection and seal replacement to do... so should I spent the few hundred it costs to powder coat these parts? or should I just roll with some duplicolor hitemp engine enamel?  (I want the crankcase and cylinders black). It is a big difference in money, is it worth it?

later...

Offline Treeguy

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2009, 04:30:26 PM »
I have had really good luck with David SIlver Spares (In Britain yes) but they have never left me hanging and prices are sometimes cheaper than State's side. Pics are very nice !

Offline Will

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build - LOTS OF CLEANING... more parts
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2009, 02:07:00 PM »
Well, It has been a long few weeks! I have been busy at work, out late at some good summer concerts, and going through gallons of various cleaners trying to get this engine clean!
I got the cam cover, head, and barrels cleaned up pretty good. I split the cases and surprisingly found nothing out of the ordinary. Lots of bad seals, gaskets, an a thin clutch. The oil stainer was filthy!!! All of that silicon that the PO had used to try to plug up a bad shifter spindle oil seal had gotten all up in the crankcase. So Time to clean the cases meticulously! all of the oil passages needed to be checked. I will be replacing all of the major bearings and seals that I can within reason. Here are some pics of the cleanup:
Top end after cleaning:
I guess I didn't take any photos when i was cleaning the top end... oops. still a lot of work to be done there though.


Silicone problem:




Bad Gaskets and seals:
this one was in peices... totally shot.



Crankcase Cleaning:
This took a while


The next day I decided to strip the tank, and see what condition it was in. 4 hours and I got this:

Another hour of sanding and finishing I got this:


A little bit of black detailing, and a crap load of clear coat, and we'll call it a day there. Not too shabby.

Things to come:
 - I just got a 605 kit! when it arrives I'll call up a buddy to bore those juggs.
 - I also am working on getting my hands on a NOS 79 cb650 cam
 - Swingarm is off in the mail to Hondaman for some TLC.
 - I'll bust the dremmel out in a few weeks to find some added flow on the intake side
(see: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=17374.msg%25msg_id%25)
 - Polish, Polish, and paint!
 
Thats it for now.
I am off on a surfing trip for 10 days. I'll have some updates when I am back.
later.

Offline Caferacernoc

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2009, 10:10:36 AM »
Neat job on the back end and seat!

Offline noahspop

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2009, 02:38:30 PM »
i like the natural look of the tank.
i look forward to the end result.

Offline my78k

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2009, 03:07:55 PM »
Cool build so far...not sure how I missed it before...

Dennis

Offline Will

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build -- it's been too long!!!!
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2009, 12:23:26 PM »
UPDATE!
I haven't posted anything recently because I have been away surfing, fishing, and being lazy...


But that is not to say that progress has not been taking place! Several things are going on with the build right now. Most importantly, i have a local guy that is going to do my overbore, up to 61mm for the 605cc kit that i scored. I finally got my 650 cam from Australia, it is brand new NOS! Also, Mark AKA Hondaman has been giving my swing arm some well needed TLC. He is doing a complete overhaul, including reverting the swing arm bolt to a 2 zerk model.
Ahead I will be doing a little grinding in the intake ports, for added flow.
I have a HID conversion kit on order, and when i get it I will figure out how to fit the ballast to the electrical mount that i created. That will be the final link in the electrical system, which means two things; I can finish the mount, and I can start to sandblast and powder coat the frame, seat pan, mounting plate, and swing arm.

I will have some pictures of all of this up soon, until then, enjoy a nice sunset:

Offline Will

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Re: Will's '77 CB550F build
« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2016, 11:54:10 AM »
Updating this build thread with the pictures from after I finished the build. I know it has been many years since I completed this build, but I never got a chance to post the end result.
The full album of build pics is here: https://maxwellw.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/1977-CB550F-build/
The bike now looks like this: