Author Topic: 1975 Honda CB400 Four Project - Rookie (Read 318484 times)

strynboen · « **Reply #300 on:** February 23, 2011, 06:52:00 AM »

hey think the collekter is a littel different..orginal have 2 pipes veldet and the other with squeeze band..dont now the word..my home made have all lose..give it some exhost gum to tight

Free Booter · « **Reply #301 on:** February 23, 2011, 07:18:56 AM »

So here I was trying to remove a float bowl screw that had stuck. I broke the head off of it trying to remove it, so I tried an easy out extracting drill bit. This time I followed the instructions more carefully and used a spanner. No matter, just like last time, it broke. So now I'm going to need a new float bowl as there's no way I'm getting both the stuck screw and the broken extracting drill bit out.

Get yourself a pair of Hemostats (google it) you can either buy something more "mechanics" oriented like these from sears:

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00987674000P?sid=IDx20070921x00003a&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=00987674000P
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00987673000P?sid=IDx20070921x00003a&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=00987673000P

Or more "Medical" oriented like these:

http://www.indigo.com/images/product/28.jpg

Personally, I prefer the latter. My girlfriend used to bring them home from work all the time when she was a nurse.

They are incredibly strong and great for tight spots. I've used them in building cars computers and motorcycles and come in a variety of shapes and sizes.

I would use a straight one and "wrench" that puppy out from the inside. hopefully you can get it to budge/twist.

As for the heat idea...you could try that too before you start. I wouldn't go hitting it with a torch, but maybe a blow dryer or a heat gun till the bowl is hot.

rickyracer · « **Reply #302 on:** February 23, 2011, 08:48:56 AM »

Hey Rick i think i would make the Dealer do some leg work on this deal, by telling him he has been paid by me and may have sold a stolen bike, that would not look good for a Dealer im sure! let him know you want him to help you get this straighten out. Can you check what requirements are needed downunder for a custom frame builder and maybe just tell them its a custom built frame and in need of a new serial#? good luck either way and hang in there.

RickB · « **Reply #303 on:** February 23, 2011, 08:34:39 PM »

@ Free Booter: Thanks for the tips. I gave the bowl to my girlfriends dad a while ago. He's an engineer and set one of his guys onto it. So we'll see how that goes. I've replaced it with a used bowl I got from 400fourbits anyway.

@ rickyracer: I went through all the registration/serial number problems over a year ago. I'm about to come around back on them when I go to get this registered. So we'll see what happens.

Ok so today I was working on some little bits and pieces I rebuilt the petcock for my CB350F tank. As I've said earlier, it appears that this is the only Honda petcock that works with CB350F tank. The CB350 twin one doesn't.

I picked up a pretty beat up CB350F petcock on eBay for $15. As you can see it's in terrible condition. The seller thought it was missing some nipples, but I think the holes he thought they were from are actually just disused moldings. The similar looking models of petcocks (the CB350 twin for example) have the fuel lines coming out the other side in a pair of nipples. The CB350F just has the single.

The reserve tube is cracked straight through, the bowl and internals were full of a greyish sludge that may have been a dissolved o-ring and filter screen. I took it off to the hydroblasters, soaked it overnight in kerosene and put it back together with the excellent rebuild kit provided by the eBay user dgs38. The kit contains instructions, q-tips for cleaning, cut down bamboo sticks, fuel filter screen, new screws, washers and o-rings. All neatly packaged. Totally worth the $25.

After the hydroblaster. Good as new.

The bowl on mine had been over tightened. There is about 3 rows of thread left. Consequently the 14mm o-ring that came with the rebuild kit was too bulky. A quick trip to the o-ring store down the street and I had a slimmer o-ring.

I probably should have the RES-ON-STOP plate electro plated, but for now I'm installing it as is.

As for the cracked reserve tube. I searched everywhere for a 5mm brass tube. The smallest any of the plumbing stores had was 6mm. I was about to hunt down some refrigeration suppliers when a helpful auto store employee told me his sons hobby shop had loads of small diameter tubing. A quick drive to the hobby shop and I had three lengths of 5mm brass tubing (and a model rocket!).

Rick.

fastbroshi · « **Reply #304 on:** February 23, 2011, 10:43:07 PM »

Rick, the results your guy is getting blasting your parts is pretty nice. I wonder how much pressure he's running and how he holds all the pieces he is blasting?

FunJimmy · « **Reply #305 on:** February 24, 2011, 12:13:19 AM »

Fantastic results from the hydroblasting.
Those carbs look mint.

Nice thread.
FJ

RickB · « **Reply #306 on:** February 24, 2011, 06:08:13 AM »

@ fastbroshi and FunJimmy: I'm not even exactly sure what hydroblasting is. I asked the guy to tell me what it was and he said the process was originally designed by Rolls Royce to clean propeller blades on aircraft engines. It's water and plastic media I believe that doesn't damage the metal, it just cleans it in such a way that it can be considered 'from the mold'.

However I haven't been able to do really small pieces like the screws on the RES-ON-STOP plate for the fuel petcock as I was told they'd 'fall through the basket' so perhaps it's a process that doesn't involve manually doing it. It's dirt cheap for the result really.

So I quickly rebuilt the alternator tonight. Well rebuilt is not really the right word. It's 6 screws. The alternator cover on the engine that can with the bike was cracked from an impact and then very crudely repaired with some sort of putty. So when I had the casings hydroblasted I was sure to have a replacement housing I sourced from Steve at 400fourbits.co.uk done as well.

It's hard to see the putty but you can see the damage quite clearly.

Replacement housing. This is like all my other parts, hydroblasted with no paint. I have a NOS Honda name plate to go on this too. Shiny parts!

All back together. I could probably replace the terminal rubber protectors as they've gone rock hard but they're doing their job still so I can wait. I am missing the rubber grommet that protects the cables. I will remember to get one of those next time I put in a 400fourbits.co.uk order.

Rick.

strynboen · « **Reply #307 on:** February 24, 2011, 06:53:40 AM »

have just made this on my 550..it takes abaut 5 auers to shift all cabels.and some flex matriales and kabels

that you got looks like new,

PHeller · « **Reply #308 on:** February 24, 2011, 08:20:47 AM »

Where did you get the push button style latch?

britz73 · « **Reply #309 on:** February 24, 2011, 12:38:42 PM »

Rick,
I don't know if this is any help but............I have an old 400f frame (Bent and cut) outside that I have as spare parts (With serial number). It's yours mate if you want it. I live in Newcastle and will be coming to Sydney in the next couple of weeks to drop Mrs off at the Airport (Then D**s for a coffee and browse). If you need engine parts I may be able to help? Mark.

RickB · « **Reply #310 on:** February 24, 2011, 08:23:49 PM »

@ PHeller: I got it on eBay from a guy in Utah I believe. I bought a lot of various bolts and nuts from a CB400F from him and I asked him if by chance he had a push button gas cap latch. He did and I got it for $20. Stupidly, I didn't think to check my long ago dissembled tank. I already had a push button style latch. No matter, now both my tanks will look nice.

@ britz73: Thank so much for the offer Mark. I will think about it for sure. I think I'm right at the moment, but when I go to register the bike I might have some problems and then all of a sudden a junk frame with a valid serial number might make sense.

RickB · « **Reply #311 on:** February 26, 2011, 12:56:42 AM »

It's alive!

My mechanic Matt and I started the engine today! With a few kicks of the kick start, it started right up. No splutters, no misfires, just purred into life. Some fuel was leaking out of one of the carbie connectors (about the only o-rings I didn't replace!) but with some movement they settled into place. Matt ran it for a couple of minutes, reving the motor up and down, listening for any irregularities. So far, so good.

Matt is making up a bend for my aftermarket muffler so I haven't got the bike in my garage just yet, but a major milestone happened today. I didn't take any video because I was holding the fuel tank (plus I want it finished before I 'present it' to the SOHC4 community). As for what oil I put in it, I had some advice from Mick from Classic Motorcycle Fiberglass who was a Honda mechanic for 30 odd years. He said "don't put a good oil in 1st up. Penrite do a "running in oil". Most modern bike oils are too good, you need a cheapy multigrade to bed everything in, otherwise it will just glaze up the bores (assuming new rings??). Do 100 odd k's, drop oil, refill, do another 2-300k's then new filter and good oil. Summer 20/50, winter drop to 15/40. Penrites are ok, I use their +10 semi synthetics in my race Hondas.

So that's exactly what I did. I have Penrites Running In Oil in it at the moment.

Got the Dyna S ignition connected up. Of course my CB400F had a 15mm advance shaft, not the 13.5mm adapter shaft that comes with the Dyna S kit. So I had to have the adapter plug milled out to 15mm buy a shop last second. Of course they butchered it and I've ordered a new one from Dyna in the US. As you can see above, I need to shorten my spark plug leads.

The left side MC Again rearset. It took some guess-work to get fitted correctly as the instructions are in Japanese. It still needs some adjustment but I was excited with I found out I can still use my kick started (as the electric switch doesn't yet work).

Both the pegs flip up. Brilliant. However on this side Matt had to file down a tiny bit of the mounting bracket as it hit the engine casing. Nothing major though.

Although on the other side rearset he had to do some more serious filing. It seems the stud that keeps the original footpegs from spinning was welded a few mm from where the MC Again rearsets expected it to be. When I spoke to Kevin at TTR400 about this, he said "There have been a few bikes that ended up having the locating pin in a different spot than the majority of them. Just grind it off.The CB350F frame has the locating pin in a different location as well, so all of them have to be ground down to mount the rearsets.I wonder if someone at the factory used the CB350F jig on a days worth of CB400F frames?".

Rather than grind the whole stud off, we just filed the rearset mounting bracket lightly and a bit of the stud. Went on easy after a couple minutes, no biggy. Still, between these oddly located studs, the oddly sized advance shaft and every other seemingly straight forward job with this bike, I find myself saying "why can't something be easy for a change!"

More updates soon.

Rick.

RickB · « **Reply #312 on:** February 26, 2011, 10:53:42 PM »

Ok so when starting the motor for the first time, I also filled the petrol tank for the first time. Stupidly, I didn't think to put petrol in it before I had it painted. Well, it has a leak. It's two tiny holes below the rear mounting bracket that sits on that rubber pad.

As you can see, they're not huge or structurally compromising in anyway. Can anyone suggest a way to best repair this? Obviously I can line the tank with POR 15, but the inside is rust free so it seems a bit extreme. I could have someone weld it perhaps, but does paint complicate this? I could fill it with some sort of fuel resistant epoxy? I've heard soldering can work but again, does paint affect this? It's not exactly in the easiest to get to of places what with that bracket.

Any suggestions?

Rick.

malcolmgb · « **Reply #313 on:** February 27, 2011, 04:12:54 AM »

In that position it would be pretty much hidden, I would try a repair and then brush paint over. I know a friend used a matting/epoxy repair kit which he said worked for him, I will ask him for the kit name, similar should be available in Australia.

RickB · « **Reply #314 on:** February 27, 2011, 04:22:55 AM »

Malcolm,

Yeah I don't care so much about the paint on the bottom. I'm just scared to use the POR 15 in case I spill it. If I used an epoxy or even a solder, I would assume I should strip the paint around the hole. That's going to be tricky given the location under that bracket.

If you find the name of the kit that would be great, thanks.

Rick.

malcolmgb · « **Reply #315 on:** February 27, 2011, 04:30:05 AM »

I'm sure he used it over the top of old paint in a seam, yours is new paint, with the matting providing some support for the epoxy. Waiting for him to get back to me with details.

Anti-Johnny · « **Reply #316 on:** February 27, 2011, 08:54:16 AM »

I would use a dremel with a stone attachment to chip a small section of paint away. Then use the gas tank repair epoxy from Autozone. Here its a black putty that's kneaded and pushed into cracks or holes. I've used it before and it worked well. Ymmv.

malcolmgb · « **Reply #317 on:** February 27, 2011, 10:49:39 AM »

He used Petro Patch http://www.granville-oilchem.co.uk/product_info.php?prod_id=1&product=Petro+Patch&x=19&y=13 I see they also do a putty type too.

RickB · « **Reply #318 on:** February 27, 2011, 08:22:26 PM »

Thanks for all the advice guys here and over in the SOHC/4 Bikes section.

I had a good look at the tank in the sunlight today. From what I can see (which I supposed is the big "if") it appears to just be the two small holes in the weld that holds the bracket on. I tapped around it and it all appears solid. I suspect the weld along that edge could be bad, but with the paint on and the condition of the rest of the tank, it looks great.

Given the the holes are right under the rear mounting bracket, it'll require some cutting to get to if I wanted to weld or drill it out, so I think the Permatex stuff will allow me to push it in and under with a putty knife.

I think I'd gonna' try the Permatex stuff. It'll be a pea sized amount and will take no time to do. If it leaks, then I'll have to do it properly.

As they say, the poor man pays twice. I suspect this is going to be an ongoing saga.

Rick.

leogriss · « **Reply #319 on:** February 28, 2011, 05:31:22 PM »

I gotta say that I love how your bike is turning into, Rick.

However, it's pretty sad to hear that MC-again rearset doesn't perfectly fit on a cb350f frame.
I know you said it's not a big deal to work with MC-again, but I don't want to scratch my powdercoated frame

Do you have any experience with Raask rearset?

Love your bike. Please keep up the good works!

RickB · « **Reply #320 on:** February 28, 2011, 08:43:10 PM »

leogriss,

You don't have to scratch the frame at all. I just did that because it was easier. You could just spend more time working on the rearset holes with a rat-tail file.

I must say, my CB400F is a strange beast. Everything that can go wrong does go wrong. I'm convinced it is a super early frame because whenever a part has a disclaimer 'a handfull of early CB400Fs had this different' it's always my bike.

Chances are you'd have no problem slipping them on.

Comparing the MC Again rearsets to the Raask ones is chalk and cheese. One's almost $700, the other $300. They're completely different in terms of quality and workmanship.

There's another forum member here who found that CB360 (I think, don't trust that) rearsets worked on the CB400F. Either try them or the TTR400 billet set. In the end, I went with MC Again for the superb quality and the ability to still use my kick start.

Rick.

RickB · « **Reply #321 on:** March 07, 2011, 02:57:24 AM »

A lack of updates because things have been happening!

Picked up the bike from the mechanic. Despite the length of time, I couldn't be happier with the work Matt has done. I've become friends with the guy too. But before I go into all that, the tank.

I tried getting JB Weld but true to form both my local Repco and AutoPro didn't have it. Those cure-all auto stores never have anything I'm looking for. I don't even know why I bother going to them. They did have the above stuff, which given the scope of the job, I figured was good enough.

The tools.

Using the pin, I was able to scrap of surrounding paint.

I plugged the hole by pushing the putty in with the bamboo skewer and paper clip. It looks a bit rough above, but I cleaned it up a bit after this. Considering it's under the tank behind the bracket, I'm not too fussy. I will be putting fuel in it tomorrow so will report back with a sucess I hope.

Matt The Mechanic welded on the exhaust. It wasn't a straight forward job as it required a slip on collar and some modifications to the stock header but I'm so happy with it. He even made up a fantastic mounting bracket for it. I have to take that off and paint it as well as fit the header clamps I took off for cleaning. Matt has instructed me to give the join some heat resistant silicone too, just to be sure. Not bad for a $59 Norton Commando replica from eBay. It sounds like a Ferrari at peak revs too. A real unique sound. Not throaty or 'rude', but performance. I like it.

I laid out all the extra spare parts I have been collecting for the past two years. They're all going on tomorrow I hope.

I need to shorten the spark plug leads now that they're all fitted.

Getting the air box in wasn't easy at all. In the end, this was as snug as I could get the airbox on. You'll notice the carb closest to the camera is on all the way, the middle two are set back a bit and the far one is the same as the nearest one. I think it'll do.

A note to anyone doing this. Route all your rubber tubes (there has to be a hundred of them on a CB400F!) before you put on your carbs and airbox!

Now the only problem left in the electronics. It blew a fuse and fried the small fuse type silicone rectifier missing in the of the center of the above photos and shown below.

You can see where it blew. Now the weird thing is that without this, everything works. Although it doesn't charge the battery but I'm not sure that's related to this). If I plug this back in, it blows a fuse straight away. I think it has something to do with the neutral indicator light being active instead of grounded. But I'm not an auto electrician. I would love to know what the above thing is supposed to do and why it may have blown up and if it has anything to do with the battery not charging.

Rick.

Retro Rocket · « **Reply #322 on:** March 07, 2011, 03:57:33 AM »

I would empty that tank, clean it and have it welded, i wouldn't waste my time with crappy half arsed fillers when it comes to fuel. Its in an easy spot to weld as well, once done it won't leak there ever again..

RickB · « **Reply #323 on:** March 07, 2011, 04:19:30 AM »

That probably is the wise thing to do yes. Trouble is I don't know any welders and every shop I've had do things for me has taken a month to do anything. I want to ride this thing! If it leaks when I fill it up, I'll do the right thing. Hopefully she'll be right for the short term.

Retro Rocket · « **Reply #324 on:** March 07, 2011, 04:50:30 AM »

Quote

Trouble is I don't know any welders

What about your mate "Matt the mechanic", his welding on the pipes looks great. Talk to a radiator shop about the process....

Mick

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Author Topic: 1975 Honda CB400 Four Project - Rookie (Read 318484 times)