Topic: Deep sump Oil pans for CB 750

[lordmoonpie]

Not a hope - it's peeing down here 

Mind you - when the sun does come out I think I might rattle Sam's windows a little 

[fishhead]

   A deep sump oil pan on a dry sump motor just doesnt make sense to me.

 Reguardless of if it make sence to me or not, I ended up picking a "deep sump" oil pan for the 750, just out of curiosity and just because. Here are 2 pics of it.
 It has fins on the inside and out.

[voxonda]

If ever someone comes across one, please remember me I would dearly love to have one.

Thanks, Rob

[fishhead]

Heres a side by side pic of the deep sump and the stock oil pan. The deep sump is alot deeper in the front area and where the oil pump is located at, it is about 2mm deeper and wont need an oil pump extender. The inner fins in the pan probably keep the oil from sloshing around and the added finning on the outside may cool the oil down a bit.

 It wouldnt fit my bike as the 4 header pipes of my Dunstall exhaust goes under the bike and the added height of the fins and pan would have it hitting my exhaust (that'll never do!!), but should work fine with a stock exhaust or most 4-1 exhaust.




   

[lordmoonpie]

Looks exactly the same as mine Fishhead. What I've found with mine is that more oil is staying in the sump obviously than standard when the motor stops so there is much less in the oil tank when the engine is off. Not sure that is anything to be concerned about or not - it seems to pump around quite nicely and is not as "foamy" as I'd expected it to be...oh and I'm running a cooler as well as the deep sump.

My inner pipes had to be routed lower to clear the pump - about a 2" extensionin the headers but it looks good all bolted up now.

[voxonda]

Hey LMP,

Happy to say that I got to a deal with fishhead and got my self a nice deep sump oil pan. Think it fits right into the engine I am building. Just one of the things I just wanted to have. Think it will do no harm, but the oil will benefit (slightly), and it is way cool! 

[754]

Bumping up, due to recent interest..

[BLUE71TURBO]

 I definitly need ( WANT )  a deep sump oil pan.  If anyone has one for sale please let me know !!   

[City Boy]

Hi gang.A bit of a hijack.For a small but real increase in oil capacity,if exhaust type allows,install a filter housing,bolt,and internal spacer from a 350 or 400F.This will get you 4.5 oz. increase as well as more surface area exposed to airstream.Uses 750 standard filter.I have this setup on my ko and 1100F.   Rock On

[JLeather]

To anyone searching for one, I have an NOS one similar to Fishhead's (but I think it has larger internal fins) I'm working towards recasting.  It's been difficult to keep the cost down, but I've finally found a foundry that's willing to work with me and I'm learning to do the pattern-making part myself (after a quote of many thousands of dollars from a few places that do such work).  It's still a month or so from a prototype but I'm pretty hopeful.  Not looking for anyone to start throwing their names in or anything.  When they're ready they'll be listed.  Just working out the shrinkage on it so everything lines up as well as the originals.

[lordmember1969]

To anyone searching for one, I have an NOS one similar to Fishhead's (but I think it has larger internal fins) I'm working towards recasting.  It's been difficult to keep the cost down, but I've finally found a foundry that's willing to work with me and I'm learning to do the pattern-making part myself (after a quote of many thousands of dollars from a few places that do such work).  It's still a month or so from a prototype but I'm pretty hopeful.  Not looking for anyone to start throwing their names in or anything.  When they're ready they'll be listed.  Just working out the shrinkage on it so everything lines up as well as the originals.

I want one:)

[BLUE71TURBO]

To anyone searching for one, I have an NOS one similar to Fishhead's (but I think it has larger internal fins) I'm working towards recasting.  It's been difficult to keep the cost down, but I've finally found a foundry that's willing to work with me and I'm learning to do the pattern-making part myself (after a quote of many thousands of dollars from a few places that do such work).  It's still a month or so from a prototype but I'm pretty hopeful.  Not looking for anyone to start throwing their names in or anything.  When they're ready they'll be listed.  Just working out the shrinkage on it so everything lines up as well as the originals.

   I know exactly what yer talking about !  I went to a local foundry to get quote to have side covers made up out of aluminum and i almost fainted !  The main problem is making the part larger for plug for the mold because of the molten aluminum shrinking during cooling.      

[CrankyOldGuy]

The internal fins help with heat transfer from the oil to the exterior fins.  Aluminum is an excellent heat transfer medium.  I thought for a moment that the interior and exterior fins lined up; but, they don't - 8 interior, 9 exterior.  If they did line up there would be a more direct path for transfer of the heat.  I imagine the extra external fin helps more than them lining up.

In my neck of the woods overheating has never been a problem; half the time is spent getting the oil warm enough 

Harry O.

[Ricky_Racer]

   I know exactly what yer talking about !  I went to a local foundry to get quote to have side covers made up out of aluminum and i almost fainted !  The main problem is making the part larger for plug for the mold because of the molten aluminum shrinking during cooling.      

Yeah, me too... How about $1000 for a finned points cover pattern?      RR

[Gaither]

About 25 years ago, I had an NOS '40 Ford Standard grille. They wanted $25,000 for a pattern. I passed. Bob Drake knew how to do it, he hired a retired pattern maker, made new grills for the '40 Ford Deluxe AND Standard (beautiful reproductions) profitably.

If you want patterns, find a retired pattern maker. He'll make it happen a LOT cheaper.

I don't have a "dog in this hunt" (ain't got a 750) but, I'm glad to see interest in the Deep Sump pan.

As we all know, oil, along with lubrication, does a LOT of engine cooling. If you can get more oil volume and more heat transfer surface, your ol' 750 engine can run cooler and live a much better life - for a lot longer.

[BLUE71TURBO]

   I know exactly what yer talking about !  I went to a local foundry to get quote to have side covers made up out of aluminum and i almost fainted !  The main problem is making the part larger for plug for the mold because of the molten aluminum shrinking during cooling.      

Yeah, me too... How about $1000 for a finned points cover pattern?      RR

 That sounds awful high.  I was quoted $1300.00 a side for the side covers, and that was after i made the modifications
 to the original covers for shrinkage !!!   

[754]

 I believe Bob drake die casts them, pretty sure there was a pic in his ads in Street rodder.
 Casting them would be a mess, hard to end up with a nice chromed one..

 I dont see the pattern being super hard to do. you ARE aware of patternmakers rules, are you not?

[BLUE71TURBO]

 Hey, how about a larger cast aluminum oil tank with fins for cooling !    

[oldhondarider]

To anyone searching for one, I have an NOS one similar to Fishhead's (but I think it has larger internal fins) I'm working towards recasting.  It's been difficult to keep the cost down, but I've finally found a foundry that's willing to work with me and I'm learning to do the pattern-making part myself (after a quote of many thousands of dollars from a few places that do such work).  It's still a month or so from a prototype but I'm pretty hopeful.  Not looking for anyone to start throwing their names in or anything.  When they're ready they'll be listed.  Just working out the shrinkage on it so everything lines up as well as the originals.

I want one:)

+1

[Ricky_Racer]

you ARE aware of patternmakers rules, are you not?

Frank, could you 'splain "patternmakers rules" for those of out here who aren't sure what they are?  So far the only ones I've found are "shrinkage factor" and "bend over!"  Thanks!  RR

[754]

 Patternmakers rules are rulers that take into account the shrinkage of the material to be cast. They differ for every material. Tales care of the Shrinkage..

 So if you build part of a mold 6 in wide, the finished piece will end up at 6 inches, but the mold is actually bigger.

 You can really screw someone up if you check their machining with a patternmakers caliper or ruler..

[Ricky_Racer]

Thanks, Frank. I didn't know that actual rulers were used to account for shrinkage.  Fortunately, most modern 3D software has a shrinkage factor that can be added to the model. I believe on aluminum it's 6%, but I'd defer to someone who knows for sure. I haven't given up on doing a 3D>grown or milled wax model>sandcasting project; it's just a question of putting together the pieces cost-effectively.

Wouldn't it be nice if we were all as rich as our dreams want us to be?    RR

[Spanner 1]

Nonsense fashion item IMO, zero help with oil cooling which is not an issue on a stock bike anyway, no proven advantage, in fact leads to higher oil temp IMO with a much greater % of oil sitting in the hot engine instead of circulation thru' the cool oil tank....... why not just do away with the oil tank if you can 'store' 3/4 of the oil capacity in a deep sump anyway ?

[754]

Mine is not going on a stock motor.. and it came off a 1080cc motor.

[voxonda]

Neither is mine, going on a Turbo.