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Author Topic: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom: "As the Spanner Turns..."  (Read 48856 times)

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Offline manjisann

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Mo the 80 CB650 Custom: "As the Spanner Turns..."
« on: June 11, 2009, 03:02:40 pm »
I bought this bike back in December 08 and have been dreaming about what to do. Originally I was just gonna clean it up a bit, do a quick rattlecan jobbie on the tank and ride it around. However me being who I am, the dreams grew and grew until they are what we have today. I've put way more money into preping for this customization than I am willing to admit to.

The general plans, strip it down to the frame, sandblast the frame and repaint it black using Kustom Shop paints.

Remove the ugly dent in the tank, give it a POR15 treatment on the inside and a new look on the outside. I haven't quite decided on the overall design yet, but the colors will be Kustom Shop (KS) Gunmetal Grey base, and Kobalt Blue Candy. Same general treatment for the fenders, luggage rack sissybar combo, and trunk.

Pull the engine and redo the gaskets on the top end, and possibly have the head and jugs machined flat as when I did a compression test the two outer cylinders came up to only 80 and 90 PSI on my top of the line Harbor Freight compression tester. I'm also going to remove all the old paint by blasting with walnut shell media and repaint.

Remove all the old paint on the rims and repaint to look pretty much like they do now, I like the black and silver look.

Redo the hand controls so they look new, fix the buggered wiring, and try and do something about the horrid roadrash on the right side pipes. I also have to somehow straighten out the right side passenger footpeg/brake/exhaust mount as it is a little tweaked.

Here is what I am starting with, sorry for the bad pics, it is really cramped in the garage with the paintbooth and tools and such.

Brandon
« Last Edit: May 28, 2010, 12:17:07 pm by manjisann »
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2009, 07:18:34 pm »
I hope everyone will forgive me for posting a bunch of little posts, but I don't want to host my pics elsewhere as I have seen to many posts where the links were broken. Anyhow, on to the interesting stuff.

I decided to redo the little adapter for my cylinder pressure tester to get it straight so I can hopefully get the inside two cylinders tested. 

I bought the Harbor Freight cylinder tester and it came with an 18mm and 14mm spark plug adapter, no 12mm!  >:(  Seeing as how I bought this specifically to test motorcycles, that seemed a little rude. I did some online searching and called the local shops and everyone wanted way more for the simple 12mm adapter than I wanted to pay, and that was assuming they would even sell me just the adapter. Most places wanted to sell me the whole kit, which is silly since I already had a high quality HF one  ;)

In my online perusing I found a forum where someone mentioned making their own adapter by sacrificing the 14mm adapter and brazing on the lower part of a spark plug. Now I've never really tried brazing, though my dad left me (I was the only one really intrested in it, so I got it woohoo!) his oxy/ace setup when he passed so I figured I may as well learn. One of my moms new neighbors is apparently certified in a bunch of different welding styles so I had him come over and show me how it was done. He set the fuel gauges to 40 psi on each and proceded to braze the two pieces together. Now I swear I've read that Acetylene can explode at over 15psi, so this seemed really questionable to me, but as I am typing this obviously it went OK (I don't encourage this, like I said, I've read it can explode!!) The adapter came out decent enough if a bit bent but I figured I'd try it.

Today my little brother and I tried using it, it would thread into the outer two cylinders just fine, but the inner two the bend was just too much and it wouldn't go. The outer two cylinders measured 80 and 90 psi's, but I am wondering if I didn't have it in tightly enough, and also since this is a HF special, if the psi's might be just a bit off.

I was just going to leave it at that and do a visual inspection when I tore the engine down. However, after spraying some ruststopper on some stuff I am doing for my friend, I decided I'd give it another go.

Step 1:

Break the ceramic top off a donor spark plug ( I kept some old ones just in case I needed them for something), remove the little copper wire thingy that is still in there. See Pic 1.

Step 2:

Flip it over, remove the little bent part that sparks with the electrode (is that what it's called?) Take a large diameter nail set, or you can probably get away with a phillips screw driver you don't care about, and hit the electrode back down through the top. Wear safety glasses for all this, as the ceramic does shatter a bit. See Pic 2.

Step 3:

After you've busted the little electrode thingy out, flip it back over and take your nailset and start whacking the crap out of the remaining ceramic inside, move the nailset around a bit. See Pic 3.



Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2009, 07:25:14 pm »
Step 4:

After you have busted all the ceramic out, remove the two little circle hoop thingys that are in there. It should look like this. See Pic 1.

Step 5:

Cut the threads off your 14mm adapter, I used a spiffy HF special air driven 3" cut off saw (I'm not a HF employee, but I like bargain tools that work, this one works.) See Pic 2. I then ground it down using a grinder and hand file till it was flat and as close to a square surface as I could get.

Step 6:

Taking the spark plug part, grind the top until it is down the the hexagonal area. This is a fairly thick area of the plug and will give you the most metal to braze to, and it's nearly the same size as the adapter. Make it as square as you can as well. Trust me, an adapter that isn't straight is fairly useless no matter how nice it looks. See Pic 3.




Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2009, 07:38:01 pm »
 >:( GRR stupid file size was too big so it deleted my last post and now I have to retype it!

OK, so step 7.

I wiped down the surfaces that are about to be brazed with acetone, put them in my vice to keep them lined up and brazed them together. I think it turned out pretty straight, but I won't know for sure till I try using it again. I'll try it tomorrow and let you know.

I'll also be making a slide hammer out of the jaws of a broken drill, a bolt and some fender washers. I need to pull the dent from my fuel tank, and the $20 HF slide hammer kit was more than I wanted to pay and didn't have the spiffy jaws in it  ;D

Thanks for checking out my build, any suggestions, thoughts, info or encouragement are welcome and appreciated!

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2009, 07:52:21 pm »
My little brother went out of town on a camping trip, and since I am trying to show him everything I know about motorcycles (that should really only take about 10 minutes  ;) ) I decided to wait until he gets back tomorrow before I to anything else to the bike or tests.

Instead I experimented with my welder (as I have almost no experience with it) and welding a bunch of fender washers together to make a slide hammer weight. After several failed attempts at various ways to weld it, and wire speeds, I remembered that if you bevel the metal you can weld thicker metal with better penetration. So I took the washers put them in the vice and using an angle grinder put some grooves in them. This will give me more contact surface when I run my bead.

I did two weights, one that is half a pound and one that is a full pound give or take a bit. Since I've never used a slide hammer, and I know the metal is thin on these fuel tanks, I figured this gives me three different weight options for pulling.

After I put the groove into the washers, I ran the weld bead, I'm thinking the really bad cratering is due to nozzle position, wire speed, and possibly the fact that the washers are really much too thick for my little 175 amp MiG welder. But since these aren't supporting anyones life or anything, slightly cold welds and bad looks are pretty acceptable.

Once the beads were run, I ground them down to the washer surface again. I think I will also take a hand file and go around the top and bottom edges and bevel them so they aren't so sharp. Also need to reduce the diameter of the washer that I brazed to the bolt top.

Put the washer weights onto the bolt and screw on the drill head and voila, a slide hammer that will grip wire.

I'll report and let everyone know how it works when I use it, just waiting for the rain to subside for more than a few hours. Why is it the weather is always wettest when a project is started? I live in a desert, it shouldn't be raining, but it has been for the last week or so. Oh well, rant over.

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2009, 06:44:06 pm »
Pulled the carbs off last night, and it was pretty easy with the method Hush showed for holding the air box back using a ratchet strap. THANKS HUSH!!! Probably took me 2 minutes to remove them once I had those back, soooo much easier than any other method I've tried.

After removing them, I found the strangest thing in the air box, I think it's one of those NZ air filters, Hush does this look familiar?
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2009, 06:46:31 pm »
With the carbs removed, and my little adapter straight, we retested the cylinder compression. From 1-4 went 98, 90, 90, 98. I think it's interesting that the outer two were higher than the inner two, but since the spread is within the ten percent, I'm not real worried. Once I get the engine out and torn down, I'll visually inspect everything.

Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2009, 07:55:46 pm »
Started pulling the carbs apart today, all in all they look to be in pretty good condition. I think they must have been rebuilt sometime recently as all the bronze parts look good, so do the orings and floats etc. It looks like they just need a good cleaning. Looks like I will have to replace the air cutoffs though, they've turned to goo. That's a chunk of change  :(

Still trying to decide if I just want clear over them, or actually put some color on them.
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2009, 07:59:35 pm »
The left side exhaust looks pretty decent, but the right definitely has road rash. I'm not real sure what I'm gonna do with it yet, as other than that the exhaust is really pretty sound. Since I'll be painting it all with high temp paint, I may weld something over them to make them look better.

Does anyone know if the 650's had heat shields under the riders feet on the exhausts? There are studs with female threads in that area.

Have most of the stuff off, should have the engine out in the next few days. It's exciting!!

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline Frankenkit

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2009, 09:37:15 pm »
yep, thar be heat shields under the rider's feet on the custom's 4-4 pipes.  dunno if it's just mine, but the front one was a hex bolt, the rear one a phillip's head. on both sides. Weird, huh? ???
"Moderation in all things - especially moderation. Too much moderation is excessive. The occasional excess is all part of living the moderate life."
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1980 CB650c- (sold) Delilah
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Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2009, 07:19:28 am »
Quote
dunno if it's just mine, but the front one was a hex bolt, the rear one a phillip's head. on both sides. Weird, huh?

Sounds like a PO customization. Do you have any pics? I'm thinking of trying to fab something and just wondering what the oem stuff looks like.

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline Hush

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2009, 05:27:40 pm »
No that's definitely an Australian air filter, ours are much prettier. :D
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline MikeB

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2009, 06:14:22 pm »
yep, thar be heat shields under the rider's feet on the custom's 4-4 pipes.  dunno if it's just mine, but the front one was a hex bolt, the rear one a phillip's head. on both sides. Weird, huh? ???

LOL mine on the left side had a hex bolt on the back  ::)
all the others were philips 

here's a pic. of the heat sheilds
one is a little shorter than the other , the bolts are closer together on that one also


Offline Hush

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2009, 01:42:30 am »
Might have something to do with the brake pedal travel on one side, do they have different part numbers?
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline Frankenkit

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2009, 07:09:50 am »
I had two 650 4-4s because the left one off Samson was completely rusted out.  Oddly, though they are both HM460A 4-4 pipes, the "new" one has a different rivet setup (four instead of two if I remember) and different heat shield (linear mounting bolts instead of an offset rear one, different dimple setup) so I had to use the new heat shield, too, even though my old one looked better. oh well.
"Moderation in all things - especially moderation. Too much moderation is excessive. The occasional excess is all part of living the moderate life."
2012 CBR250R "Black Betty"
1980 CB650c- (sold) Delilah
1973 CL350- Lola?
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Offline MikeB

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2009, 09:31:36 pm »
Might have something to do with the brake pedal travel on one side, do they have different part numbers?

Might be right Hush the shorter one is off the right side
No #s on the shields but guess that Honda would have sep. #

Kit
That's kinda odd were they both of a custom ?
HM460A stamped on mine to ? are you talking about the rivets in the ends of the mufflers mine have 4 also ?
wonder if the mufflers are they same but slightly diff. pipe bends between the custom and the nighthawk ?

manjisann
looks like you pipes end at the rear of your shocks ?
mine stop just short of the rear shocks (82 Nighthawk) but I think I have a little longer swingarm ?
And nice work on fabbing your own tools 8)
but I think you have your air filter in backwards :D :D (sorry just popped into my head)
« Last Edit: June 21, 2009, 09:49:08 pm by MikeB »

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2009, 06:24:41 pm »
Quote
but I think you have your air filter in backwards   (sorry just popped into my head)

Well, there are children that frequent this forum I am told, had to keep it PG  ;)

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2009, 09:09:16 am »
Quote
And nice work on fabbing your own tools

Thank you, sometimes it even saves me money  :D

Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2009, 09:21:31 am »
So Joy of Joy's we finally got the engine out. I feel like a noob for not figuring this out before. The lower right rail comes right off and takes the right front engine bracket with it. From there it was just a matter of pushing it out. For some reason we couldn't get the top rear bolt to hammer out, so the engine just slid along it.

Here's some pics along with one of the ComeAlong and engine hook thingy I made to do this with. I got the idea from another member who made a similar one.

Theres going to be a lot of cleaning and degreasing of the engine before I walnut blast it. I was hoping to leave the base part of the engine on the stand, as it's still a hefty peace of metal, but if I want to do a proper job I'm gonna have to take it off the engine stand  :'( . Oh well, it will all be worth it if it comes out looking as good as some of the works of art I've seen on here!

Now that the engine is out of the frame, it's time to finish taking it apart, and then SANDBLASTING TIME WOOHOO!!

Has anyone found a good way to take off the little placards that are on various parts of the bike? There the ones that give tire pressure specs and such. Also, how would you get them back on looking good?

Thanks for looking!

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2009, 02:50:23 pm »
Well, I have come to grips with the fact that my frame is shot and I'll have to get another  :'(  >:( This is a painful blow as the only frames I can find here locally are parts bikes and they want $500 for them. Guess I'll just have to find the money and get one and sell off all the parts I don't need. Bah, how depressing.

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline Hush

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #20 on: June 25, 2009, 03:00:40 pm »
Is that just for that steering head rust?
Didn't look that bad to me.
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2009, 05:54:12 pm »
Quote
Is that just for that steering head rust?
Didn't look that bad to me.

Haha, no not the rust. I was calling a couple machine shops about having a solid plug made so when I welded the race area it stayed round, and the guy I was talking to was a long time rider. He stated that he really didn't think it was a good idea just to patch it. Long story short, I talked to a couple others in the machining, welding, motorcycle enthusiast type people and they all stated it was really not a good idea. I suppose I finally just came to grips with the fact, after several on here told me (yes, guys you can say told you so  :-[ ) Between the damage to the steering head, and some of the other road rash stuff, it really is probably in my best interest to get an undamaged frame.

That being said, I'll still have the frame to do some experiments on, and who knows, I may just whack the steering tube off weld on a different one and make a chopper or bobber some day  ;D

I found a bone yard that has an almost complete 1980 cb650 custom that they have a title too and they want $550 for it. That is very painful, but I should be able to sale enough of the parts I don't need to at least make it liveable. I went and looked at it, didn't have a tank on it or a few other parts, which I pointed out to the guy that for 550 I really have to have those parts so I can recoup what I am losing. He said he'd round one up along with some of the other parts and have them ready for when I pick it up in a couple days. Put a bit down to let him know I was serious. He seems up and up, so I think it will work out. Now I just have to figure out where to put all the extra parts until I can sell them. I'll be posting them on the forum first, and then sell on eBay what no one is interested in here.

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline Frankenkit

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #22 on: June 26, 2009, 06:21:23 am »
damn.... oh hey where's Soos? he knows 650s quite well and might have a frame you could buy. I mean, they don't grow on trees, but...who knows.
"Moderation in all things - especially moderation. Too much moderation is excessive. The occasional excess is all part of living the moderate life."
2012 CBR250R "Black Betty"
1980 CB650c- (sold) Delilah
1973 CL350- Lola?
Sweet, bubbly, Buddha - Say it ain't so!!!
Stuff for sale

Offline manjisann

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #23 on: June 26, 2009, 06:44:02 am »
I thought about soos, but I haven't seen him lurking on the forums lately, hope he's ok. I'm pretty much commited to buying this one I found as I need it ASAP. I have to get this bike done before sept when school starts up again, and I'm running out of time. Good thing I already know how to strip the bike down  ;D I've pretty much written it up to the school of hard knocks, and now I know to be careful when examining potential bikes.

On the bright side, he has a decent right side exhaust and a few other things that were kinda mangy looking on my bike, so it's not a total loss.

Brandon
Sure it's for sale! How much you ask?? Well, how much are you willing to pay??? Now triple it, that's the price!

1973 CB500 K2 - Sold the bike and bought a Mig, Miss the bike, Love the Mig :D
1980 CB650 Custom
1971 CB500 Frame 650 engine: Project

Trip and General Ramblings blog: manjisann.blogspot.com

Offline RM81

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Re: Mo the 80 CB650 Custom build is finally started!!
« Reply #24 on: June 26, 2009, 06:58:28 am »
You can always sell the old frame and title to help with the cost of a new one.  I've heard of people just using the VIN plate with the title to use on a custom build and trashing the old frame.  Not sure if it's legal though.  Good thread so far.  I'll be watching.

 

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Honda