Topic: Guess I'll stick with the CBs

[6pkrunner]

Always had a hankering for a first year Z, but if this is where they're going .........

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Kawasaki-Kawasaki-Z1-1973-Kawasaki-Z1_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6710QQitemZ4588222564QQrdZ1

[MRieck]

I don't know....that bike IS exceptional. I can never understand owning a machine meant to be driven or ridden and parking it somewhere.

[Jonesy]

Right now the current high bidder's name is "crazy4557"... some might be thinking this name is appropriate at $15,000... Yet, in context, Vic World's bikes of comparable quality start at $20,000.

Oh well, if they've got the money and that's what they want to spend it on, more power to them. Just wish I had that kinda dough...

[skamania19]

Heck, I'd bid on it if I had the money laying around. Actually, if I had that kind of money I'd have my people call his people and set up the deal. And I'd be calling my people from a beach in the Bahamas.

[Jim Shea]

That is a lovely Z, too lovely, you would devalue it by riding it. Have a look at a Z 650 maybe,  or I love the Suzuki GT 750 they are a lot cheaper? these 2 bikes were selling for a bout 1K pounds. Of course, you should keep your CB as well.
I want one of everything.

[6pkrunner]

or I love the Suzuki GT 750 they are a lot cheaper?

Here's a few shots of a '75 I have. I got it for next to a song. While not a total resto, I've been at it for the last two years. I like the 1972s tank treatment and did a sort of modified version on this one. I didn't like the thin black and gold stripe the '75s came with

[needswork]

6pk,
That is SWEEEEEET! I grew up around 2 stroke dirt bikes and my brother owned a GT380, then a GT(?) 500 (twin), the damned things were indestructible! Those water buffalos are special though.

Paul

[cb350f_rider_73]

I'm with MRieck.  What good would it do to spend 15 grand or more on something that you basically couldn't ride without losing a lot of that money?  I'd rather pick up a clunker, fix it to good road-worthy condition and enjoy it. 

Wayne

[Terry in Australia]

Nice looking bike, pity about the 30 year old tires, they'd be harder than a bus full of Lesbians, ha ha! Cheers, Terry.

[Jim Shea]

6pk,
Your bike loos great. What type of problems should I be aware of on the GT 750 and what has your experience taught you?
I met a guy yesterday who used to own one and he said the pistons were vulnerable? He kept referring to it as a 'kettle'?
I also talked to a guy who was on a GS380 I think! and he said that the 5th gear was a problem, relevant because, his 380, was mostly made out of GT750 bits.
It's been a long time since I heard an old Suzuki fired up, it sounded terriffic!
Jim.

[SteveD CB500F]

We called them "Kettles" in the UK because they were water cooled and that was quite rare at the time.

The 380 would have been a GT380 triple but I can't imagine that it had too many interchangeable parts with the 750 (?)

[Jim Shea]

The one I saw was a twin, I wonder if it was a 350? Steve, I saw this at Infinity yesterday. The other guy I met was one of the founders of the UK kettle club, he said be careful of the bike seizing up, something to do with the oil injectors getting clogged up?

[SteveD CB500F]

You're probably right.  Before the launch of the GT triples (1972?), I believe the Suzuki 2 strokes were twins.

[Jim Shea]

A red letter day indeed, Steve says and I quote "You're probably right" a phrase that I will remember and cherish!   

[Terry in Australia]

I had a 1970 Suzuki T250 twin, it was quicker off the line than a CB750, and a mate had a T500 "Cobra" which was pretty quick too. The GT380/550's were air cooled triples, better behaved than the Kawasaki triples of the same era, a lot less "peaky", but also heavy and a lot slower, and like a lot of air cooled triples, had problems with centre cylinders overheating.

The GT750 "Water buffalo", "Waterbottle", "Kettle" etc, was a great bike, big and heavy so no competition for say, the Kawasaki H2 750, but a nice mild touring bike, much like a two stroke CB750. I owned a GT750J (first model) with the 4LS front brake, (which was crap, compared to a disc, if anyone is wondering) but my favorite model was the GT750K with the "J"s styling, but twin disc front end.

If you're looking for one, main problem is worn out crank seals causing gearbox oil to be drawn into the crankcases and producing a "London Fog" of smoke, (I am responsible for once blocking the sun in Elizabeth St in Melbourne in 1997) the fix for this is a complete strip down, which can be a real problem in itself, as the water cooled 750's are susceptible to "Electrolysis" chemically welding the crankcases to the cylinder block due to PO's not religiously changing the engine coolant.

The later engines were a little faster due to different port timing, and had less problems with carb synching, (they fitted CV's to the later engines, and fixed the linkage problem) but the styling was bland in comparison to the earlier models. The only tricky thing is adjusting the oil pump, and as far as I'm aware, there were no electronic ignitions available, so you'll have fun adjusting 3 sets of points. Great bike though, for sure! Cheers, Terry.

[6pkrunner]

Being a two stroke the crank seals are the most wear prone item IMHO. The bike is slightly heavier (or feels it at slow speeds) than a CB750. Once loose on the road it is amazing smooth and quiet for a large displacement 2 stroke. And getting used to no engine compression braking is a bit nervy for a while. But they are great bikes. They were never designed to be a superbike just a sport tourer and at that they are pretty good.
The carb floats are made of the thinnest brass on the planet and while NOS replacement floats are available from the UK (where they carry a cult like following) they are not cheap.
I got 4 sets of carbs off eGouge and managed to make up a good set of three floats, and the 4 sets of carbs were cheaper than three NOS floats from across the pond. But like anything on eGouge you have to hit the ads with typos or the not common searched titles.
Sometimes GT parts go for next to nothing, then there is a bidding frenzy.
And also be careful of the NOS sales. Suzuki carries a lot of the parts still in inventory. Points cover selling for over $100 on eGouge when they are new for $60 at the dealer. Emblems going for $30 when they are $15 at the dealer.
But now that they are pretty much gone, they get a lot of stares and gawks from people. Be prepared to answer lots of questions whenever you stop.

[6pkrunner]

And yes Terry - the Suzuki way of setting the point gap and timing is quite bizarre to say the least. you need a depth dial indicator and you set the timing when the pistons are a specific height from TDC. And the center piston is a different height than the outboards. The oil pump rod is hooked to a lever from the right hand carb and yes pump setting is critical. Too little oil mixed and she'll bake pistons better than an over at 500 degrees. Too much, while not a bad thing, other than fouling plugs will have ever neighbour down your back. I set mine to the factory specs and other than the constant thin float issues and subsequent carb fiddling, there's never been a hassle.
Handling isn't a crisp as a CB750 (comparitively speaking for 30 plus year old bikes) and acceleration seems to be on par. The road tests I had from the time put the Suzuki at 13.5 to 13.8 in the 1/4 and the later CBs at 13.3 to 13.5. In the real world with the seat of the pants dyno the Suzuki seems a tad slower, mainly because the engine never seems to be pressed hard. Just gets a more gutteral sound. The CB gets the "up on the cam" fantic sound when hitting the powerband.  But the speedo will swing the same as the CBs.
 I know all this pales in reference to todays bikes, but my interest isn't in new machinery. I like the ones that were around when I wore a younger man's clothes and they still do 30 in the city and 70 on the highway. I have no need for 170mph top end, nor 9.8 quarter mile times.

[damn_yankee]

"The motorcycle has had no fuel in the tank, has never been started"

so for $15,000.00 I don't even know if it runs!

[Terry in Australia]

Yeah, it's probably buggared, I bet that's why he's selling it! Cheers, Terry.

[Jim Shea]

So, do you chaps feel that the GT750 is more trouble, less trouble or about the same as CB750?

[Terry in Australia]

Like any bike Jim, it depends on it's condition. CB750's were built in much greater numbers though, so parts will always be more readily available, but once set up, the GT750 would be just as reliable, and just as enjoyable to own, anyone in Oz got one sitting in a shed? I'll trade you my F2! cheers, Terry.

[6pkrunner]

I enjoy tinkering with the bikes and cars as much as driving them, so they get maintained too often. In that respect the two are about the same in maintainance. When the Honda has lash to set, the Buffalo as the extra oddity of timing setting and coolant system checks. And the two stroke can get the munchies for plugs every now and again. Let's you know right away,  2 stroke oil or carbs are a tad off.

[Jim Shea]

Thanks guys. I enjoy tinkering, just not very good at the moment, but practice makes perfect?
I will havea  look at one in the flesh, I have onle seen them on ebay etc, adn I need to sit on one and get a feel for it. If I like it, I am pretty sure I will go for it...