Topic: bye bye spark plugs?

[Laminar]

Hard to say on a market. If the system was reliable, I am sure some would buy it, especially if it gave a performance boost over stock. I would love to get an fi set up as long as the frame itself did not need to be modded. it would take care of having to sync and the mix could be better controlled. But I do not have the time or money to invest in a system like this or the fabrication tools.

ITBs still require syncing.

The whole point though is that advances like this are cool, even if we can adapt them.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

Yeah, once. Once you have tings in tune, no more resyncing yearly or every couple of years. No more effects from strong cross winds. The fi just will not require as much work over time. Initial setup, yes but after that, about the only thing is if you make engine changes of some sort. Plus, if you use a small computer to store the settings, it is even easier to reset.
Now couple this with a dyna2000, good stuff.

[Laminar]

Yeah, once. Once you have tings in tune, no more resyncing yearly or every couple of years.

Things I've read have suggested resyncing every 5000 miles or so, and definitely every time the valves are adjusted.

[demon78]

Correct me if I'm wrong gents but dual plugs are for reliability not better combustion all same as A/C engines where were instituted so big thing in front would keep whirling even with duff plug.
Bill the demon.

[Buber]

I dunno, an electric powered bike, just doesn't have the same allure of an internal combustion engine...

Agreed.  That's why I'd prefer they work on non gas-powered engines for their future cars so we can keep our gas burning engines going a generation from now. 

Hmm, actually don't despair yet. There are scientists that claim you can convert CO2 into methane, and then it's straight chemical reaction, to normal fuel.
http://www.azom.com/news.asp?newsID=15847
or this (translated by google)
http://translate.google.pl/translate?hl=pl&sl=pl&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wprost.pl%2Far%2F166360%2FTanie-paliwo-z-Lublina%2F

And there are opinions that this is actually possible...

[Retro Rocket]

This is interesting, watch till the end, its the bit about acetone i am interested in.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/524517/double_your_gas_mileage_2x/

Mick

[Inigo Montoya]

nothing shows up. I have heard of people using acetone to increase mileage though.

As for syncing every 5000 miles, I would not call that a reliable system, not in this day and age. And there should be no reason whatsoever to have to do it from a simple valve adjust unless you are somehow really changing how far they open.

[Gordon]

This is interesting, watch till the end, its the bit about acetone i am interested in.

Mick

None of the claims about acetone increasing fuel efficiency have been able to be reproduced by third party testers.  Unsubstantiated claims aside, I wonder what acetone would do to all the rubber bits from the petcock all the way down to the carbs?  My guess is it wouldn't be good. 

[Buber]

Acetone is a myth.. unfortunately....

[Inigo Montoya]

Well the amount is negligible. From what I have read on it, people put in a couple ounces to a few gallons of gas. Something like 3 ounces to 10 gallons, so that is WAY less then the ethanol found in most gas at 10% and is not that great for rubber either. but that does not mean there is no effect on parts.

As for 3rd party testers, hard to say. Some people see it, some do not. I think it all depends on the gas in your area and the vehicle itself. I doubt our bikes would benefit much but then I have not tried it in any of my cars.

So maybe it does work but then maybe not, I am not going to try it as I do not want to worry about possible issues. So I guess I could say I am not convinced by the claims.

[Laminar]

Correct me if I'm wrong gents but dual plugs are for reliability not better combustion all same as A/C engines where were instituted so big thing in front would keep whirling even with duff plug.
Bill the demon.

Two plugs means combustion starts at two points in the cylinder. This ensures more complete combustion of the fuel because the flame front takes time to travel through the cylinder. It's especially useful with large bores where the flame front has a long way to travel.

[demon78]

Like 3350's or Merlins?
Bill the demon.

[bucky katt]

ford did (does?) twin plug 4 cylinder motors in the ranger

[demon78]

Well the engine theory I learned was that engineers tried to get more HP by staggering the ignition point and producing a better flame front but that HP gain was negligible versus the complexity of the system, so they went back to the original, I will stand to be corrected if someone can point me to the information.
Bill the demon.

[Inigo Montoya]

I know my 82 nissan stanza had dual plugs. It was carbed and pretty reliable. The plugs were termed intake and exhaust. I am sure they fired at the same time and you could tell if one was not firing quite right.

[CBGhia]

Ducati uses dual plugs in its 1000 DS motor.  I don't know how much of an improvement the plugs were.  Sometimes Ducati does things just for fun.  (Desmo valves anyone?)

[Cvillechopper]

Ducati uses dual plugs in its 1000 DS motor.  I don't know how much of an improvement the plugs were.  Sometimes Ducati does things just for fun.  (Desmo valves anyone?)

Desmo valves are great but a bugger to maintain.  Really do allow the engine to rev more freely.  The sound is distinct but you either love it or hate it.  I think it sounds like a pocketful of change in the top end but my friend just loves the sound of his 748.

[Inigo Montoya]

I love how topics evolve! We go from dropping plugs to dual plugs to valves. The theory of evolution is true!!!

[Steve F]

Can anyone tell me how they propose to get the laser beam into the combustion chamber?  LASERs, being a form of light would require lenses and such, no?  How do they intend on keeping the lenses clear and not fried or carboned up?  Is there a port or a shutter that opens up so the laser can fire through and then closes really quick?
It's a little hard for me to visualize how this laser system is to work in the real world, and not some laboratory.

[HavocTurbo]

Can anyone tell me how they propose to get the laser beam into the combustion chamber?  LASERs, being a form of light would require lenses and such, no?  How do they intend on keeping the lenses clear and not fried or carboned up?  Is there a port or a shutter that opens up so the laser can fire through and then closes really quick?
It's a little hard for me to visualize how this laser system is to work in the real world, and not some laboratory.

They would probably require regular service like oil changes, and tune ups.

[Retro Rocket]

These lasers would have to just "flash" for a very short period of time right? so if they shorted and stuck on, would they melt the top of the pistons or do i watch too much TV.....

Mick

[lordmoonpie]

Well the engine theory I learned was that engineers tried to get more HP by staggering the ignition point and producing a better flame front but that HP gain was negligible versus the complexity of the system, so they went back to the original, I will stand to be corrected if someone can point me to the information.
Bill the demon.

Twin plugging the Black Bomber head is a common modification in the UK classic race scene. It's mainly on the top end bikes but is good for a whole 1 extra horsepower. very small gains but at the sharp end of racing it's obviously worth it.