Author Topic: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???  (Read 2562 times)

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maxime

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There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« on: July 17, 2009, 06:45:44 AM »
Hi Guys ,

I am new on the forum, glad I found you, just bought a CB 750 1973 that been park in a heated garage since 1997, so I have to work on it to make it run, but still it' s a beautiful bike.

The engine been done at 47 000Km and now it has 51 000km. The number on the engine is  CB750E 20 831 (weird for a 1973??) but the worst is that is has a radiator in front, that is not original, like a Nighthawk maybe.  What does that mean??? Help me, I am lost...........   


Thanks 

Offline Duke McDukiedook

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2009, 06:52:39 AM »
Oil cooler.
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Offline Johnie

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2009, 06:58:16 AM »
Welcome to the board...I agree it has to be an oil cooler unless someone put a whole different liquid cooled engine in that bike.  We really like pics here so attach some when you get a chance.  Let us know how it goes...we are here to help.  Download the service manual for the bike.  It is on the board here.
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Offline Duke McDukiedook

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #3 on: July 17, 2009, 07:03:52 AM »
Posted pictures are always better than none.
"Well, Mr. Carpetbagger. We got somethin' in this territory called the Missouri boat ride."   Josey Wales

"It's Baltimore, gentlemen. The gods will not save you." Ervin Burrell

CB750 K3 crat | (2) 1986 VFR750F

maxime

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #4 on: July 17, 2009, 08:32:23 AM »
Thanks guys,

So it would be a oil cooler, interesting... is it worth keeping it you think? My friend has the same bike but without the cooler. It do not look very good anyway (with tie rap that hold it to the frame)but if I need it, I need it.
 
I will post pics soon, thanks again.

Offline Johnie

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #5 on: July 17, 2009, 08:56:51 AM »
Thanks guys,

So it would be a oil cooler, interesting... is it worth keeping it you think? My friend has the same bike but without the cooler. It do not look very good anyway (with tie rap that hold it to the frame)but if I need it, I need it.
 
I will post pics soon, thanks again.
You should not need an oil cooler on that bike.
1970 CB750K0 - Candy Ruby Red
1973 CB750K3 - Candy Bacchus Olive or Sunflake Orange
1970 Chevy Chevelle SS396 - Cortez Silver
1976 GL1000 Sulphur Yellow

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Offline mystic_1

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #6 on: July 17, 2009, 09:09:38 AM »
Agreed, unless the motor has serious mods you don't need it, and maybe not even then.

It do not look very good anyway


There's your answer.  Don't like the way it makes the bike look?  Ditch it.

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Offline 754

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #7 on: July 17, 2009, 09:11:55 AM »
How do you know?, they could live in an area that often sees 40 degree C temps.
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Offline Pinhead

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2009, 09:34:18 AM »
He bought the bike used, and the engine has been "redone" a while back... How do you know the PO didn't hop it up a bit and now it NEEDS the cooler?? Personally I'd leave it on.
Doug

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Offline d_soles

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2009, 09:37:25 AM »
Unless it leaks excessively, I see no reason to take it off. 

It's already there, and it's cooling your engine (oil).  Heat = Damage, so, why not let your engine run a bit cooler?  Might even make your oil last longer, not as much thermal breakdown.

If you don't like the way it's attached, make some brackets and attach it nicely.  It's easy.  I'm not a fabricator (I don't even own a grinder or a welder), but I can usually make stuff work with a drill and a saw. 


Doug
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Offline Industrial Rat400f Killer

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2009, 09:37:35 AM »
How do you know?, they could live in an area that often sees 40 degree C temps.


Yeah, I thought that an oil cooler would improve performance and extent engine life no matter what the climate conditions are. I really don't know anything as I'm pretty new but shouldn't we know what kind of riding he wants to do, get pics and find out what the temps are in his area?


Offline mystic_1

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2009, 09:54:50 AM »
I don't see how an oil could improve performance.  It will help prolong engine life if your engine routinely exceeds normal operating temperatures.

There have been some pretty heated threads in the past on the pros and cons of oil coolers.  A search from the search page will turn these up.  IMO unless your motor is hopped up or you live in a desert you do not need one, so it's a styling choice at that point.

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Offline Industrial Rat400f Killer

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2009, 10:29:25 AM »
I don't see how an oil could improve performance.  It will help prolong engine life if your engine routinely exceeds normal operating temperatures.

There have been some pretty heated threads in the past on the pros and cons of oil coolers.  A search from the search page will turn these up.  IMO unless your motor is hopped up or you live in a desert you do not need one, so it's a styling choice at that point.

mystic_1

I'm not disagreeing with you as I believe what you said about it not being needed unless the engine is hopped up or they live in a desert to be true, but I do have this question.
I was under the impresion that these bikes generally perform better in cooler temp than in hot temps, my bike seems to anyway.
Having said that wouldn't an oil cooler keep the engine in a temp range that would help with performance?
Like I said before I'm not arguing, I'm just asking because that's what I thought the theory behind oil coolers was.

Offline Shoeboxjoe

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2009, 10:44:10 AM »
Colder air (fuel) is more dense which is why you see more power in cooler weather.
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Offline Industrial Rat400f Killer

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2009, 12:00:35 PM »
Colder air (fuel) is more dense which is why you see more power in cooler weather.


Oh, gotcha, it has nothing to do with engine temp, it's air and fuel.

Huskyoff

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2009, 12:06:20 PM »
I've got one and it makes me better than everybody that doesn't have one!!!!


Offline angeldeville

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #16 on: July 17, 2009, 01:26:49 PM »
oil cooler can decrease the amount of air flowing around the cylinder and heads.

oil that is too cold doesn't lubricate and flow properly.

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Offline TwoTired

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #17 on: July 17, 2009, 02:14:24 PM »
It's called an oil cooler for a reason, as it is there to cool the oil and help it survive high engine temps such as when you drive through a hot desert using high engine power output (where the engine generates the most heat).

The cooling fins on the engine do the bulk of the engine cooling by far.  Both devices need air flow for them to do their job.

Unless the engine was designed to be cooled by oil, an oil cooler is for keeping the oil in a proper state of health, and only indirectly aids engine longevity.  An oil cooler also needs a corresponding thermostat to do it's job properly, or there is risk of over-cooling the oil below its optimum working temperature.  Short rides may never see the oil temp get high enough to even use the oil cooler, leaving it just so much added weight and unnecessary complexity.  Over-cooled oil does not lubricate the engine properly.

The stock SOHC4 doesn't need an oil cooler for street use.  If you have made special mods or use it in an abnormal way, there can be some benefits to an added oil cooler.

I'm convinced the popularity of oil coolers is largely based on myth, conjecture, and wishful thinking, rather than science or demonstrated need.  The other reason has to do with "looking" like something related to a track vehicle that actually has a need based on the environment it is used within.  Street bikes rarely, if ever, meet those conditions.

There is some rationale that says it might extend the useful life of the oil, by keeping the oil below breakdown temps on long, hot, loaded down rides.  But, economically it makes more sense to me to simply change the oil at the normal recommended service interval.

I have a Lockhart oil cooler that came on one of my 750 bikes.  It's an F model that had its engine replaced with a K motor.  Anyway, I'll eventually move that thing over to a cafe/custom style buildup to enhance it's sales appeal.  Every bit of eye candy helps for that genre.

If the engine isn't making more heat than stock, or routinely making more power than stock, the oil cooler is just added weight, a conversation piece, and sales tool.

Previously in this thread, the point was made about the oil cooler's location upstream from the engine cooling fins.  Raising the temperature of the air passing over the engine cooling fins reduces their ability to transfer heat away from the engine.  I question why one would want to diminish effectiveness of the engine's primary cooling system in such a way. 

IMO
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Offline d_soles

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2009, 05:05:54 PM »
TT, all good points....

Doug
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Offline nobody

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2009, 05:44:23 PM »
I have one on my 74k that looks to be factory equipment and I was thinking about maybe putting one on my 78f cafe build but afte reading this I may reconsider.
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #20 on: July 17, 2009, 05:53:05 PM »
I have one on my 74k that looks to be factory equipment and I was thinking about maybe putting one on my 78f cafe build but afte reading this I may reconsider.

It might be factory equipment.  But, no Honda SOHC4 came with a factory installed oil cooler.  At least not one for sale to the public.
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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Offline nobody

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #21 on: July 17, 2009, 06:00:49 PM »
Hmm, maybe I should remove it from that bike then, if I ever get it back on the road.
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Offline Don R

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #22 on: July 18, 2009, 12:29:05 AM »
There is usually an adapter behind the oil filter that routes the oil through the hoses to the cooler, it could be removed when doing your next oil change. I bet you could sell it easily on here to someone like me. or me see the ads section.
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Offline Pinhead

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #23 on: July 18, 2009, 01:36:18 AM »
He bought the bike used, and the engine has been "redone" a while back... How do you know the PO didn't hop it up a bit and now it NEEDS the cooler?? Personally I'd leave it on.

So, what of it? Are you absolutely sure that the engine hasn't been redone with higher compression, bigger pistons, a hotter cam, etc??
Doug

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Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: There is a radiator on my CB 750 1973 Why ???
« Reply #24 on: July 18, 2009, 02:04:55 AM »
Quote
I question why one would want to diminish effectiveness of the engine's primary cooling system in such a way. 

I think you are onto something there TT, hence the oil cooler... ;D ;D

Sorry, couldn't help myself.... ::)

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