Author Topic: Do I Have a Beef?  (Read 1687 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Popwood

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 914
Do I Have a Beef?
« on: July 18, 2009, 08:37:35 AM »
Ordered a new front wheel rim for my '75 750 from an ebay seller. The rim was represented as NOS. When I got it, it certainly is new, and it had an official looking Honda Parts sticker on it. However, it was made by DID-- the company that makes MC chain and has a good rep. The rim looks fine and is a reproduction of the original Honda rim, but it certainly doesn't match my understanding of what NOS is. I'm just wondering if I paid a premium for NOS and it isn't NOS. The price was $99.95.

What say you?
Current Rides:
1975 cb550K
1975 cb750K
1967 Bridgestone 350GTR

Past Rides:
1988 400 Hawk
195? Schwinn Whizzer

Offline mlinder

  • "Kitten Puncher"
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,013
  • Stop Global Tilting now!
    • Moto Northwest
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2009, 08:40:48 AM »
DID made the rims for the sohc4's.
No.


Offline FunJimmy

  • Who you calling
  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,802
  • Vancouver
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2009, 08:45:51 AM »
Technically you night have a bone to chew on, but a lot of sellers on feebay don't know what the heII they're selling.
If it looks OLD and NEW, then the listing says NOS.
He may not have a clue what the real rim on an old CB750 was or looked like in the first place.

But "the squeaky wheel gets the grease".
Complain to the seller and advise him of your dissatisfaction.
File a claim with Ebay and Paypal.
Paypal sides with the purchaser in disputes like these.
You can often get your money back upon return of the item, or you might agree to a partial refund.

Keep us posted

FJ
You never see a motorcycle parked outside of a psychiatrist's office!

CB550 Cafe Interceptor a Gentlemans Roadster
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=27159.0

Offline robe0531

  • Enthusiast
  • **
  • Posts: 200
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2009, 08:48:37 AM »
my rims are stock on my cb750 and they are made by DID
i do belive DID made the rims for the old cb750s
1978 cb750k
1968 Honda ca160

Offline Popwood

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 914
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2009, 08:59:35 AM »
Oh, the seller knows what NOS is. He has lots of items of sale and his business is Meyers Motocycles in Percy, Illinois.

Am I mistaken that NOS means parts that were made in the era but never used? Would real NOS be more valuable/higher priced than new stock? While not always the case, let's face it. A lot of stuff manufactured years ago is of better quality than what's being made today. For example, I wouldn't say the chrome on this rim looks as good as that on my 550s original rims, even after all these years. It may or may not matter, but this rim was made in Indonesia.

It is good to know that the same company is making it today as were the originals and as I said earlier, DID has a good rep in the chain business.
Current Rides:
1975 cb550K
1975 cb750K
1967 Bridgestone 350GTR

Past Rides:
1988 400 Hawk
195? Schwinn Whizzer

Offline mlinder

  • "Kitten Puncher"
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,013
  • Stop Global Tilting now!
    • Moto Northwest
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2009, 09:16:57 AM »
NOS means New Old Stock.
Meaning, it's old, but new, as in, made way back when but never used, and is the same type used on the machine you are buying it for.
New- unused
old- was made around the same time that your original was
stock- same as used on your machine

Again, DID made the rims for these old bikes.

Sounds like it was represented correctly, unless I'm missing something?
No.


Offline Magpie

  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,318
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2009, 09:18:44 AM »
My take on this is............ The original rims on my K1 and K0 750's have a small diamond with DID in it near the hole for the valve stem. So, if I bought a NOS rim I would want the same thing only new. I have a new DID replacement rim from Honda that has the size and date of manufacture stamped on the outer side of the rim. This is a new "replacement" rim not NOS for my K1 and K0. I would certainly pay more for a NOS rim if it was a true original since rechroming an old one is over $200/rim here.
The replacement I have looks good but is not a dupilcate of the original.
If you were looking to have a new duplicate of your old rim I don't think you got it if yours are like mine.
Cliff.

Offline IHWillys

  • Enthusiast
  • **
  • Posts: 178
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #7 on: July 18, 2009, 09:50:35 AM »
Quote from: Popwood
Am I mistaken that NOS means parts that were made in the era but never used?...

No but the "in the era" part is perhaps a bit ambiguous.
NOS, New Old Stock, means it is a part that was made long enough ago to have completely through the normal flow of manufacturing/distribution channels without ever being used/installed.  It now has reentered the distribution process and is being sold under the guise of NOS to additionally denote that while new, it has sat around for some time and any warranty extended the part when new is not likely to now be applicable.  Also, the seller's own inventory is what is available through that channel.  If a replacement due to defect is desired, the replacement may very well not be there if the purchaser "got the last one".

A key point here in my understanding of NOS is that NOS applies to aftermarket parts as readily as it does OEM parts and it applies to parts that were made well after other parts for the same vehicle that are NOS.  IE, NOS can apply to a made-in-1972-for-Honda wheel and it could also apply to a made-in-1982-for-the-aftermarket wheel.  Both could be NOS. Of the two, only the former would be OEM NOS.  I have purchased far more NOS labeled parts from the latter category than the former in dealing with '50s era cars and trucks.

The key difference here between my interpretation and others' above is that I read the "Stock" not as meaning OEM but as meaning "inventory", as in "Yes, I have that in stock".  Thus NOS is not held as meaning OEM as it is commonly applied to aftermarket parts. 

I went off to ebay for an example and funny thing is, the last item I had viewed is an example.  Item number: 350118085368.  This is an auction for some Redwing shocks, NOS is in the title.  These obviously are not OEM.  Likewise, item number: 370224212922.  Here the seller quite clearly states OEM and Genuine Honda vs just using NOS.

After all this long windedness, I say you received an NOS wheel if it is new and was manufactured 10+ years ago. 

Ken

Offline Inigo Montoya

  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,855
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #8 on: July 18, 2009, 10:09:42 AM »
Does the wheel fit? Does it look good? Does it work with the other wheel on the bike? If so, then I would say to not gripe about it. After all, a new rim can cost over 100 clams easy.

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

  • This MuthaF'er is getting to be a
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 14,929
  • Bought her new 4/75
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #9 on: July 18, 2009, 10:15:12 AM »
This guy is selling NEW, meaning brand new, stuff. All his listings are still available from Honda. He is NOT selling New Old Stock! Perhaps that's why he doesn't list the parts numbers for you to look for availability?

You have a technical beef if you expected the exact OLD item with the diamond emblem for a perfect restore. Proving it's not NOS will be damn near impossible unless it has a manufacture date on it which I'd bet it does not. I ordered a NEW set of rims for my 75 F last year from Service Honda and received what I believe to be the exact DID branded rim(s) you got and got them at a much better price.

Just don't be fooled into buying Myers' set of primary chains. Yes, you need 2 chains which come in one set BUT he is pricing them at the price of 2 sets!

If he stated NOS in the ad I'd say to give him a neutral feedback for representing new stuff as NOS and use the new rim. If you want to be that particular contact him first to let him know your intentions. If he's an #$%* about it, if it's that important to you, then nail him with a negative feedback.     
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline FunJimmy

  • Who you calling
  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,802
  • Vancouver
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #10 on: July 18, 2009, 10:25:18 AM »
The key difference here between my interpretation and others' above is that I read the "Stock" not as meaning OEM but as meaning "inventory", as in "Yes, I have that in stock".  Thus NOS is not held as meaning OEM as it is commonly applied to aftermarket parts. 

Well said!
+1
You never see a motorcycle parked outside of a psychiatrist's office!

CB550 Cafe Interceptor a Gentlemans Roadster
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=27159.0

Offline Popwood

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 914
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2009, 11:39:07 AM »
This new rim has a DOT born on date stamped on the rim, and it's little more than a year old. Clearly not OLD.

The only part that is OLD is the design/style. It looks exacly like the original, but if you were doing a resto on a KO I don't think you'd want that DOT stamp on the rim.

Maybe I'll ping the seller to let him know that he should be more clear about what it is he's selling, clear up the ambiguity.

Current Rides:
1975 cb550K
1975 cb750K
1967 Bridgestone 350GTR

Past Rides:
1988 400 Hawk
195? Schwinn Whizzer

Offline 754

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 29,058
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2009, 11:48:28 AM »
Lets take the Cb 750/K0 750 rims.. They may have been superseded, then you may be getting what Honda considers an OEM replacement part. That does not mean it is RESTORATION CORRECT.

The topic here, is later rims, if it is less than 3 years old, I would not consider NOS, as it is likely current stock.

 So yes, If he did say NOS and it is a year old, you have a beef.

 I dont think an OEM rim from Honda is overpriced at 100 bux.

 And YES, NOS can mean OEM or Aftermarket parts

  If a rim was built as a superseded part for a K0 (I am just using this as an example), and it was NOT IDENTICAL, but manufactured in the 70,s... it would then be a N.O.R.S part.
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline MJL

  • Don't listen to me, I'm no
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,162
  • Oh hell, what's one more bike?
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2009, 12:50:15 PM »
Lets take the Cb 750/K0 750 rims.. They may have been superseded, then you may be getting what Honda considers an OEM replacement part. That does not mean it is RESTORATION CORRECT.
If it is an OEM replacement it is not NOS.  NOS is an original factory rim that was never used. People pay a lot more for NOS than OEM replacement.
No matter how fast or how far I rode, I couldn't leave her memory behind.

Offline 754

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 29,058
Re: Do I Have a Beef?
« Reply #14 on: July 18, 2009, 01:27:43 PM »
If it is an OEM  (factory) replacement made in 1975 it would be NOS.

 if it was a 2nd or 3rd generation replacement part, then it would/could be considered NORS, and be an NOS part.

 Here is an example some 750 parts went thru a few revisions;
 300-010
 300-020
 399-040......... the last 2 part #s or one of them may be noted as superseded.

 so if a 69 750 was crashed in 72, It may have been repaired by a Honda shop, using all OEM parts, but not  always correct parts for that serial #.
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline Popwood

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 914
Re: Do I Have a Beef? (Update)
« Reply #15 on: July 20, 2009, 10:42:15 AM »
I contacted the seller (myersmotorcycles) this morning to say that while the product was fine and his service/shipping very good, I had to take issue with the NOS designation in the description. He replied quickly, apologized saying he didn't intend to mislead and is removing NOS from the description. He also agreed to take the rim back and pay freight in both directions if I was not satisfied.

Overall, I'm going chalk this up as "no harm, no foul" and would probably buy from him in the future.
Current Rides:
1975 cb550K
1975 cb750K
1967 Bridgestone 350GTR

Past Rides:
1988 400 Hawk
195? Schwinn Whizzer