Author Topic: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?  (Read 30632 times)

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Offline blackhog02

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #25 on: November 01, 2009, 04:27:08 PM »
All I know is that when I put a part on my hondas they stay put and rarely do I have to go back and re-tighten them.  On my Buell X1 I check for loose parts b/4 every ride and am constantly shaking parts loose.

Offline the technological J

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Offline mlinder

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Offline 754

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #28 on: November 01, 2009, 06:17:19 PM »
Ingo, if you had a average condition Yamaha Radian, KZ 750, Yamaha 750 triple, instead of a Honda four, and went to sell it... you would get a better understanding of the cost worth it...

 The 78 FL, would bring more of its  original purchase money back..

 Luckily we have very desireable Japanese models, they did not all hold their resale value well..

in fact ours did not either for a while, but they came back later on in their life..
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My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

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Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline Inigo Montoya

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #29 on: November 01, 2009, 06:19:56 PM »
I don't really care. I do not ride a bike to sell it. If I buy a bike, it is to keep it. The only reason I would sell is if my hand were forced to. So if you look at it that way, resale value means nothing. I mean, I don't know about you but I would rather say I do all the work instead of talk about all the money I could get for selling it.
But that is just me, maybe most of you ride to the next sale?

Offline jeepster

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #30 on: November 01, 2009, 06:40:21 PM »
All I know is that when I put a part on my hondas they stay put and rarely do I have to go back and re-tighten them.  On my Buell X1 I check for loose parts b/4 every ride and am constantly shaking parts loose.

I wonder if the constant shaking also stresses the engine and contributes to the breakdowns/oil leaks HD's are famous for...
"An ounce of prevention is worth more if you break it up into nickel bags."

Offline the technological J

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #31 on: November 01, 2009, 07:24:03 PM »
All I know is that when I put a part on my hondas they stay put and rarely do I have to go back and re-tighten them.  On my Buell X1 I check for loose parts b/4 every ride and am constantly shaking parts loose.

I wonder if the constant shaking also stresses the engine and contributes to the breakdowns/oil leaks HD's are famous for...
thats what they say about triumphs
70 KO...sold to fund the ST http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=88800.0(Alpha)
74 Kaw 250 Enduro http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=124278.0
K4 added to collection! http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=104784.0
78 750K... http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=60257.0 (Omega)sold to fund the K4
94 ST1100..Gone
72 750 K2 Stay tuned!

78750

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #32 on: November 01, 2009, 07:37:02 PM »
I've had 2 Harleys, an XL 883 and my current FLHTCU. I've also had 2 Hondas, a V65 Sabre and my current 78 750K. I've had far LESS trouble with both of my shaking V twin American bikes than I've had with the Hondas. That V65 Sabre was the BIGGEST piece of junk I've ever owned.  I like the 750 though, still like my Harley better. 

Offline MMICAFE

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #33 on: November 01, 2009, 07:42:35 PM »
literally if you listen to a harley it sounds like its going potato potato potato but the twin cam harleys are the twin cam 88 and the twin cam 88b b stands for ballanced it has ballanceing cranks in the motor that help the rubber mounting stop vibrations
1974 Honda CB450 super sport (sold sniff sniff) (my first bike)

1979 Honda CB650 (we have a love hate relationship)

2008 Honda metropolitan (sold kinda miss it for the gas mileage)

Offline Inigo Montoya

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #34 on: November 01, 2009, 08:23:37 PM »
The sabre may have been more trouble but it would go as fast in second as most harleys do at top speed! :D

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #35 on: November 01, 2009, 08:44:32 PM »
125+ mph in 2nd gear?! I don't think so.
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline johnyvilla

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #36 on: November 01, 2009, 09:41:11 PM »
It doesn't matter how smooth HD motors are. Most owners buy these bikes because they like how they look and sound. They remind me of Kenny Rodgers, "the Gambler" and dream catchers, but hey, to each his own. 

Offline jcarthel

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #37 on: November 01, 2009, 10:02:22 PM »
Man, my question got answered alright along with hearing some very passionate opinions! :)  There are a lot of Harleys on the road so they must build what a lot of people want.  Me, I love my K2 750!  In my opinion, it is the perfect sport/touring bike!  It is relatively light and nimble compared to most of the other heavy giants on the road.  It is very reliable and easy to maintain.  I love the smoothness of the motor, very enjoyable to me!  I like the fact that my K2 with a newly rebuilt motor will last 100k miles if I take care of it, and I also like its fuel economy.  This motor has plenty of punch, kinda reminds me of the way my buddy's '69 Dodge Charger R/T runs (440 Magnum engine).  Then there is the look of the bike.  I love it!  Two chrome fenders, simple design with no bulky fairings or luggage boxes, four exhaust pipes, a very good looking bike design (it looks like a motorcycle should and nobody mistakes it for a small car:)

Justin in Texas

Offline w1sa

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #38 on: November 01, 2009, 11:21:07 PM »
There is passion and there is precision. Sometimes the two exist in the same perception, on the same plane, at the same time. :)

Offline Peters1983

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #39 on: November 02, 2009, 03:55:28 AM »
My father has owned a 74 AMF superglide since 76(if you don't know AMF has the worst reputation of all) and it has had so many rebuilds it makes you wonder if it was worth all of the trouble. All I can say that if you have the passion make it your own and if you have the time a harley can be worth the blood sweat and tears put into it. His is one of the few harleys that I would own in a bit of a bias opinion, but he is a motorcycle enthusiast to say the least. His bike is as much a part of the family as anyone else.

On this journey he has worked for 2 licensed harley shops and the bike has transformed into a new beast each time. Is it temperamental? Hell yes but if you know what you are doing it seems to me that all of the time spent was well worth the knowledge gained and the reward later. Harleys have been making mechanics out of bikers for years hence the reputation but I can also say the same thing for my 77sohc, if it wasn't for our machines we would probably know nothing about how things work and that is the most valuable thing I have learned so far.

Sorry I got a bit off topic but the v twin harley fires on both cylenders at the same time causing a lot of the vibration and feel harley riders love so much.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2009, 04:01:06 AM by Peters1983 »
Chuck dont need oil. Engines run cause they are afraid of chuck! ;D

Offline kos

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #40 on: November 02, 2009, 04:22:29 AM »
I don't care if davidson sells more big bikes than Honda in US. The numbers for 2008 worldwide were as follows:

Hd sold 335,000 bikes TOTAL

Honda 12 Million.



get over it...davidson is a marketing company. 90% of the companies income comes from selling boots,  bra's, Christmas ornaments, and the rights to their name.  Ford /HD truck, Italian eye-wear companies, etc.
220...221, whatever it takes.

78750

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #41 on: November 02, 2009, 04:34:40 AM »
The sabre may have been more trouble but it would go as fast in second as most harleys do at top speed! :D

Uh, no.  The Sabre would do about 85 in second, the Harleys are faster than that.  But, you never felt safe on the Sabre, the Harleys were stable as buildings.

Offline Inigo Montoya

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #42 on: November 02, 2009, 06:42:56 AM »
First, most hd's top out at just under 100 in STOCK form RXman. Second, so I exagerated just a bit but still, when you can go almost as fast in second as a bike can at top speed in 5th, that says something. Of course I should have stated this was for somewhat older harleys as I think most now have a 6 speed tranny allowing them up to around 115-120 or so. So about as fast as our 30+ year old bikes.

As for the sabre never feeling stable, I guess maybe you didn't have good tires. I rode one once and it felt every bit as stable as my 77.

1985 Iron Butt Rally Finishers (24 riders started the rally):

Position/Name         Age  Home City           Motorcycle

 #1  George Egloff    44   New Jersey          Suzuki GS1150E
 #2  Gary Moore            South Carolina      Honda Gold Wing
 #3  Rob Eilertson                             Honda Gold Wing
 #4  Jim Newberry          California          Honda V65 Sabre
 #5  Suzie Mann            California          BMW K100RS
 #6  Richard Hoffman       Pennsylvania        Honda Gold Wing
 #7  Roy Eastwood     42   Canada              BMW R100S
 #8  Alan Pease       36   California          BMW
 #9  Jeff Janks                                Honda
#10  John "Stu" Moore                          Honda Gold Wing
#11  Dave Heinaur                              Honda
#12  Alan Greenwood        New Hampshire       Honda Gold Wing
#13  Joe Tracy             New York            Honda Gold Wing

Taken from this site: http://www.ironbutt.org/intro/ibrfacts.html
Not many harleys there and yet a sabre shows up. As the sabre was only made for something like 2-3 years, it is not a common bike. Yet here it is. Just food for thought.

Like I said, they are not junk, I just cannot see how the price is justified.

Offline paddy paul

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #43 on: November 02, 2009, 07:05:10 AM »
All I'm going to say on this subject is this I had a iron head sporty as the second bike I ever owned, I sold it after one summer of having it, because I literally  spent more time working on it to go riding than actually riding it, then I bought a cb 550 for 300 bucks, spent about 200 on a 650 cam, 750 carb set up, put some clubmans on it, and smoked every f**king Harley that wanted to race..... and all of the guys I worked and that are my friends ride them and I love them for there passion, but if you want performance and reliability from a motorcycle you go foreign,  period.....
« Last Edit: November 02, 2009, 07:25:32 AM by paddy paul »

Offline 754

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #44 on: November 02, 2009, 08:40:31 AM »
Kos, GM sells way more vehicles than Kenworth.. does  that mean much?

 . about the same as your example.. ;)
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
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Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline Magpie

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #45 on: November 02, 2009, 09:03:51 AM »
My 2007 Gl1800 Goldwing is made in the States and it seems to have reasonable performance and reliabilty.

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #46 on: November 02, 2009, 09:07:06 AM »
The Harley Sound
 
Harleys have a unique sound, a symphony to those who know the breed. The idle is an irregular, lumpy rumble; utterly unmistakable. And it all comes about because of an engine design that no modern engineer would use on a bet. But we love 'em, and wouldn't have it any other way.

Before you can follow this explanation, you must understand a couple things. First of all, if you don't understand about the four cycles of power generation (suck, squeeze, bang, and blow), you probably won't be able to follow this explanation.

Then there are a few more things about the design of the engine you should understand, and a couple of terms.

The angle of the V of the cylinders is 45 degrees.

The crank rotates counterclockwise when viewed from the left side.
 
"TDC" means Top Dead Center, that is, the piston is as high as it can go, and is about to start down. A piston is at TDC twice in each power cycle, once on the compression stroke (at which point a spark fires the fuel,) and once on the exhaust stroke, when it is blowing out the burned gas.

"BDC" means Bottom Dead Center.

While most engines have a crankpin for each piston, a Harley as only one crankpin, shared by both pistons. That means the pistons go up and down ALMOST together. Because of the V shape of the engine, one piston will run ahead of the other by the angle of the V, or 45 degrees. In this case, the rear one leads the front by 45 degrees of crankshaft rotation, or about 1/2 inch of travel in the cylinder.

OK - let's walk through a firing sequence, beginning with ignition in the front cylinder.

The front cylinder fires, pushing the piston down on a power stroke, spinning the crank. The rear piston is already 45 degrees down its bore on an intake stroke, being pulled by the crank, sucking in a load of fuel. Make sure you can mentally visualize this or you're gonna get lost.
 For the sake of simplicity of explanation, I am saying that the spark fires the fuel mix at TDC. In fact, it fires it before TDC by up to 50 degrees of crank rotation, depending on the engine and the rpm level. This is "timing." There is an article to explain timing in this section. Also, valves actually open and close before and after TDC and BDC. 
 
When the front piston reaches bottom dead center on its power stroke the rear piston is 45 degrees up on its compression (squeeze) stroke, pushing the fuel it pulled in up into a shrinking chamber. In other words, it's getting ready to fire, right?

The front piston, having delivered its power, is now starting up on its exhaust (blow) stroke.
 At this time there is no power stroke going on in either cylinder. The engine is being turned over by the intertia of the spinning flywheel. 
 
The rear piston arrives at its firing point on the compression stroke and a spark fires in the rear cylinder, 315 degrees (360 degrees - 45 degrees in the V) after the front did. That puts the rear cylinder into its power stroke, and the front is on its intake (suck) stroke, being pulled down by the crank.

The front cylinder goes down on intake, then back up on compression, then fires 405 degrees (360 + 45) after the rear cylinder did.

So here's the firing order.

Front Bang, rotate 315 degrees - Rear Bang, rotate 405 degrees - Front Bang, rotate 315 degrees, - Rear Bang, etc.

So there it is. The engine sounds like it does because the firing order is irregular, it kind of lopes along, as it has since 1903. And probably will until the next century, if the traditionalists have their way. I hope so. 

Source:  http://www.wildwestcycle.com/f_firing.html


Offline MRieck

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #47 on: November 02, 2009, 09:46:46 AM »
I've had 2 Harleys, an XL 883 and my current FLHTCU. I've also had 2 Hondas, a V65 Sabre and my current 78 750K. I've had far LESS trouble with both of my shaking V twin American bikes than I've had with the Hondas. That V65 Sabre was the BIGGEST piece of junk I've ever owned.  I like the 750 though, still like my Harley better. 
I have to agree with that. They are the biggest POS to work on...
Owner of the "Million Dollar CB"

Offline 754

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #48 on: November 02, 2009, 10:36:57 AM »
Mike, I dont like the look either.. sorta scrunched up..

 It nice to have brand loyalty, but blinders are still optional...

 I was in a few Honda dealerships this year, the one in Salt Lake City truly had lots of bikes.. some of the others.. looks like they  watched the marketing experts  (or domestic cycle manufacturers) and were heavy on clothing & accessory stuff..

 Seems a few Honda dealers also carry Victory...

 I dont mind good natured ribbing between brands and really enjoy this discussion.. but some posters are quite biased, and not open minded..

 Bikes, not only about technology, it still about about the feel of riding them...
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline BobbyR

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Re: SOHC'S ARE SMOOTH, BUT WHY DO THE HARLEYS SHAKE SO MUCH?
« Reply #49 on: November 02, 2009, 10:59:54 AM »
(suck, squeeze, bang, and blow)
Reminds me of a girl I knew in College. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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