Topic: Did I get taken for a wheel truing?

[Dave-and-his-550]

I went to my local Honda service shop to have them true a wheel for me after I spoked it. I also wanted them to mount a tire as well. The shop opened Saturday at 8:30 and I received a call at 9 a.m about what side the speedo cable mounted so the guy knew how to mount the tire.

I then got a call at 9:31 a.m telling me the wheel was done. I went to pick it up. The time they had down for labor was 66 and 27 I assume 66 for rim truing and 27 for mounting the tire. The total was $95 + parts (rim strip) and tax which equaled $104.86

The problem is...How could that be when they opened at 8:30 am and I got the call it was done at 9:30 a.m If the time invested was 93 minutes?! Thats only an hour!

And that is assuming the guy got right on it at 8:30 when they opened which I doubt...

I say it is malarkey and I got over charged intentionally. Any thoughts? Anything I can do to dispute this after I payed it?

[bucky katt]

most shops charge by the job hour. there is a book that shows the amount of time a job should take. for example (just making up time for the answer) doing a valve adjustment on a 2005 BMW r1200gs in the book it says it should take 2.5 hours, whether it takes the technician 20 minutes or 10 hours, the customer pays the 2.5 hours at the shops hourly rate.

[ev0lve]

The total was $95 + parts (rim strip) and tax which equaled $104.86

I say it is malarkey and I got over charged intentionally. Any thoughts? Anything I can do to dispute this after I payed it?

That's not out of line I think. Mine were about $80 a piece to true, mount and balance on freshly laced rims. Yours may have been pretty true to begin with thus not taking to long.

The question I'm not sure I want to know the answer to is whether they're actually trued to 1mm or less in all directions. Only way to know is get a dial gauge and find out.

[tramp]

time wise it sounds like ya got ripped

[DaytonGuy]

I called my local Honda shop and they quoted me $75.00 to true both front and back wheel total.  There was no tire mounting involved.  I thought it was a fair price....

[Gordon]

Did you get the shop to quote you a price when you dropped off the wheels? 

[Ogri]

I'd ask them how much do they charge for 1 hour's labor and whether they 'round up' labor times.

With that info you'll be able to work out if you got hosed or not. If you did, then first call the shop manager and explain the situation.

Make a note of everything he says.

If they give you any crap contact the Honda Area Manager for your region.

Have you checked that the wheel is true, or did you just take their word for it ?

[333]

Seems to me that if you know enough to lace it, you should be able to true it and save the money.

[ev0lve]

Seems to me that if you know enough to lace it, you should be able to true it and save the money.

You'd think. Folks say it's easy but I wasn't able to get it down to 1mm all the way around.

[Dave-and-his-550]

time wise it sounds like ya got ripped

Exactly, it was all done in under an hour. But I got charged 93 minutes for labor?! But, like bucky katt said, they might charge a going rate based from the books...

Did you get the shop to quote you a price when you dropped off the wheels? 

Nope, I should have though. I think the price is reasonable, I just don't like how the labor times written down dont add up to the actual time worked.

I'd ask them how much do they charge for 1 hour's labor and whether they 'round up' labor times.

With that info you'll be able to work out if you got hosed or not. If you did, then first call the shop manager and explain the situation.

Make a note of everything he says.

If they give you any crap contact the Honda Area Manager for your region.

Have you checked that the wheel is true, or did you just take their word for it ?

Thanks for this info, I'll look into contacting an area manager if I need to. No, I haven't checked the wheel yet. I should have when I was there, maybe have them show me it was true but they did not seem like very happy people lol...and it was almost closing time.

Seems to me that if you know enough to lace it, you should be able to true it and save the money.

I want to give this a try now. I bet I could have bought a jig for what I got charged.

I will call them on Tuesday when they're open again, and inquire about the labor times again and ask if they charge a base 1 hour minimum for something or whatever.

I also (Duh!) left some spoke nipples with their service department and I HAVE to get them back for the rear tire. I can't believe I forgot them 

Thanks for all the insight. You guys and this forum are invaluable 

[ev0lve]

I want to give this a try now. I bet I could have bought a jig for what I got charged.

It's worth giving it a shot - all you need is a stand, spoke wrench and a dial gauge. The rest is all about finesse.

My only word of advice is to not keep tightening everything up as you go trying to get it into round. Sometimes you want to loosen here, tighten there. It's not rocket science but requires the feel. I didn't have it and ended up fubaring my rear rim (cracked holes). In the end I spent a good long time at it and never got the damn thing under 2mm on the hop - wobble was easier - and it was a relief to just pay someone to get it right. It's definitely a learned skill and more than a little natural talent I think.

Good luck!

[Uncle Ernie]

Sounds cheaper than Buchana's, actually, but I had a tough case, too.

[bucky katt]

i built my own truing stand. no actual money paid out because i had all the scrap wood and screws i needed

[NickC]

You were charged by the book, not by true hours worked. This is the way most mechanics work. It's a common thing, and I wouldn't be upset about it. The mechanic is likely paid the same way, by the book rate, not hours worked. That way, it benefits him to bust ass and get jobs done quicker than the book says.

[fishhead]

If you can't play the fiddle, you'll need to pay the fiddler.

  The local stealership cost about 2x what you paid to true a wheel and it is why I true my own.

[754]

You can get by without all that stuff..
 Bare minimum, use your forks or swingarm, and a pen/pointer fastened to fork or swingaem...but you should use a good wrench.

 Approach it logically and THINK, if it has hop, you must release one side and tighten the other, same with side to side.. That and proper tension in the end is the whole deal in a nutshell... (provided spokes are correctly placed and proper length.

 I have a problem with a dial indicator when in the hands of a newbie on wheels.. You are never gonna get it real close, and you do not need an instrument that reads in thousands of an inch to acheive 1/32 to 1mm runout.. 32 to 40 thou.. a lot of rims wont get much better than 20, and 30 would be fine..

[MCRider]

You can get by without all that stuff..
 Bare minimum, use your forks or swingarm, and a pen/pointer fastened to fork or swingaem...but you should use a good wrench.

 Approach it logically and THINK, if it has hop, you must release one side and tighten the other, same with side to side.. That and proper tension in the end is the whole deal in a nutshell... (provided spokes are correctly placed and proper length.

 I have a problem with a dial indicator when in the hands of a newbie on wheels.. You are never gonna get it real close, and you do not need an instrument that reads in thousands of an inch to acheive 1/32 to 1mm runout.. 32 to 40 thou.. a lot of rims wont get much better than 20, and 30 would be fine..

Yup all true. (pun)

Additionally, sometimes a steel rim will have a bump in it right at the weld and there is nothing you'll ever be able to do about that. True the rest and ride it.

[eshumaker]

I read somewhere that when you re-spoke a rim and get it trued, you should check the hop after a few hundred miles, as the rim "gives" under the pressure. Does this sound right?

I am asking because my CB750 build is nearing the assembly stage, and I have some spokes to replace. If you should check the balance after a few hundred, then I will probably do the initial true myself, then have a shop do it later, otherwise I will have them do it once.

Thanks!

[MCRider]

I read somewhere that when you re-spoke a rim and get it trued, you should check the hop after a few hundred miles, as the rim "gives" under the pressure. Does this sound right?

I am asking because my CB750 build is nearing the assembly stage, and I have some spokes to replace. If you should check the balance after a few hundred, then I will probably do the initial true myself, then have a shop do it later, otherwise I will have them do it once.

Thanks!

More true with an aluminum rim than a steel one. But if you're using oversize spokes and a modern alum rim (which is pretty beefy in the spoke areas) I doubt you'll notice anything loosening up after the initial build with alum either. Assuming everything was tight at that time.

Its mostly a CYA practice. can't fault it, but likely not necessary, in my experience. If you have a shop do it, I'll bet they won't mention bringing it back in unless you bring it up. Then of course they'll say, yes bring it back in.  Or they'll just say keep an eye on it and bring it back if necessary.

[Dave-and-his-550]

I also (Duh!) left some spoke nipples with their service department and I HAVE to get them back for the rear tire. I can't believe I forgot them

Just called them. They said they used ALL the spares I gave them, and that they threw away all the bad ones... They said I can go there and dig through the trash for them if I liked... 

[MCRider]

I also (Duh!) left some spoke nipples with their service department and I HAVE to get them back for the rear tire. I can't believe I forgot them

Just called them. They said they used ALL the spares I gave them, and that they threw away all the bad ones... They said I can go there and dig through the trash for them if I liked... 

If they are stock nipples, I'm sure we can set you up with more.

[Dave-and-his-550]

Very kind of you. I got the spokes and nipples from buchanan's both are stainless steel. I called them and they said they would replace the bad ones for me. IF I can find them all to send back.

I gave the guys who worked on my rim a small bag of about 15 or so, sp that's about how many I'll need. I'm going to go there anyway and look for them. If I can't find enough, I'll let ya know. But, hopefully Buchanan will be nice enough to replace the few missing ones...Hopefully.

[tortelvis]

You were charged by the book, not by true hours worked. This is the way most mechanics work. It's a common thing, and I wouldn't be upset about it. The mechanic is likely paid the same way, by the book rate, not hours worked. That way, it benefits him to bust ass and get jobs done quicker than the book says.

100% correct but...do you want your mechanic rushing the job to make more money? Never mind what the displayed labor rate is, the mechanic gets a fraction of that.

[thrownchain]

After reading this thread and giving it some thought, ya did OK. For truing the wheel and mounting the tire, $100 isn't way out of the park, actually very reasonable. On as others have said, some wheels you can never get perfect for any number of reasons, biggest being a "flatspot" where the rim ends are welded together, some are worse than others. Try it sometime if you've got the patients.

[BobbyR]

Just to mount a tire on the front wheel they want $100 over here.