Topic: Like Folks To Acknowledge Their Military Branch And Such, If You Don't Mind

[hopterfixer]

Have you guys seen the second book Bob Mason wrote, "Chickenhawk, Back in the World"?
http://www.robertcmason.com/Books/chbitw.html  It picks up where the first one left off explaining everything including the entire story of how he ended up in prison.  Both books are very good reading.  

On the topic, a guy named Matthew Brennan wrote a book
http://www.amazon.com/Brennans-War-1965-1969-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671624997/ref=pd_sim_b_2 about his experiences as a Blue in the 1st of the 9th Cav.  Later he wrote two more books detailing the personal accounts of the guys in his unit that sent their stories to him after his first book was published
http://www.amazon.com/Headhunters-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671660136/ref=pd_sim_b_5 and
http://www.amazon.com/Hunter-Killer-Squadron-Aero-Weapons-Aero-Scouts-Aero-Rifles/dp/0891413944/ref=pd_sim_b_2    All very good reading.  I have read 25 or so books mostly on helicopter operations in Vietnam over the past year and a half or so, there are a lot of good stories out there.  

Personally, USMC 1997-2002
CH-46E Crewchief/Mechanic (97-99)
MV-22B Crewchief/Mechanic (99-02), and worked for Bell after I got out for another 2 years on it.

 

[BobbyR]

Have you guys seen the second book Bob Mason wrote, "Chickenhawk, Back in the World"?
http://www.robertcmason.com/Books/chbitw.html  It picks up where the first one left off explaining everything including the entire story of how he ended up in prison.  Both books are very good reading.  

On the topic, a guy named Matthew Brennan wrote a book
http://www.amazon.com/Brennans-War-1965-1969-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671624997/ref=pd_sim_b_2 about his experiences as a Blue in the 1st of the 9th Cav.  Later he wrote two more books detailing the personal accounts of the guys in his unit that sent their stories to him after his first book was published
http://www.amazon.com/Headhunters-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671660136/ref=pd_sim_b_5 and
http://www.amazon.com/Hunter-Killer-Squadron-Aero-Weapons-Aero-Scouts-Aero-Rifles/dp/0891413944/ref=pd_sim_b_2    All very good reading.  I have read 25 or so books mostly on helicopter operations in Vietnam over the past year and a half or so, there are a lot of good stories out there.  

Personally, USMC 1997-2002
CH-46E Crewchief/Mechanic (97-99)
MV-22B Crewchief/Mechanic (99-02), and worked for Bell after I got out for another 2 years on it.

 

You can read the book here for free:

http://books.google.com/books?id=DkxkyfBwhPEC&pg=PA50&lpg=PA50&dq=Matthew+Brennan+Helicopter&source=bl&ots=2lB-DU-TAM&sig=VF6l0Kg2oKISmGJ0ssRGsSeG3sU&hl=en&ei=z7wAS4qPOZHknAevj_2aCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CAgQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=&f=false

[hopterfixer]

....parts of it anyway.  I have found all of the ones I've read at used book stores in the area.

[cb750k7]

Have you guys seen the second book Bob Mason wrote, "Chickenhawk, Back in the World"?
http://www.robertcmason.com/Books/chbitw.html  It picks up where the first one left off explaining everything including the entire story of how he ended up in prison.  Both books are very good reading. 

On the topic, a guy named Matthew Brennan wrote a book
http://www.amazon.com/Brennans-War-1965-1969-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671624997/ref=pd_sim_b_2 about his experiences as a Blue in the 1st of the 9th Cav.  Later he wrote two more books detailing the personal accounts of the guys in his unit that sent their stories to him after his first book was published
http://www.amazon.com/Headhunters-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671660136/ref=pd_sim_b_5 and
http://www.amazon.com/Hunter-Killer-Squadron-Aero-Weapons-Aero-Scouts-Aero-Rifles/dp/0891413944/ref=pd_sim_b_2    All very good reading.  I have read 25 or so books mostly on helicopter operations in Vietnam over the past year and a half or so, there are a lot of good stories out there. 

Personally, USMC 1997-2002
CH-46E Crewchief/Mechanic (97-99)
MV-22B Crewchief/Mechanic (99-02), and worked for Bell after I got out for another 2 years on it.

 

I have it as well the book that Mason's wife wrote about their ordeals.

[mrbreeze]

US Navy 1974-76.....was ships company on the USS Ranger CVA-61 (aircraft carrier).Got out of the Navy early on a medical hardship.(appendisitis)(sp?)

[nokrome]

Have you guys seen the second book Bob Mason wrote, "Chickenhawk, Back in the World"?
http://www.robertcmason.com/Books/chbitw.html  It picks up where the first one left off explaining everything including the entire story of how he ended up in prison.  Both books are very good reading. 

On the topic, a guy named Matthew Brennan wrote a book
http://www.amazon.com/Brennans-War-1965-1969-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671624997/ref=pd_sim_b_2 about his experiences as a Blue in the 1st of the 9th Cav.  Later he wrote two more books detailing the personal accounts of the guys in his unit that sent their stories to him after his first book was published
http://www.amazon.com/Headhunters-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671660136/ref=pd_sim_b_5 and
http://www.amazon.com/Hunter-Killer-Squadron-Aero-Weapons-Aero-Scouts-Aero-Rifles/dp/0891413944/ref=pd_sim_b_2    All very good reading.  I have read 25 or so books mostly on helicopter operations in Vietnam over the past year and a half or so, there are a lot of good stories out there. 

Personally, USMC 1997-2002
CH-46E Crewchief/Mechanic (97-99)
MV-22B Crewchief/Mechanic (99-02), and worked for Bell after I got out for another 2 years on it.

 

       which 46 units were you with?   i was in 161 out of tustin (before it closed), 265 in okinawa, and 166 in el toro when i got back to the states, got out in 98, maybe we crossed pathes

[hopterfixer]

Have you guys seen the second book Bob Mason wrote, "Chickenhawk, Back in the World"?
http://www.robertcmason.com/Books/chbitw.html  It picks up where the first one left off explaining everything including the entire story of how he ended up in prison.  Both books are very good reading. 

On the topic, a guy named Matthew Brennan wrote a book
http://www.amazon.com/Brennans-War-1965-1969-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671624997/ref=pd_sim_b_2 about his experiences as a Blue in the 1st of the 9th Cav.  Later he wrote two more books detailing the personal accounts of the guys in his unit that sent their stories to him after his first book was published
http://www.amazon.com/Headhunters-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671660136/ref=pd_sim_b_5 and
http://www.amazon.com/Hunter-Killer-Squadron-Aero-Weapons-Aero-Scouts-Aero-Rifles/dp/0891413944/ref=pd_sim_b_2    All very good reading.  I have read 25 or so books mostly on helicopter operations in Vietnam over the past year and a half or so, there are a lot of good stories out there. 

Personally, USMC 1997-2002
CH-46E Crewchief/Mechanic (97-99)
MV-22B Crewchief/Mechanic (99-02), and worked for Bell after I got out for another 2 years on it.

 

       which 46 units were you with?   i was in 161 out of tustin (before it closed), 265 in okinawa, and 166 in el toro when i got back to the states, got out in 98, maybe we crossed pathes

I was in 265 July 98-July 99, Then VMMT-204 until I got out.  204 made the switch to V-22's right before I got there.
Small world.

[nokrome]

looks like i missed you in oki by about a year
                                                      cheers

[BobbyR]

Have you guys seen the second book Bob Mason wrote, "Chickenhawk, Back in the World"?
http://www.robertcmason.com/Books/chbitw.html  It picks up where the first one left off explaining everything including the entire story of how he ended up in prison.  Both books are very good reading.  

On the topic, a guy named Matthew Brennan wrote a book
http://www.amazon.com/Brennans-War-1965-1969-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671624997/ref=pd_sim_b_2 about his experiences as a Blue in the 1st of the 9th Cav.  Later he wrote two more books detailing the personal accounts of the guys in his unit that sent their stories to him after his first book was published
http://www.amazon.com/Headhunters-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671660136/ref=pd_sim_b_5 and
http://www.amazon.com/Hunter-Killer-Squadron-Aero-Weapons-Aero-Scouts-Aero-Rifles/dp/0891413944/ref=pd_sim_b_2    All very good reading.  I have read 25 or so books mostly on helicopter operations in Vietnam over the past year and a half or so, there are a lot of good stories out there.  

Personally, USMC 1997-2002
CH-46E Crewchief/Mechanic (97-99)
MV-22B Crewchief/Mechanic (99-02), and worked for Bell after I got out for another 2 years on it.

 

I used to wonder why people would read books on Vietnam, since it is slowly becoming acient history. I was doing some checking on the books you mentioned.

In a majority of the cases it would seem the Huey was is used as a symbol of that war. In WWI people were fascinated with the Airplane and the people who flew them. In WWII it was the fighters, Subs and Tanks which were fairly new.

In Vietnam the chopper took center stage. The Huey was a throw back to WWI the fighters were fast and the bombers were huge and flew high. The chopper was more like the biplane, it was slow and flew low. The effective range of the weapons was very limited, so any engagement was up close and personal. The people who drove them were considered colorful. In reality not as colorful as you would imagine.

The Whuuump Whuuump of the twin rotors was I guess the Harley sound of aircraft.

The chopper did change modern warfare, it increased attack mobility, could evac wounded much faster. I doubt the new Drones will have that sexiness.

[Bob Wessner]

The Huey has a very distinctive sound. To this day, when a civilian version of one is in the air near me, I can tell without looking. Some things you never forget.

[bill440cars]

The Huey has a very distinctive sound. To this day, when a civilian version of one is in the air near me, I can tell without looking. Some things you never forget.

       I hear that! One might think that the Jets are all the same , but there is a distinctive sound to some, like the F104 and the F4 for sure. The Arkansas Air Guard used to have F16s and now have A10s and there is NO comparison in the sound of the two planes. Not to distract from the conversation about the Huey either! Used to have the Huey's and Chinooks flying over us around here, but haven't for some time now.

[nokrome]

btw, there is a really good series on the history channel this week called WWII in HD, mostly color footage, very interesting, check it out!

[Slayer]

By far the best documentary I have ever seen. The film restoration blows me away. I love the history channel!

[hopterfixer]

Have you guys seen the second book Bob Mason wrote, "Chickenhawk, Back in the World"?
http://www.robertcmason.com/Books/chbitw.html  It picks up where the first one left off explaining everything including the entire story of how he ended up in prison.  Both books are very good reading.  

On the topic, a guy named Matthew Brennan wrote a book
http://www.amazon.com/Brennans-War-1965-1969-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671624997/ref=pd_sim_b_2 about his experiences as a Blue in the 1st of the 9th Cav.  Later he wrote two more books detailing the personal accounts of the guys in his unit that sent their stories to him after his first book was published
http://www.amazon.com/Headhunters-Matthew-Brennan/dp/0671660136/ref=pd_sim_b_5 and
http://www.amazon.com/Hunter-Killer-Squadron-Aero-Weapons-Aero-Scouts-Aero-Rifles/dp/0891413944/ref=pd_sim_b_2    All very good reading.  I have read 25 or so books mostly on helicopter operations in Vietnam over the past year and a half or so, there are a lot of good stories out there.  

Personally, USMC 1997-2002
CH-46E Crewchief/Mechanic (97-99)
MV-22B Crewchief/Mechanic (99-02), and worked for Bell after I got out for another 2 years on it.

 

I used to wonder why people would read books on Vietnam, since it is slowly becoming acient history. I was doing some checking on the books you mentioned.

In a majority of the cases it would seem the Huey was is used as a symbol of that war. In WWI people were fascinated with the Airplane and the people who flew them. In WWII it was the fighters, Subs and Tanks which were fairly new.

In Vietnam the chopper took center stage. The Huey was a throw back to WWI the fighters were fast and the bombers were huge and flew high. The chopper was more like the biplane, it was slow and flew low. The effective range of the weapons was very limited, so any engagement was up close and personal. The people who drove them were considered colorful. In reality not as colorful as you would imagine.

The Whuuump Whuuump of the twin rotors was I guess the Harley sound of aircraft.

The chopper did change modern warfare, it increased attack mobility, could evac wounded much faster. I doubt the new Drones will have that sexiness.

I am a helicopter nut and Vietnam was the helicopter war.  I am also in to first person accounts of events, and from that war there are many stories to share.  One of my co-workers flew scouts in B troop 1/9th Cav, being a Marine I knew little of Army aviation before speaking with him.  After hearing some of his exploits I started to look for books the scout pilots had written.  I read two in the past week, Aeroscouts by Charles Holley, and Easy Target by Tom Smith, both scout pilots and two more good stories.   I am always on the hunt for more.

[BobbyR]

The scout drivers were under rated. They are amazingly brave and extraordinary pilots. They were the first in and they drew fire first and they stayed in the hot zone the longest. They to identify and call targets, make evasive spins and avoid A holes like me all at once. Considering the number of spins and turns they would do I cannot see how they did not become disoriented. I guess without the whuump whuump whuump they got very little press coverage at the time.

[medic09]

Do you all mean the Forward Air Controllers who flew planes like the OV-10?

Edit:  Answered my own question; you all are referring to aircraft like the OH-6 Loach helicopters.

[BobbyR]

No they were just mostly modified Bells

[medic09]

Thanks, Bobby.  We posted close together.

You all might appreciate the narratives here, at the Vietnam Helicopter Pilots Assoc. :

http://www.vhpa.org/stories/stories.html

[BobbyR]

Thanks, Bobby.  We posted close together.

You all might appreciate the narratives here, at the Vietnam Helicopter Pilots Assoc. :

http://www.vhpa.org/stories/stories.html

This about sums it all up from that site:

Yes, now I was invincible. I had a new flight jacket, shiny new wings, and my badge of
courage Cobra patch. To quote Dan Grossman of the 48th Blue Stars, “little did I know
that for better or for worse, for all the fun times, for all my personal ups and downs, I
never expected to have had some of the best times of my life intermixed with many of the
worst nightmares of that life.”

[medic09]

I suspect those words, with a change here or there, fit many a soldier in combat units.

I would later often tell my students, "We were too young and stupid to know that we couldn't do what we were doing.  So we did it.  And they were the most noble moments of our lives."

[hopterfixer]

The common thread with all of the stories that I have read is that those pilots all had a hard time finding something to give them the same rush or "fix" that that flying and shooting (and being shot at) gave them.  The scouts flew just a few feet off of the ground and their job was to draw the fire, giving the position of the bad guys away so the grunts could come in an clean up.  Having done all of my flying in more modern times, the stories of flying down roads full speed and having to climb to pass mopeds really gets my blood pumping.   

[Bob Wessner]

No they were just mostly modified Bells

Ah, remember these as well. They reminded me of giant bumble bees. Boy, were they maneuverable!

[SanDogDewey]

U.S. Navy 1982 - 2004

F-14 Tomcat Avionics Technician '83 - '97
Aviation Maintenance Officer '98 - '04

Retired CWO3

[BobbyR]

The common thread with all of the stories that I have read is that those pilots all had a hard time finding something to give them the same rush or "fix" that that flying and shooting (and being shot at) gave them. 

Once you have been conditioned to a way of living, it is diffacult to go back. You have been changed in many ways. It cannot be switched on and off. There is a line you cross and that cannot be undone.

I am not sure I would recommend it to anyone. I have done evrything I can to prevent my son from going down that road. This is not to diminish what others have done and are doing.

I saw a shrink 25 years ago and one of the things he pointed out was my going back to riding a bike was a substitution.

You need hyper awareness at all times to survive in a hostile and deadly environment..

You controlled the machine with your arms and legs, and your body and the machine had to act as one.

You banked sharply on turns, and you were constanly correcting for wind and other conditions.

When you pulled into the Garage and shut down, you had beat the odds and accomplished the mission. 

[medic09]

Once you have been conditioned to a way of living, it is diffacult to go back. You have been changed in many ways. It cannot be switched on and off. There is a line you cross and that cannot be undone.

I'm sure all of us agree.  I wonder if this is an insight into the sad consequences of even the noblest war.

I also wonder if it makes any difference what role the military plays in a society, and how accepted it is?  I used to think that in Israel we had fewer problems because we had universal draft and fight a war of existence.  That, compared to Vietnam vets who didn't wear their uniforms on American streets because they were villified by many.  And for some of us in Israel, myself certainly, we are living out an almost mythological historic return and odyssey.  Now, I sometimes wonder if we weren't just in denial about things like PTSD (I'm convinced every combat vet has at least a little tinge of it somewhere), and just not recognizing the effects on individuals and the society they make up.

Dunno.