Poll

Which model would make the best cafe and why?

CB400F
9 (9.9%)
CB500/550K
45 (49.5%)
CB750K
30 (33%)
CB350
3 (3.3%)
CB650
4 (4.4%)

Total Members Voted: 60

Author Topic: Best Cafe Racer candidate?  (Read 15785 times)

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Offline cmorgan47

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #50 on: August 22, 2006, 11:00:56 AM »
i went with 400, cause mines shaping up to be a pretty nice little cafe.....
light and a 6 speed, throw it through the corners.

for a "cafe racer" though, in my mind, it has to be <=600cc. 
small and light. 
maybe the 650, but not the 750. 
i love babies...
with a nice chianti sauce and a side of fava beans

Offline GroovieGhoulie

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #51 on: August 22, 2006, 01:55:18 PM »
I still say go with the 650. IMO you can get good horsepower with less work than would be needed to increase power in the 750. Finding parts, on the other hand..........

No kicker is a dealbreaker for me.

Offline StevieMac

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #52 on: August 22, 2006, 02:18:29 PM »
No kicker is a dealbreaker for me.

Me too.  That's why I voted 500/550.  Actually I'd go with a 550 given the choice for the upgraded clutch and transmission. 
For me personally I prefer the lighter weight of the 500/550 for that type of use over the 750.
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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #53 on: August 22, 2006, 02:45:00 PM »
If you're an American and you have to drag out a British magazine to back up your argument, then I don't really need to state the obvious, you only have to look at some of Britain's automotive disasters to know that the average Briton's tasts buds are firmly planted in their collective asses, ha ha! Now where did I leave my flak jacket? Cheers, Terry. ;D

I would rise to the bait, but of course being of English extraction I am also a gentleman, and that would be beneath my dignity!

Seriously though, you are absolutely right about British automotive disasters, and motorcycling ones too. However I think we could point our fingers at pretty much any car/bike manufacturing company in the world and say that they had at least one dud. Suzuki RE-5 anyone? Ford Edsel? That of  course does not mean that they had their taste buds in their collective asses, as you so delicately put it, just that they produced models that were inappropriate for their time, or just plain ugly, or perhaps not as mechanically well thought out as they should have been.

My 44 cents worth. (4 cents + inflation.)

That's very true mate, being an Aussie and considering our ties, (The Empire, before the sun finally set on it) I spent most of my free time during my childhood in the 1960's being both horrified and fascinated by "British engineering". We had mostly "Pommy" bikes here in Oz, BSA's, Triumphs, and Nortons, not to mention Ariels, Royal Enfields, Velo's, etc. I won't even bother to mention English cars, but suffice to say that even now, English cars are avoided here like a 2 dollar hooker with a runny nose.

I can truthfully say that the only decently engineered British bike that was as reliable as it was fast and was actually quite beautiful, was the Vincent, and not just because it was designed by an Aussie either. (Phil Irving) By then the company hadn't existed for many years, more's the pity. The people here who would argue otherwise, just don't know what they're talking about.

My reason for this reminiscing of course is to illustrate why Britain so embraced Japanese bikes while their own outdated industry crumbled around them, with little effort from the british people to save it, the Jap bikes were simply better. No oil leaks, dodgy electrics, parts vibrating off, rapidly wearing out or just breaking due to poor metallurgy.

The British love for "mid sized" bikes as we refer to them now goes back to the day when the Beeza 500 was a "big" bike, and most "big" bikes were 500's. That, is why British mags (and only British mags) rave about the smaller bikes, it's just part of their culture. Here in Oz, and certainly in the US, we like our bikes and cars BIG, and that is why Honda built 500,000 750's and only about the same amount of "sub 750's" over that time.

From someone who was there, I can tell you first hand (without reading any british mags) that the 750 was THE best custom candidate, whether it was in racer or chopper guise. Wanna know why? Take a look at the engine guys, it is still THE best looking Jap motorcycle engine of the era. Sure, the Kawasaki Z1 looks great in race bikes, but the most versatile engine of the 1970's was the magnificent CB750.

I'm not saying don't "cafe" the smaller bikes, but don't then compare them to their brilliant big brother,the worlds first "Superbike" because really, there is no comparison, and it's too late to re-write history. Cheers, Terry. ;D
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Offline nickjtc

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #54 on: August 22, 2006, 04:36:01 PM »
That's very true mate, being an Aussie and considering our ties, (The Empire, before the sun finally set on it) I spent most of my free time during my childhood in the 1960's being both horrified and fascinated by "British engineering". We had mostly "Pommy" bikes here in Oz, BSA's, Triumphs, and Nortons, not to mention Ariels, Royal Enfields, Velo's, etc. I won't even bother to mention English cars, but suffice to say that even now, English cars are avoided here like a 2 dollar hooker with a runny nose.

I can truthfully say that the only decently engineered British bike that was as reliable as it was fast and was actually quite beautiful, was the Vincent, and not just because it was designed by an Aussie either. (Phil Irving) By then the company hadn't existed for many years, more's the pity. The people here who would argue otherwise, just don't know what they're talking about.

My reason for this reminiscing of course is to illustrate why Britain so embraced Japanese bikes while their own outdated industry crumbled around them, with little effort from the british people to save it, the Jap bikes were simply better. No oil leaks, dodgy electrics, parts vibrating off, rapidly wearing out or just breaking due to poor metallurgy.

The British love for "mid sized" bikes as we refer to them now goes back to the day when the Beeza 500 was a "big" bike, and most "big" bikes were 500's. That, is why British mags (and only British mags) rave about the smaller bikes, it's just part of their culture. Here in Oz, and certainly in the US, we like our bikes and cars BIG, and that is why Honda built 500,000 750's and only about the same amount of "sub 750's" over that time.

From someone who was there, I can tell you first hand (without reading any british mags) that the 750 was THE best custom candidate, whether it was in racer or chopper guise. Wanna know why? Take a look at the engine guys, it is still THE best looking Jap motorcycle engine of the era. Sure, the Kawasaki Z1 looks great in race bikes, but the most versatile engine of the 1970's was the magnificent CB750.

That's very erudite, Terry. You are 110% right about the 750 engine. Sex on wheels.

And right to a certain extent about the demise of the British motorcycle industry. Let's face it, the best on offer at the time to those of us who wanted to fly the flag was the Triumph Trident. You cannot blame the punters for not buying British with what was on offer. It was more a case that the industry big wigs didn't move ahead with the times. To think that the first Trident prototype was built in 1965 but shelved because Edward Turner couldn't see the future in it. Every single Bonneville they made was sold pretty well straight away, so why change?

I love my Norton, but when you compare the technology to the  sohc 750, both being built at the same time,well, there is no comparison. The Norton has bolts that use Victorian threads!!
« Last Edit: August 22, 2006, 04:57:10 PM by nickjtc »
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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #55 on: August 23, 2006, 02:03:41 AM »
G'Day Nick, well I've got to admit that regardless of all their mechanical faults, I still crave the masochistic delights of Norton Commando ownership, even after all these years and supposedly the wisdom of my advancing years, ha ha! Send me a pic! Cheers, Terry. ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

larsenken

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #56 on: August 23, 2006, 02:18:13 AM »
As a matter of fact I am building one of each right now and i think the 550 is the best balance of power and handling of the bunch.

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Offline nickjtc

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #57 on: August 23, 2006, 08:18:44 AM »
G'Day Nick, well I've got to admit that regardless of all their mechanical faults, I still crave the masochistic delights of Norton Commando ownership, even after all these years and supposedly the wisdom of my advancing years, ha ha! Send me a pic! Cheers, Terry. ;D

The good thing about Norton ownership is that you can get every single part, brand new. Some companies in the UK will build you one from the ground up, for about 8,000 pounds. And there are all kinds of modern accoutrements you can put on to make it more reliable, like electronic ignition and a belt primary drive.

The bad thing is that nothing will change the fact that it is the ultimate developement of a '40s engine, enlarged over the years to satisfy the masses, and unless carefully maintained will prove a very harsh mistress.....
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1977 Suzuki GS750

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Offline aptech77

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Re: Best Cafe Racer candidate?
« Reply #58 on: August 23, 2006, 08:34:53 AM »
I would go for the 400F. My little 400F has about 55HP. 60HP+ when I get done with the valve job over winter. I have the bike under 300LBS. That is 5.45LBS per HP or .183HP per LBS. In top gear she pull 7.5k@100MPH. I have not tried All WOT as I'm still breaking in the motor, just over 650miles now. Now its time to see what she can do. I also will be going to the track in WI. to get some official times. I figure she might be good for 125/130MPH top speed as is. Can't wait to add valves.. ;)