Author Topic: Dyna Coils which model do I need??  (Read 2383 times)

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Offline yellowbirdrs

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Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« on: November 22, 2009, 04:24:52 PM »
CB750 K8 Dyna S ignition Motobatt AMG battery MBTX14AU

Need help on which one I need, 3 or 5 ohms  ???
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Offline bucky katt

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2009, 08:34:54 PM »
i'm running my stock coils with the dyna s. runs fantastic.
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2009, 10:38:19 PM »
Unless you have added other non-stock electrical loads, you can use either on a 750.

If you want to save your battery running around town at low speeds, then get the 5 ohm.
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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Offline yellowbirdrs

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #3 on: November 23, 2009, 01:49:42 PM »
thanks!

I will run LED back signals and brake light, H4 as a headlight no front signal so what do you recommend?


no intents of track racing just some community ride @ low/mid speed   
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #4 on: November 23, 2009, 02:13:54 PM »
I'm of the opinion that the stock motor C.R. does not need the higher potential voltage that could occur with the 3 ohm coils.  So, for the normal street bike motor, 5 ohm is the better choice, as the bike can maintain the battery in a better state and provide it with improved longevity.

BTW, H4 is a type, and not a power consumption spec.  What we need for proper evaluation is a watts rating, or the watts difference between what was stock and what you have installed.  But, if you choose the 5 ohm coils, no real calculation is needed as that is darned close to what the bike had in stock form.  The dyna S WILL make the coils draw more power than the stock points system, though.  And the lower the coil ohms rating, the more power will be drawn from the battery during waits at stop lights (whenever the bike is idling).
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline yellowbirdrs

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2009, 11:46:19 AM »
THX!

I will order the 5 ohms colis any advice in what kind of wires are the best?
The H4 bulb will be a Phillips H4 MotoVision 12v 60/55 w
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2009, 03:27:08 PM »
I prefer metal core wires for reasons of longevity.  Copper stranded is good, as would be aluminum.
This means you would either have to have plug caps with built in resistors, or use resistor plugs.

The alternative is to use suppression core wires that have built in resistance (rated in ohms/foot).  This type of wire core will eventually break down, requiring replacement in 5 to 10 years, usually.  But, you won't need the resistance in the plug boots or the plugs, with this choice.

Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline BobbyR

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2009, 04:46:23 PM »
thanks!

I will run LED back signals and brake light, H4 as a headlight no front signal so what do you recommend?


no intents of track racing just some community ride @ low/mid speed   
TT is correct, running no turn signals is not a great idea since they are also marker lights. If a cop is facing you sees you make a turn and does not see the proper hand signal, you bought a ticket. In NY it is all or nothing. Having rear and no front or vice versa is defective equipment.
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Offline Ogri

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2009, 02:10:51 AM »

TwoTired:  Why is it necessary to have resistance in either the HT leads or the caps ? Apart from stopping interferance to car drivers' radio signals, surely any inbuilt resistance is detrimental (to a tiny degree) to the spark at the spark-plug ?

My other bikes all run copper core HT leads and non-resistor spark plug caps.

Offline TwoTired

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2009, 01:06:27 AM »
Not exactly necessary, but certainly beneficial for the HT circuit.

Has to do with how this ignition system works.  First some understanding of the circuit needs explanation.
When the points close (or other electronic trigger device) current flows through the coil's primary and a magnetic field builds in and around the metal core material of the coil.  Ideally, this time duration is enough to achieve full magnetic field saturation.  This is where power is put into the coil.

The secondary coil circuit path is from one HT wire through the spark plug, across the cylinder head and through the other spark and HT lead.  The circuit need only be completed by a conductor across the spark gap (plasma arc).   The secondary windings in the coil (where the HT leads are attached) are physically located within the same magnetic field created by the primary current.  When the points are opened, the coil magnetic field collapses, and the collapsing field creates a voltage in the secondary windings.  This voltage rises until there is enough voltage to create a plasma tunnel between the electrodes of the spark plug(s).  This also completes the secondary electrical circuit so current can flow in the secondary of the coil.  If the HT circuit has low/no resistance, the energy dump from the coil is a very rapid, short event, with the highest peak current the system is capable of producing, limited only by the secondary resistance of the coil itself.  The high currents promote erosion of the spark electrodes.  (see also ESD machining, spark gap erosion machining).

If we add resistance to the HT leads, the voltage needed to create the plasma channel and fire the spark plugs is exactly the same, but the in-line resistor limits the current during the spark event.  It also extends the spark event because the energy dump from the coil is slowed down.  This gives a bit more time to ignite the mixture in the cylinder.  It also extends spark plug life by reducing the amount of erosion that occurs at the spark plug electrodes due to reduced current peaks.

So, HT resistance, rather than being detrimental to spark, it is actually beneficial.

But, you can get too much of a good thing, though.  The current passing through the spark arc, does relate to how hot the plasma channel becomes during the arc event.  If you use too much HT resistance, the plasma channel heat can get too low, and effect the sustained duration of the spark event, and it's ability to effectively light off the air/fuel mixture.  That is why, you normally pick one of the resistance devices found in the HT circuit; Resistance wire, resistor plug caps, or resistor plugs.

Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline Ogri

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Re: Dyna Coils which model do I need??
« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2009, 02:58:18 AM »
Wow, thanks TT - all news to me! I might have to read that again (a couple of times) for it to really sink in.