Author Topic: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC  (Read 12139 times)

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Offline bucky katt

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #50 on: November 28, 2009, 12:26:49 PM »
Yo Bucky, it was the lower part of a cauliflower Jaffa was chopping up for dinner....couldn't help myself. ;D

i know exactly how you felt  ;D
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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #51 on: November 28, 2009, 05:19:08 PM »
By '73, the Italian twins just weren't competive with the Japanese 4s. A Z1 Kawasaki cost $2000, an SF1 was $2500+, and there was a Kaw dealer on every other corner. Twins were out (especially expensive ones). Price wins over overkill every time.

That's true Grumpy, the release of the Kawasaki 900 spelled the end of the Laverda's twin's dominance in racing world wide, but that was the only Japanese 4 that would show them a clean pair of heels. The CB750 (for all it's brilliance) was only pumping out 2 more BHP, much less torque, it was a good 50 pounds heavier and didn't handle or brake all that well.

The Kawasaki, on the other hand, had 22 more BHP and weighed about the same as a CB750, and apart from it's wobbly handling (no worse than a CB750, it was just more noticeable because it would get you in trouble so much quicker than a 750/4) was an absolute beast with power that the Italian, German and British manufaturers could only dream of. Of course, the factories had so much more money to spend on their racing programmes too, so the term "money talks" was another reason why the Japanese race teams were so successfull.

And Jerry, my Canary yellow 1975 CB750F was just an early F, America mightn't have got the yellow bikes until 1976, and I know that some Americans think that every thing that Honda made was made just for them, but you have to remember that there are other countries in the world outside of the US, and you might not have always been Honda's No1 priority. Oh, and I'm sure your Kawa riding friends are great blokes, but if they couldn't kick your butt on a porcine CB750F, they just weren't very good riders......  ;D   
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #52 on: November 28, 2009, 06:16:45 PM »
By '73, the Italian twins just weren't competive with the Japanese 4s. A Z1 Kawasaki cost $2000, an SF1 was $2500+, and there was a Kaw dealer on every other corner. Twins were out (especially expensive ones). Price wins over overkill every time.

That's true Grumpy, the release of the Kawasaki 900 spelled the end of the Laverda's twin's dominance in racing world wide, but that was the only Japanese 4 that would show them a clean pair of heels. The CB750 (for all it's brilliance) was only pumping out 2 more BHP, much less torque, it was a good 50 pounds heavier and didn't handle or brake all that well.

The Kawasaki, on the other hand, had 22 more BHP and weighed about the same as a CB750, and apart from it's wobbly handling (no worse than a CB750, it was just more noticeable because it would get you in trouble so much quicker than a 750/4) was an absolute beast with power that the Italian, German and British manufaturers could only dream of. Of course, the factories had so much more money to spend on their racing programmes too, so the term "money talks" was another reason why the Japanese race teams were so successfull.

And Jerry, my Canary yellow 1975 CB750F was just an early F, America mightn't have got the yellow bikes until 1976, and I know that some Americans think that every thing that Honda made was made just for them, but you have to remember that there are other countries in the world outside of the US, and you might not have always been Honda's No1 priority. Oh, and I'm sure your Kawa riding friends are great blokes, but if they couldn't kick your butt on a porcine CB750F, they just weren't very good riders......  ;D   

Just as a matter of interest, the American bikes were usually slower than ours as you guys had stricter pollution controls and the like, we never had the 80MPH speedo's. I have also ridden 500 and 750 Kawasaki triples and both would blow the doors off any 750 Honda i have ever ridden and i can honestly say i have almost had every big bore piston kitted Honda 750 known to man... ;D  The front wheel would come up in almost every gear on the Kawa 500 and i could lift the front in every gear on the 750's, i could wheel stand the Honda but it was a struggle compared to the Kawa triples, and without bragging i could ride my well set up 750 Honda's past their handling limitations and did on several occasions !!   :o  I would back the Kawasaki's for speed, over the Honda's any day except if corners came into the equation.... ;)  And Terry, some of my old Honda's used to make my mates 900 Kwaka look slow especially in the twisties, man those early 900's handled poorly, my first big tank slapper was on one of them and the rather large high speed wobble was just a bit scary at times... ;D   Ahhhhh.....the good old days...

Mick

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Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #53 on: November 28, 2009, 08:35:08 PM »
Musta detuned the American Mach III's. I sure wish you still had that SULFUR yellow F. I'd bet you a bottle of Makers it started with CB750F-2xxxxxx. Maybe the Sulfur Yellow was quicker than the Canary yellow  ;)
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline 754

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #54 on: November 28, 2009, 08:53:18 PM »
 Some bike/riders  are a lot quicker than others with the same combo.
 I saw the 750 my Webers came from, spank a 900 Kawi off a light to 60 mph easily..

 My 73 K could constantly beat a buddies 78 F..


 Ask Dale Walker, how many times his Honda 750 showed a Kawi its taillight...
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Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #55 on: November 29, 2009, 04:14:31 AM »
Just for the record, I think it's ridiculous to compare a hotted up Honda 750 to a stock Kawa 750, 900, etc. A really well sorted Honda 750 might make 100 BHP on a really good day, but I've seen Kawasaki 900's pumping out 200+ BHP with what is/was available for them. Sure, it's nice that you're proud of what your hotted up CB750 was capable of, but at the end of the day, it's a dumb argument.

Awhile ago, a member here told me that his hotted up, bored out to the max CB550 would kick my stock CB750's butt and I thought, "yeah, and if I went to the same lengths working over my CB750 engine, you wouldn't see me for dust". It's just a dumb argument, like "My daddy could kick your daddy's butt", know what I mean?

We started off comparing Kawasaki triples that out of the box would whoop stock Honda 750's, but now we're just waffling on about what our hotted up bikes could do to stock bigger bikes. It's nice to reminisce, but let's try to keep it relevant guys. Cheers, Terry. ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #56 on: November 29, 2009, 09:41:35 AM »
 ;)  That's all I'm saying
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline Bill/BentON Racing

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #57 on: November 29, 2009, 12:13:16 PM »
SOHC 4cyl 736cc vs DOHC 4 cyl 903cc,never was close on properly running stock bikes,it's why I bought a supercharger for my '75 CB750K,8-10lbs boost took care of things!! ;D ;D,Bill
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Offline 754

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #58 on: November 29, 2009, 12:55:31 PM »
I WAS talking a 750 stock motor, with different carbs, pipe and gearing, no engine work...

 good rider can make huge difference..

 Any bike  model, there is usually a few that run quicker than others, and a bunch that run slower.

 Average guy on a stock bike, gets no where near magazine test times.. but some riders can. Some people loose enough time off the hole to majorly change the outcome..
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #59 on: November 29, 2009, 02:04:56 PM »
SOHC 4cyl 736cc vs DOHC 4 cyl 903cc,never was close on properly running stock bikes,it's why I bought a supercharger for my '75 CB750K,8-10lbs boost took care of things!! ;D ;D,Bill

Have you got any pics of that bike Bill? Sounds sweet! ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline Bill/BentON Racing

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #60 on: November 29, 2009, 05:22:29 PM »
One,I'll scan it and post later this week(after I learn how),it was a lot of fun,wish I had it still,at least the blower!Rider and state of tune can change everything!! ;D ;D,Bill
BentON Racing Website
OEM Parts | Service | Custom Builds
BentON Racing Facebook
Over 35 years of experience working on vintage motorcycles, with a speciality in Honda SOHC/4 with a focus on the CB750 and other models as well from 1966 - 1985.
______________________________________
1993 HRC RS125 | 1984 NS400R | 1974 Honda CB750/836cc (Calendar Girl) | 1972 CB 500/550 Yoshi Kitted 590cc | 1965 Honda CB450 Black Bomber | 1972 Suzuki T350 | 1973 88cc | Z50/Falcons Pit Bike | 1967 CA100| 1974 CB350 (400F motor)...and more.
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See our latest build 'Captain Marvel' CLICK HERE

Offline Hondell

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #61 on: November 30, 2009, 05:56:57 AM »
Yep Terry, I agree. Hotted up cb's can kick the lowley 500,s ass. Don't ask what my 792 triple did to even turbo'd cb,s though. They would run high 10's while mine was kissing 9's. The magazine ads worked though. All bike talk was about those charcoal Kawalskis that summer when I was a kid.
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Offline Yoshi823

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #62 on: November 30, 2009, 08:06:06 AM »
Yeh, that's a good old ad.
If you've never ridden a Mach III you haven't lived - man they are scary, evil, noisy, dirty, smokey, wobbly - but fark they are a heap of fun.
I'll never forget a mate loaning me his back in the 70s "here, take it for a spin, no probs". Thirty minutes later I returned shaky, sweaty, wobbly, with a grin from ear to ear and said "how good was that, but I don't need to do it again". The 750 Mach IVs weren't much different, but a bit better handling. And they both are very collectable and I'd love to have either in my garage (along with about 20 other 70's classics of course!).
And Terry, the GT750s were laughed at in the 70s, but we all now realize they were a damn good bike, and also very desirable these days.
Oh bugga, now I'm dreamin again.......... :-[

I had a go on a friend's Kwak 750 trple back in the late '70s when I was at Navy College.I was only riding a 125 at the time,so it was with some trepidation that I pulled away on the 750.I too came back with shaking hands and a tingling feeling that made me fell 'I have got to get myself one of these'...that has never gone away,even though I ride an R1 nowadays.
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Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #63 on: November 30, 2009, 03:14:34 PM »
I think even if you didn't get the tingle from the shear ferocity of the power delivery, those Kawasaki triples had a high frequency vibration that would send you hands numb.....still fun though. Is anyone going to mention corners when referring to these bikes.?? ;D   That was the scary part......

Mick
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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #64 on: November 30, 2009, 03:41:39 PM »
Well Mick, in Oz we (our generation) always used to judge a bike by how well it went around corners, but of course, with the amazing freeways in the US, you need to go looking to find a corner or two, so I'm guessing that "cornering ability" isn't as big an issue there as it is here.

Having said that, I've ridden over 5000 miles here in Oz this year, (more miles than I've done in one year since I stopped my daily commute 8 years ago when I left the regular army and got my first company car) and I'd be lucky if more than 500 of those miles had any decent corners, so in reality, how important is it to have a bike that is going to spend 90% of it's life (on average) on straight roads and freeways, capable of going around corners like a Ducati? Pretty important when you go into a corner too fast in the wrong gear, I guess.........

We used to call those Kawasaki H2's "Widowmakers" due to their "flexi-flyer" frames, but in reality, if you fitted some decent rear shocks and tires, half the wobble went out of them, and there are still plenty around as testimony to their longevity. I'd certainly have one, I know where there's a mint H2 sitting in a shed on a farm in NSW, he wouldn't sell it last time I asked, I might have to see if he's changed his mind. Cheers, Terry. ;D 
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline BLUE71TURBO

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #65 on: November 30, 2009, 03:54:50 PM »
  I know what i did with my honda.........TURBOCHARGED IT !!   ;D

                     

                     
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Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #66 on: November 30, 2009, 04:15:55 PM »
Well Mick, in Oz we (our generation) always used to judge a bike by how well it went around corners, but of course, with the amazing freeways in the US, you need to go looking to find a corner or two, so I'm guessing that "cornering ability" isn't as big an issue there as it is here.

Having said that, I've ridden over 5000 miles here in Oz this year, (more miles than I've done in one year since I stopped my daily commute 8 years ago when I left the regular army and got my first company car) and I'd be lucky if more than 500 of those miles had any decent corners, so in reality, how important is it to have a bike that is going to spend 90% of it's life (on average) on straight roads and freeways, capable of going around corners like a Ducati? Pretty important when you go into a corner too fast in the wrong gear, I guess.........

We used to call those Kawasaki H2's "Widowmakers" due to their "flexi-flyer" frames, but in reality, if you fitted some decent rear shocks and tires, half the wobble went out of them, and there are still plenty around as testimony to their longevity. I'd certainly have one, I know where there's a mint H2 sitting in a shed on a farm in NSW, he wouldn't sell it last time I asked, I might have to see if he's changed his mind. Cheers, Terry. ;D  

Yep, widow makers they were....I agree with everything you said Terry but i still like to find a series of streets to use for a bit of fun, everywhere i have lived i have managed to find a local "racetrack"   ;D    I found out a couple of weeks ago that a friend of mine sold his later model 500 Kawasaki triple for 500 bucks, it hadn't been ridden for 20 years and was almost mint... :o    Not happy Jan..... ;)   I would love a 750 project triple...

Mick
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750 F1 970cc
750 Bitsa 900cc
If You can't fix it with a hammer, You've got an electrical problem.

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #67 on: November 30, 2009, 05:02:19 PM »

Yep, widow makers they were....I agree with everything you said Terry but i still like to find a series of streets to use for a bit of fun, everywhere i have lived i have managed to find a local "racetrack"   ;D  

Mick

Ha ha, true mate, there's a 5 mile stretch of road near my place, (but in a "rural" environment surrounded only by farmland) where I've done my 140+ MPH runs on my Suzuki GS1000S and 120+ on my K1, but it's a nice straight stretch of road with a very slight downhill grade, and while I'd take on any bike on that road, I wouldn't try chasing modern sports bikes thru the twisties, neither me or my old bikes are up to it, and at my age, I take too long to heal.........  ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline MJL

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #68 on: November 30, 2009, 06:15:51 PM »
Quote
   
You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC

Ride it and enjoy it?
No matter how fast or how far I rode, I couldn't leave her memory behind.

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #69 on: November 30, 2009, 09:33:27 PM »
  I know what i did with my honda.........TURBOCHARGED IT !!   ;D

                     

                     

What did you do to your frame mate? Cut the two support rails? That beast must handle like a Kawasaki triple now, ha ha! ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline jcarthel

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #70 on: November 30, 2009, 09:41:10 PM »
What year did the Kawasaki come out?  I believe in 1969, the CB 750 was the bike that owned the road.  In 1969, the CB 750 was the quickest production bike in the quarter and in top speed, right?  Didn't Honda raise the bar in 1969 so the Kawasaki was an attempt to raise the bar even higher?  In my book, how can you compare a 750 SOHC four stroke to a 750 2 stroke?  By nature, the 2 stroke should outperform the four stroke.  It is like comparing a 454 to a Duramax, they are vastly different in both science and performance.  The 1969 CB 750 did raise the bar and in fact, it took a few years before there was a four stroke bike that could dethrone the top performance 4 stroke king, the CB 750.

Justin

Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #71 on: November 30, 2009, 11:13:35 PM »
Well Justin, the Kawasaki 500 Mach 1 was introduced a year before the CB750, in 1968. At the time of it's release, it was the fastest accellerating motorcycle in the world. It had a quarter mile time of 12.4 seconds (arguable quicker than the CB750K0) and a 0 - 60 time of well under the CB750's 12 seconds.

The H2 750 (Widowmaker) was released in 1972, and it would blow the CB750 into the weeds. The standard bike was quoted at 12.0 secs for the quarter mile which is not much faster than the smaller 500 but it had a better spread of power.

A 750 H-2 still holds the record for the fastest nitrous injected 750 cc motorcycle, with a standing quarter-mile of 7.776 seconds at 170 mph by Brian Pretzel of Redline Motorsports and the fastest normally aspirated 750cc motorcycle with a standing quarter-mile of 8.24 at 153 mph held by Joe Bird of Fremont Nebraska.

While the CB750 was "nice", the Kawasaki triples were pure evil.............  ;D 
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline jcarthel

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #72 on: December 01, 2009, 12:46:33 PM »
TERRY,

THANKS FOR THE EXCELLENT HISTORICAL REVIEW!  AM I CORRECT THOUGH, THAT IN 1969, THE CB 750 WAS THE FASTEST FOUR STROKE BIKE ON THE MARKET?  IF THIS IS TRUE, WHAT WAS THE FIRST 4 STROKE BIKE BUILT THAT HAD A QUICKER QUARTER TIME THAN THE CB 750?

JUSTIN

Offline jcarthel

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #73 on: December 01, 2009, 07:58:54 PM »
CAN YOU SAY BUMP?  WAITING FOR AN ANSWER TO MY QUESTION. :)

JUSTIN

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Re: You Know What You Can Do With Your Honda SOHC
« Reply #74 on: December 01, 2009, 08:05:27 PM »
I could be wrong but i think it was the 900 Kawasaki..

Mick
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750 F1 970cc
750 Bitsa 900cc
If You can't fix it with a hammer, You've got an electrical problem.