Topic: Bench designing a Bonneville bike

[Don R]

If you could build a SOHC bike to compete at the salt flats or another top speed event what would you build? Could it be competetive?

[Sam Green Racing]

Frank 754 was talking about running his 750 with a sidecar on it last year. I offered to ride in the S/C but it didn't happen.
There are lots of classes, I'm sure a 750 would fit into one of them, It's not easy though, just ask Burt Munro.

Sam.

[Old Scrambler]

With today's piston and valve technology, almost any class is up for graps.  One big secret is to build a bike that will adapt to several classes just by making minor alterations.  Another trick is to find a 120 lb. rider that knows how to handle the sometimes soft salt.  A fully-faired bike requires the side profile of the rider to be fully visible.  If you build the rear enclosure as part of the seat, it can stay on for un-faired runs.  As the bikes are built with increased power, adding weight to the swingarm seems to aid traction.  To make the bike more slippery in the air you may want to remove the front brake or run a small brake in the hub.

I was clocked by my friend's Toyota at 90 MPH on my XR650L pit bike.  (officially probably a little slower) If I geared it properly and lowered the bars to get me out of the wind, I think it would do 110.  That kind of speed with a 220 lb. rider runs against conventional thinking about getting low to the ground.  Be sure to leave a lot of seat room so the rider can adjust weight position to cure any speed wobbles.  Here's some inspiration....... 

[BLUE71TURBO]

Add some taller gears and a body to fit my big a$$ plus my motorcycle............ 

     

[754]

A turbo 750  sohc ran around 147 or 149 back in 75 ish..
 actually talked to the guy at the flats in Aug..

 he has bigger fish to fry now, going after an absolute record..
 he is also on the tech crew..

 There was I think a 750 sohc at Bub this yrear but I could not find it.. either broke and left early or did not make it..

 I would like to run there, but have not been able to afford, it be totally honest.

[Sam Green Racing]

With today's piston and valve technology, almost any class is up for graps.  One big secret is to build a bike that will adapt to several classes just by making minor alterations.  Another trick is to find a 120 lb. rider that knows how to handle the sometimes soft salt.  A fully-faired bike requires the side profile of the rider to be fully visible.  If you build the rear enclosure as part of the seat, it can stay on for un-faired runs.  As the bikes are built with increased power, adding weight to the swingarm seems to aid traction.  To make the bike more slippery in the air you may want to remove the front brake or run a small brake in the hub.

I was clocked by my friend's Toyota at 90 MPH on my XR650L pit bike.  (officially probably a little slower) If I geared it properly and lowered the bars to get me out of the wind, I think it would do 110.  That kind of speed with a 220 lb. rider runs against conventional thinking about getting low to the ground.  Be sure to leave a lot of seat room so the rider can adjust weight position to cure any speed wobbles.  Here's some inspiration....... 

Hey Dennis, #2 picture is by far the best, is the ladies name Debbie ?

Sam.

[bwaller]

I know she inspired me. 

[754]

She lives here in Kelowna BC.. I got a better pic of her.
 i dont think it Debbie, trying to remember her name

[wannabridin]

well lets see that better pic of her!!!   

[BLUE71TURBO]

Here's a BONNEVILLE BABE .....  
 
Here name is Leslie Porterfield. Holds a bonneville record over 200 mph.
Here's a better picture....       
                                           

[voxonda]

I know which of the two I like best...........and it aint that bike! She is COOL

Rob

[BLUE71TURBO]

You missed the second picture !! 

[754]

We got a cool pic of Leslie, and me and my buddy wearing our Hawaiin shirts at Speed Week..

 she is very nice..
 Didnt see her at all during Bub, I mean not at the pits..

Fritz Egli was sharing the same pits, I saw the stickers on the bike with sidecar, but did not realize he wass running it.. should got off my bike and had a better look..

[Old Scrambler]

I chatted with Leslie for quite some time in the starter's shelter while she waited to run on Thursday. She is very calm and knows her business. Notice how the 'seat' area on her bike allows her to move. When she is starting out her butt is almost a foot from the rear of the seat, but at speed she is all the way to the rear and hugging everything very closely.  Leslie also rides other bikes for the owner.

Notice the front width of her bike is approximately the same as a 750 with the standard dyno/starter clutch removed. Another consideration is a rev-limiter to save the motor. Several soft spots on the salt caused numerous bikes to lose traction.  Tom Moeller uses an aircraft-engine balance gauge on his '69 Triumph Triple to tell him at the end of each run if the rear wheel turned more revs than the front.

[Don R]

I've also thought of converting our dragster into a lakester, it has rear suspension but would need proper cooling, tire/wheel combo and gear ratio. My 120lb driver has been 177 in the quarter mile but she isn't a bike rider. My preference would be to start with a smaller cc sohc depending on the rules. Any good reason to get there really.

[Old Scrambler]

The BUB event has a 'run what you brung' event.  No Excusses!

[seaweb11]

............and she has gone over 200mph!!!!!!

       











                                          Sorry where was I?

[BLUE71TURBO]

Stairing at that bonneville 200 mph club tank top !!!      

[lordmoonpie]

Where can you find the list of Bonneville classes and current records?....one day

[Don R]

The BUB event sounds like a good way to get started.

[754]

Bub is all bikes, Aug 28th to Sept 2nd for 2010

 if you run it will cost a bit of money, entry fee, leathers, correct helmet etc.. get a rulebook, and do what you need BEFORE you get there..

 Run What ya Brung..RWB.. is good up to 175mph.. so that covers even most stock Busas.. remember if your bike does 190mph at sea level, it MIGHT hit 170mph at Bonneville.. it is a different game there..

 For endless info regarding slat Flats or any other speedtrials events, check out www.landracing.com.. an excellent forum, that will help you out with all you need..

 Run by Seldom Seen Slim and the lovely Nancy.. who is also in the 200mph club.. they both ride Kawis.. got to meet them at Speedweek this year..

[Sam Green Racing]

Where can you find the list of Bonneville classes and current records?....one day

Here ya go me Lord.

http://www.landracing.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3&Itemid=17

This is the place Simon but the Bonneville records are not coming up at the moment for some reason or other.

Sam.

[Don R]

So it seems a SOHC750 could be bored from 736 to 750. But it appears we compete against 750 twin cam engines. For a serious record attempt we may be at a disadvantage compared to later 750's. For a fun run however is another story.

[lordmoonpie]

Here ya go me Lord.

http://www.landracing.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3&Itemid=17

This is the place Simon but the Bonneville records are not coming up at the moment for some reason or other.

Sam.

Sam - thanks for this, I just need to find a class that no-one else goes into and get me a record LOL!

[Don R]

Ok then let's say you have a 75F 750 and you were planning on going to the BUB just to see how fast you could go. how would you prep the bike? speed rated tires,  steering dampener, good neck bearings and swing arm rebuild go without saying. what else? Gear ratio? dragbike style or road race style? I'm thinking lowered with weight on or in the swingarm. would you need an O2 sensor for jetting when you get there?

[754]

You will need a Snell 2005 helmet I think, which is only good for 2010, then it changes.. ( may not apply for RWYB
 Full leathers.
 First run is around 100 or 125 bucks, something like that, extra runs are 50.00 I think

 Not positive on them figures , but they are close.
 To run in the regular classes, its 375.00 for early and 500.00 for late entry..

[Sam Green Racing]

For some reason, the Bonneville records that I posted a link to are not coming up.
These are the ECTA records for 750 motorcycles posted on their web site and illustrate how classes are broken down from just capacity.

750 CC Records
894 P/P-750/2 Snart Racing Jon Amo Oct-04 105.188
9524 P/P-750/4 Ace Performance Sal Spatafora Jun-08 180.882
 P/P-750/R Darth Rotor Scott Guthrie Jun-99 107.656
 P/PP-750/4 Scott Guthrie Racing Scott Guthrie Mar-98 111.663
5-B P/PB-750/4 OFOS Racing Jim Cannon Oct-07 167.165
 P/PB-750/R Darth Rotor Scott Guthrie Jun-99 108.043

750 CC NON-Pushrod Records
 M/G-750/2 Scott Guthrie Racing Scott Guthrie Apr-95 160.428
9539 M/G-750/4 TLN Motorsports / Ace Performance Greg Neal Jun-09 168.449
9472 M/F-750/4 Project 750 Assault Jack Broomall Jun-08 167.264
9539 M/BG-750/4 TLN Motorsports / Ace Performance Greg Neal Jun-09 166.228
9539 M/BF-750/4 TLN Motorsports / Ace Performance Greg Neal Jun-09 164.954
 M/VG-750/4 Ben Ellis Ben Ellis May-99 107.502
 M/VF-750/4 Ben Ellis Ben Ellis Oct-97 82.645
421 M/VBG-750/4 Hykz Racing Canada Terry Cruse May-07 82.084
421 M/VBF-750/4 Hykz Racing Canada Terry Cruse Apr-05 97.777
9524 MPS/G-750/4 Ace Performance Sal Spatafora Jun-08 183.366
169 MPS/F-750/2 Purpose Driven Racing Tom Schaefer May-07 146.706
9652 MPS/F-750/4 James Hight James Hight Jun-08 183.647
1241 MPS/F-750/R OFOS Racing Jim Cannon Apr-08 98.423
9652 MPS/BG-750/4 James Hight James Hight Sep-09 200.390
9652 MPS/BF-750/4 James Hight James Hight Apr-09 201.815
1241 MPS/BF-750/R OFOS Racing Jim Cannon May-08 94.419
421 MPS/VBG-750/4 Hykz Racing Canada Terry Cruse May-07 70.954

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
750 CC Pushrod Records
 M/PG-750/4 Team Exceleration Don Camlin Oct-02 129.174
 M/PF-750/4 Team Exceleration Don Camlin Oct-02 135.951
 M/PBG-750/4 Scott Guthrie Racing Scott Guthrie Sep-98 112.500
 M/PBF-750/4 Scott Guthrie Racing C. McNamara Oct-98 110.159
 MPS/PG-750/4 Team Exceleration Kirk Gustafson Oct-02 123.223
9183 MPS/PF-750/4 Joe Miceli Joe Miceli Sep-09 116.810
 MPS/PBG-750/4 Dinosaur Racing Booger Smith May-02 109.386
7117 MPS/PBF-750/4 Dinosaur Racing Steve Smith Apr-06 111.858

750 CC NON-Pushrod Records
 A/G-750/2 Scott Guthrie Racing Scott Guthrie Apr-95 163.339
9472 A/G-750/4 Project 750 Assault Jack Broomall Oct-08 167.641
 A/F-750/2 Scott Guthrie Racing Scott Guthrie Apr-95 159.011
9539 A/F-750/4 TLN Motorsports / Ace Performance Greg Neal Jun-09 160.018
9472 A/BG-750/4 Project 750 Assault Jack Broomall Sep-08 166.554
169 A/BF-750/2 Purpose Driven Racing Tom Schaefer Oct-08 124.971
9539 A/BF-750/4 TLN Motorsports / Ace Performance Greg Neal Jun-09 160.100
9131 A/VG-750/4 Wheels Through Time Dale Walksler Apr-09 90.374
9253 A/VF-750/4 2 Brothers Racing Doug Wood Oct-08 86.633
9441 A/VBG-750/4 Brew Bikes Steve Garn Oct-06 75.051
9524 APS/G-750/4 Paul O'Sullivan / Ace Performance Sal Spatafora May-09 184.586
9524 APS/F-750/4 Paul O'Sullivan Paul O'Sullivan, Jr. Apr-09 179.148
9524 APS/BG-750/4 Paul O'Sullivan Paul O'Sullivan, Jr. Apr-09 178.920
9524 APS/BF-750/4 Paul O'Sullivan Paul O'Sullivan, Jr. Apr-09 182.728
9441 APS/VBG-750/4 Brew Bikes Steve Garn Mar-07 75.020

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
750 CC Pushrod Records
765 A/PG-750/4 FRS Engineering Randy Smith Jun-08 117.767
765 A/PF-750/4 FRS Engineering Randy Smith Jun-08 115.368
 A/PBG-750/4 Scott Guthrie Racing C. McNamara Oct-98 109.489
 A/PBF-750/4 Scott Guthrie Racing C. McNamara Oct-98 109.622
765 APS/PG-750/4 FRS Engineering Randy Smith Jun-08 127.357
765 APS/PF-750/4 FRS Engineering Randy Smith Jun-08 124.242
7117 APS/PBG-750/4 Dinosaur Racing Booger Smith May-02 111.278
7117 APS/PBF-750/4 Dinosaur Racing Booger Smith May-02 109.738

There are no sidecar or full streamlined records listed, that could be your opening if you want to set records at Maxton over a speed trap with one mile run in.

Sam.

[Old Scrambler]

If you want to go fast with a basic street bike in the RWB..........bring front and rear sprockets and chains. Tune your carbs and exhaust with velocity stacks. Read the rules about side and center stands, and kick-start levers, and control levers. The salt is groomed (scraped) each morning.  Be prepared to run early in the AM but watch the wind.  Be prepared to handle (adjust for) speed wobbles including changing the front wheel or tire and keeping the rear as far back as possible. Bring your own shade and ground cover!  Get used to riding with a dark tinted shield.  If you know your peak torque RPM I would gear for maximum speed a little past that point and hope you have enouph power to match the air velocity drag.  Are you running stock compression and cam?

[Don R]

  I am still in the "what if" stage, trying to establish what it takes to show up and not look like a clown. We have been racing rear engine dragsters since '93. I've run 7.57 at 180 in the 1/4 mile. I have a current helmet, tow rig, trailer, pit vehicle and tools, no leathers and only a couple street bikes so far. I have a 750 frame with an extended swing arm and a raked neck but I don't know if it is suitable for use. I haven't made any decisions on what to run or even if I have the resources to try. Still learning, Thanks for the input, keep it coming.

[754]

Sam, in post # 2..
 The girrrrrrrrrrrrl on the Duc, her name is Heatherrrrrr.... 

[Sam Green Racing]

She can be in my team anytime Frank.

Sam.