Author Topic: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...  (Read 4119 times)

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Offline Hush

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #25 on: November 21, 2009, 10:07:23 PM »
Check gas supply right from tank to carbs, open the drains in the carbs and see what comes out.
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline CB650 Wolf

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #26 on: November 22, 2009, 06:46:13 PM »
I unscrewed the drains and only a couple of drops came out. I really don't want to pull those carbs off again. :-[
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Offline cb650

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #27 on: November 22, 2009, 07:09:58 PM »
Did you leave the auto shut off instaled?   
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Offline Hush

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #28 on: November 22, 2009, 09:29:54 PM »
No gas no start!  ;D
OK I don't know much about auto shut offs' but if it is like my partners GSX400 then they are a pain.
You need to get gas down to the carbs, whatever tube you have coming from the gas tank, it must hold and transfer gas down to the carbs.
If you can simplify this process by running a tube directly from the gas tap to the carb inlet you should be good to go.
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline CB650 Wolf

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2009, 05:44:58 AM »
Your second picture looks like the automatic fuel shut off not the accel. pump.  You can bypass it if it gives you a problem - mine did.  Just make sure to plug the vacuum line if you bypass.

Will a screw alone work for plugging this or am I going to need a O ring for it?
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Offline cb650

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #30 on: November 23, 2009, 06:45:41 AM »
PM me your addy and I'll send you a plug like the other carbs have.
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Offline CB650 Wolf

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #31 on: November 27, 2009, 02:47:30 PM »
Okay so I removed the auto shut off and eventually got the bike to start. Now another problem.  :-\
It seems now that when the pet cock is in the on position the fuel does get to the carbs and no more overflowing out of the overflow valve on the bottom, but between carbs 2 and 3 there is a even bigger leak. What is causing this?
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Offline Hush

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #32 on: November 27, 2009, 06:35:06 PM »
My guess would be either the common feeder tube that allows gas to flow across to all carbs or the accelerator pump sealing "O" ring.
On your model the "O" ring seal is part of the carb bowl gasket so a new one of those or some gasket goo (it works I've done it) would be required.
If it is the feeder tubes that run across the carbs then I'm afraid it's carb removal time again as you would have to dissasemble the carb rack to renew that tube or it's seals.
Does your model have the main gas line from the tank to a "T" junction between carbs 1 & 2?
Check taht this is on tight too.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2009, 06:37:54 PM by Hush »
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline CB650 Wolf

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #33 on: November 27, 2009, 07:36:30 PM »
My guess would be either the common feeder tube that allows gas to flow across to all carbs or the accelerator pump sealing "O" ring.
On your model the "O" ring seal is part of the carb bowl gasket so a new one of those or some gasket goo (it works I've done it) would be required.
If it is the feeder tubes that run across the carbs then I'm afraid it's carb removal time again as you would have to dissasemble the carb rack to renew that tube or it's seals.
Does your model have the main gas line from the tank to a "T" junction between carbs 1 & 2?
Check taht this is on tight too.

my model has main T tube between carb 2 and 3. There are two more smaller T tubes that go between carbs 1 / 2 and 3 / 4, but those tubes go to the T tube that runs from the airbox. I guess I'll try and get some time to pull them off again tomorrow and look at the accel pump and the feeder tubes.
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Offline Hush

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #34 on: November 27, 2009, 11:00:58 PM »
Sounds like as your "big leak" is between the #2 and #3 carbs and your gas tank mainline is attached there that this will be your problem.
But before you remove anything, just check that the gas line is not its self leaking or split, happened to me when I didn't fit it well enough.
This would be way more simple than carb removal so don't take a spanner to your carbs until you check that gas line. :)
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline CB650 Wolf

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #35 on: November 29, 2009, 03:21:49 PM »
I pulled the carbs off today. Before even pulling them apart i made sure inspect each one of the bowls. And what did I find?  :-X  ::) On carb 2 the bowl gasket wasn't seated completely. Luckily it was ruined by this. I got the carbs back on and started the bike up. Everything seemed to be fine so I decided to go for a ride. Right after I got the bike up to about 45mph the idle was staying way too high. I got it back home and tried to adjust it. It seems like the idle screw is all the way out. Also with the pet cock off the idle will stay at about 2000 (in neutral) , but as soon as I turn it on and pump the throttle the idle shoots up to 4500 and stays there (in neutral). While I'm riding there isn't any issue with RPMs until I pull on the clutch and they shoot back up again.  :-\
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Offline cb650

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #36 on: November 29, 2009, 03:35:06 PM »
Are all your floats ok?   Not related but I had a 80 (slider carbs) do this and never could get them right.
After 5 or so tries I swaped out the carbs and runs great.
18 grand and 18 miles dont make you a biker

Offline CB650 Wolf

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #37 on: November 29, 2009, 05:07:54 PM »
All of the floats are fine. I just went through everything. The only thing I can think of is that the idle screw got messed with somehow and isn't adjusting right. I've had this happen before and just had to play with it enough. Although could this be a side effect of the auto shut off being gone now?
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Offline Spanner 1

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #38 on: November 29, 2009, 06:18:54 PM »
Search the Forum for carb sync. and follow instructions...!!
If your sure it's a carb problem; it's ignition,
If your sure it's an ignition problem; it's carbs....

Offline Hush

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #39 on: November 29, 2009, 06:32:49 PM »
I'd say you need to adjust your throttle cables, back your idle screw adjuster right off (that's anti-clockwise) then check your cables, if they are too tight your idles will never drop.
As you didn't play with the sync it's more likely that the cables are your problem, often one problem leads to another.
So back the idle adjuster right off, slacken the throttle right off at the handlebar adjuster (wind it in)then move down to the cables at the carbs and leave a bit of slack there.
Start the bike up (it will need throttle as the idle adjuster is backed off) and wind the idle adjuster in clockwise, when you are happy with the idle speed (about or just under 1000 rpm is good) adjust the cables again and remove most but not all of the slack.
One final test (for safety) while the bike is running, turn the handlebars full lock both ways to check for binding, nothing like going to red line when you are cornering. ;)
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline CB650 Wolf

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #40 on: November 29, 2009, 07:16:03 PM »
Search the Forum for carb sync. and follow instructions...!!

I followed the procedures for a bench sync when I was putting everything back together.
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Offline leekellerking

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Re: Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #41 on: November 29, 2009, 08:06:45 PM »
Okay, third time is (hopefully) a charm.  (Board ate my first try and I screwed up my second).

Listen to Hush -- he knows of what he speaks.   :)As for me, I don't know crap about carbs.  I do, however, know a little bit about the charging system on the 1982 CB650SC, which is the same as yours (I think).  See, i.e. http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=40792.0 and http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=61075.0.  See also, Kit's thread at http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=42826.0.

It sounds like you have a charging problem, which is a known issue with these bikes.  Here are some steps to follow:

1. Get the battery checked.  It could be a bad battery, or the charging system may had ruined the battery. (Don't ask!)  :(

2. Check the connection between the regulator/rectifier and the starter solenoid.  (Honda calls it a starter switch, but it's a damn solenoid).  If it is burned or buggered, replace it with parts from Tony Weeks at www.oregonmotorcycleparts.com.  Also, check the voltage output at the solenoid at idle and 5,000 rpm.  You should get at least 12-13 volts at idle and up around 14 volts at 5,000.  (That is from memory, so YMMV).

3. Physically check the stator and rotor and the wiring from the stator to the reg/rec.  If little pieces of brown crap fall out when you pull the alternator cover, you should probably replace both the rotor and stator.  (Again, don't ask!)  :(

4. Put a multimeter on the stator terminals to the reg/rec.  Clymer says 0.41-0.51 between any two yellow wires and no continuity to ground.  If not, replace it.

5.  Check the rotor.  Clymer says 4-6 ohms between the two slip rings and infinite between either slip ring and the center.  However, you can have an intermittent short which only ocurrs when the bike is under load, so make sure to do step 3.  Also, while you're there, clean the face of the rotor with scotchbrite and DeOxy electrical contact cleaner (I get it at Fry's Electronics Superstore -- a dangerous place to go if you don't want to spend money).

If either the stator or rotor tests out bad, I'd strongly suggest replacing both.  (Once again, don't ask!).  I have bought both units (rewound) from www.customrewind.com .  Gary is a great guy who does good work, but he is not computer savy so you should call him on the 800 number and do the deal.  I forget what I paid for my rotor, but the stator was $85 (plus my postage shipping my core back to him).  Plug and play!  Tell Gary that Lee King from Sugar Land, Texas sent you.

Any other questions, feel free to ask.  It's the least I can do considering the great advice I've received from Hush, Kit, Hondaman and the other inmates here.

Lee
(I nearly fired my mechanic but I realized I couldn't afford to fire myself)   :'(

Hi mate, put 650 in your question line next time and we'll be right there. ;D
My 650 had a bad rotor, took me replacing all the other bits before I got to it and it still tested fine but was stuffed so hunt around for some 650 parts close to you and be ready to buy one.
Sounds like your carbs are flooding and that is causing the bogging down you describe, is yours the 650 with the plastic floats or the black shoe ones? the old black shoe ones you can reset but the modern all plastic ones have to be replaced.
More than likely your carb float valves are up for replacement, they are the tiny sharp tipped thingies that the floats push up into the carb body to shut the flow of gas off to the bowls.
My last set cost $40 for the 4 so not an expensive item and if you haven't done them since buying the bike they are well worth replacing so you can eliminate them from as the cause.
Floats are actually set below the bowls top lip so by all accounts carbs should never flood unless something like the valves are leaking in too much gas.
Get back to us on how you get on and welcome to the forum.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2009, 08:09:09 PM by leekellerking »
My Nighthawk is put together with wire and zip ties, burns oil, and handles like a pig.  I love it!

Offline cb650

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Re: CB650 Bad battery or other issue? And more...
« Reply #42 on: November 30, 2009, 04:54:00 AM »
All of the floats are fine. I just went through everything. The only thing I can think of is that the idle screw got messed with somehow and isn't adjusting right. I've had this happen before and just had to play with it enough. Although could this be a side effect of the auto shut off being gone now?

As long as you pluged the hole for the vacum the auto shut off will have no effect on the idleing prob.    Make sure all the rubbers are in good shap and no leaks there.
18 grand and 18 miles dont make you a biker