Topic: something inside is moving around

[pablo78cb550]

ok, i just got my engine back from honda. i won't even tell you all how much that hurt my wallet.
but, while i had it at home and was moving it around to clean it up a little. i tilted it to it's side and i heard something slide inside and stop. i tilted it the other way and it slid back the other way. it sounds like its coming from the trans. i put my ear against the clutch cover and tried it again, i'm pretty sure thats where the noise is coming from. there is nothing holding the clutch arm. i'm wondering what it is. anyone?

[Glenn Stauffer]

You really should just call the guys who worked on your engine.  Of course, you could take off the cover since, though I could be wrong, you have to take it off to connect the cable anyway.

[pablo78cb550]

no the arm that actives the clutch is on the out side of the clutch cover.

[MetalHead550]

Only thing I can think of since you say its coming from the trans area is that the gears are sliding back and forth.  Your clutch attaches to the main shaft and it may be transfering that noise to the clutch and its cover.  What did they work on?  Is there oil in it? I dont think the gears should be able to slide on their own since they are controled by the selector forks which are in turn controlled by the selector drum and it by shifter linkage.   So basically for the gears to be able to slide, one of those elements would have to be...not attached?  I dont remember if neutral would allow more movement.  Try putting it in gear and then tilt it and see what happens.  It could be something more simple but I cant think of anything that would have enough side to side play to make that noise...but I wonder if the clutch could be making that noise if theres no oil in it?  If you dont get any better responses that lead you to conclusion, you can see a great deal of your trans etc. by flipping the motor and and pulling the oil pan and oil screen, then you can change gears by spinning the output shaft and working the selector...just make sure theres no oil in it  .

[pablo78cb550]

i gave honda a call and told the mechanic about the noise and he said its pobably because the clutch does not have cable tension on it. i'll check it when i get home.

[Raul CB750K1]

I don't know the CB550, but the CB350 I'm restoring have the clutch basket at the right, and the clutch mechanism at the left. I rod inside the primary train actuates the clutch from one side to the other. It could be the same in the CB550, then the rod could be wiggling around until the clutch cable is installed and adjusted.

Raul

[MetalHead550]

Your guys' avatars get more absurd every time I visit  .  Good call Raul but on the 550 the clutch and actuator are on the same side but I know what you mean, my Triumph is set up like you describe.  It would still be nice to know what they worked on..bottom end?  Clutch?  There are circlips on the primary, clutch, etc. that if left out might cause free movement of some parts.  Plus that would be bad news when you fire it up and are cruising down the road...not trying to scare you, worst case scenario thats all.  Probably something simple, but make sure everything is safe and no funny noises when you take off.  Ive heard horror stories of all kinds.  I dont trust other people working on my bike unless I see everthing they do or can check the quality of the work afterward.  I know not everyone has that luxury though.

[oldbiker]

I cannot believe that anything in a properly assembled motor could move about enough to make an appreciable sound such as you describe. At the very least take the sump off and have a look around.

[Glenn Stauffer]

If it is lack of tension on the clutch actuator, could you just tension it by hand and see if the noise remains?  I'm with oldbiker on this.  I have a bunch of spare 550 motors and can't recall ever hearing any noise that concerned me from them and I've moved them around a number of times.  Of course, maybe you are like me with new stuff and overly sensitve to the slightest noise.

[HondaMan]

I'm with Oldbiker: I don't ever remember hearing anything loose in any CB750/500 I rebuilt....

[MetalHead550]

Yeah...never mind everything I said...

[pablo78cb550]

these is no oil in it yet, this was rebuild from rings, piston pins, valve guides, valves, gaskets you name it. from the bottom of the cylinders to the top.
i'm going to flip the motor over tomorrow and remove the oil pan and check it out.
 the honda mechanic said its probably the gears a sliding from side to side.
thanks for your help guys

[oldbiker]

Hi Pablo, if the gears and gearshift mechanism is properly assembled, the gears cannot slide about. They are moved in a positive stop fashion by the drum which moves the selector forks. If, as I suspect, you find something that is lose that shouldn't be there, I think I would want some reccompense from the 'Honda Mechanic' for the time you have had to spend sorting out his error.

[pablo78cb550]

ok, here are the pictures of what is moving side to side.
all the clips are in place. nothing is missing. both arrows point to the pieces moving.
now they only move a very very very small amount from side to side. but you can hear when they stop.
one is the primary i assume, and the other, well i don't know what it is.

[pablo78cb550]

anyone?

[dusterdude]

my guess is the upper gear is the countershaft sprocket and the lower one is the starter gear for the electric starter.im probably wrong tho

[pablo78cb550]

thanks biffta

[MetalHead550]

Could you describe from what angle you took that shot?  Mabey get some more light in there?  I know its tough with the cases together.  I can see the counter and main shaft in the bottom left.   The lower arrow points to the starter gear as others have described but Im at a loss as to what exactly youre pointing at with the top arrow.  If the clips are all there and it goes through the gears without problems then Id say your ok.

[pablo78cb550]

this might be a better shot.

[oldbiker]

I lightened up ypur pic in my paint program and it looks like the starter pinion and the countershaft pinion are the items you are poining to. If they are slightly worn and therefore have a little more play than new items, then with no oil in the engine you might hear a small sound of movement. If there is no other obvious problem then build up and get your bike on the road.

[MetalHead550]

I say youre good.

[pablo78cb550]

thanks guys, i think you've all put my mind at ease. now i have to remove the grit and grime and paint the cases. this should be fun. no way am i putting that dirty engine with chips in the paint on the cases back into a freshly powder coated frame.
thanks again for all your help guys.

[MetalHead550]

Cool.  Are you going for an original restore or are you customizing a bit?  Those engines sure look mean painted low gloss black with chrome accents.  Either way make sure you get some good high temp paint and let it cure well berfore you put it in service.  Rattle can paint, high temp or otherwise, doesnt hold up to gas and other fluids so well till its good and cured.  I recommend Simple Green and a pressure washer for cleaning the engine then some final prep cleaner(get at an automitive paint supplier) before you spray.

[pablo78cb550]

DEFFINENTLY NOT GOING STOCK.
Cafe racer. I even bought a front fender license plate for it.
I like the black engine on your bike, but I’m going for a more silver than black set up.
Still haven't decided how I want to paint the tank. I’m also thinking of put bondo over the name plate mounts on the tank. Pin striping maybe, but that's not really cafe racer style. So I’m back and forth a lot.

[MetalHead550]

Cool!  Is that turquois on the fender the color your going with?  Looks good!  You paint it?   Is the frame still black or did you go with something else.  Have a look at Paulages post about his 550 project.  He did some cool #$%* to his tank and Id like to try it sometime but I dont have the balls to till I have a couple spares.  I hear ya on the back and forth, mine has been done for a while, and its still not "done."