Author Topic: Velocity stacks????  (Read 43664 times)

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Offline B.O.X.N.I.F.E.

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #25 on: December 08, 2009, 01:56:52 pm »
That's a pretty damn cool airbox.  Tell us more!

mystic_1

I bet something like that could be built for the 4's. With a photo and dimensions they could probably do it for you...

http://www.eplastics.com/Plastic/Plexiglass_Acrylic_Sheet
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traveler

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #26 on: December 09, 2009, 05:44:45 pm »
just order some Honda CB750 Bell velocity stacks from Speed Dragon good customer service so far let's see how the stack shine and fit.





Finally got a chance to check out the website.  These "bell" stacks are the best ones he makes, IMHO.

Might have to spring for these.:D

~Joe

Offline Sheik Yerbouti

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #27 on: December 09, 2009, 06:07:59 pm »
That clear airbox could probably be made real easy with a pretty basic vacuum form mold. Hell, if you wanted to you could make some aluminum frames, put the material between two frames and hold it in place with binder clips.

Then if you have a decent shop vac, hook the hose up to a MDF box with a pegboard top. Put your mold on the box, heat the plastic up in an electric oven and when it's hot enough suck it down over the part. You can attach the back part using solvent. I might have to try this.

Offline mystic_1

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #28 on: December 09, 2009, 08:25:37 pm »
I walked into work this morning to find that they have just purchased a brand new vacuum forming table  ;D  Talk about serendipity :)  Now I just have to figure out how to use it.

mystic_1
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Offline rustrocket92

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #29 on: December 09, 2009, 09:22:26 pm »
Anybody have the exact spacing between carbs on a 73k and 78f as well as carb throat dimensions?
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Offline turboguzzi

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #30 on: December 10, 2009, 11:28:12 am »
As I suggested a few back, a foam sock is a good compromise when it comes to filtering rampipes. In my experience better than a 'pod'.

But agree that the best for max flow is 'open'.
You say there is no in between, and I know what you mean, but the optimum for a filtered induction has to be the airbox and remote filter.


interesting, common wisdom these days is airbox volume should be 8-10 times the ebgine capacity so that airbox looks on the small side.

on the other hand, talking with students that been working on formula SAE cars, they said those small plenums bring out a lot of torque from those hugh strung 600-4.

I am currently planning a 4 litre box for my sohc 500, but eventually the real boost should come from tuning the length of the airbox runners to the box.

 

traveler

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #31 on: December 10, 2009, 11:35:47 am »
If you were to build your airbox such that the stacks went into the box, you could set the bikes power to how you want it through the length of the stacks.  Longer stacks increase torque...shorter stacks are for high RPM's.

The rubber "boots" are basically a velocity stack on the inside.

The best would be fuel injection with a tuned airbox.....but that is an expensive option.

~Joe


Offline yellowbirdrs

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #32 on: December 10, 2009, 01:12:33 pm »
Got mine last Friday great quality and fitment the screen mesh is good but I guess I will made mines using coffee filter mesh with some oily foam between  2 layers of mesh.
photos will come later.

« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 01:16:39 pm by yellowbirdrs »
X/A
Summer 2011

traveler

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #33 on: December 10, 2009, 01:40:36 pm »
you will have clean air, but the foam and mesh is gonna kill the airflow that the stacks are capable of, in my opinion.

~Joe

Offline clayman74

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #34 on: December 10, 2009, 04:24:41 pm »
perhaps this is a good thread to ask. i ditched the airbox in search of stacks but i have recently been reading horror stories of peoples cars falling off from vibration without support of the airbox.

anyone have any suggestions or pics of what they have fabricated to support carbs?

Offline Steel Dragon Performance

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #35 on: December 10, 2009, 06:28:09 pm »
clayman74, you can use black industrial tie straps (the pull ties). Run them around your frame and in between the carbs, depending on what carbs and bike you have, you should be able to find a spot to pull them up for support. If your clamps are tight, you shouldn't have any problems.

Offline mystic_1

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #36 on: December 10, 2009, 10:47:44 pm »
My bike has never had a stock airbox on it in the time that I've owned it.  No rear carb support either.  Carbs never fell off.  :)

YMMV

mystic_1
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Offline acteg

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #37 on: December 11, 2009, 09:52:45 am »
The velocity stacks for my 75 550 came in today.  They look great and fit great.  The mounting portion has holes for screws but no screws came with the stacks.  Additionally one of the stacks has a small chip in it, but I don't really care.

pics







« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 10:04:09 am by acteg »

Offline acteg

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #38 on: December 11, 2009, 12:28:16 pm »
As a side note:

Mike from www.steeldragonperformance.com saw my post on here and offered to replace the chipped stack at no charge.  He also apologized for the lack of screws as they are supposed to come with them.  I did not take him up on his offer to replace the chipped stack because it is very minor, and overall I am very happy with the quality and design of the product.  I would not hesitate to purchase from Mike at www.steeldragonfperformance.com again.  Additionally, the turn around time to get the product was very fast and Mike was in constant communication via email.

Great product and even better service.


Offline Silverback

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #39 on: December 11, 2009, 01:07:51 pm »
Can you do these for CR special carbs (29mm)? The air nozzles are arranged a bit differently, but thought I would ask anyway.
Chris
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Offline Steel Dragon Performance

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #40 on: December 11, 2009, 02:40:30 pm »
Hi I have made them for 31 cr's for a customer in Australia. If you are interested ,contact me at www.steeldragonperformance.com Thanks, Mike

Offline clayman74

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2009, 12:44:08 am »
AYE those look great! have to take that into consideration for my stacks!

traveler

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2009, 11:01:55 pm »
If I can't get my airbox and carbs straightened out, I'll be ordering a set with the bell tips.....just need to polish a set of these out to a mirror finish!:D

~Joe

Offline wannabridin

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #43 on: January 13, 2010, 03:56:10 pm »
Got mine last Friday great quality and fitment the screen mesh is good but I guess I will made mines using coffee filter mesh with some oily foam between  2 layers of mesh.
photos will come later.



do you have pics of your stacks?  i'd like to see what you did for the filters
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Offline shag nasty

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #44 on: October 24, 2010, 10:16:20 pm »
You can now purchase Steel Dragon Performance Velocity Stacks directly from them via paypal d off of my website. http://sohc750.net/shopping/steel-dragon-performance/

Offline Tintop

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #45 on: October 25, 2010, 03:06:00 pm »
Just read through this thread.  Thanks shag nasty for posting and bringing it to the top.

While the alloy stacks certainly look great, as this thread points out filtering is an issue.  While the coffee filter screen and foam seems like a good idea, flow wise its not.  For the stack to be effective the air has to enter it smoothly.  Placing a filter directly on the bell mouth prevents that.  There  needs to be a gap between the end of the stack, and the inside face of the filter.  As little as 15 / 20mm will work. ;)

I'm in the final stages of getting a filter made for my cafe build that uses the 40mm 77/78 550 stacks (2 pair of #2/3's).  It might be a solution for those who want to run something other than the stock air box, or pods.  Will be posting data and pictures in a short while.

I do love billet, so Steel Dragon will be getting an inquiry for something different. ;) :)
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
1980 CB750F (project)
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products (SOLD)
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case (SOLD)
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline seanbarney41

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #46 on: October 25, 2010, 09:35:48 pm »
Hey Steel Dragon Performance, do you have a price on those airboxes yet?   I may be interested in one for a 750k.  Looks like they may work similar to the plexiglas one posted above.  Any reports on airflow versus the stock airbox?  Also weight?
If it works good, it looks good...

Offline wannabridin

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #47 on: October 26, 2010, 12:01:32 pm »
has anyone thought of using a filter with some "legs" to space it off?  even a small piece of gauze-type or foam type filter could work well?  this would allow the filter to be inside the "mouth" of the smooth airflow.

dammit i love the looks of stacks so bad, but i've heard nothing but horror stories about tuning them and getting them to run well like a factory airbox...   :( :(
1976 CB750K, currently under construction:
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=64468.0

-And if you don't do it this year, you'll be one year older when you do...

Offline Tintop

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #48 on: October 26, 2010, 02:35:31 pm »
has anyone thought of using a filter with some "legs" to space it off?  even a small piece of gauze-type or foam type filter could work well?  this would allow the filter to be inside the "mouth" of the smooth airflow.

dammit i love the looks of stacks so bad, but i've heard nothing but horror stories about tuning them and getting them to run well like a factory airbox...   :( :(

The best single stack filter, as Turboguzzi pointed out, is a sock.  The problem is the look, in that they cover the whole stack, and use zip ties to hold them on.  A secondary issue is clearance.  A sock on #2 can potentially foul on the 77/78 throttle bell crank, which is why I rejected that easy solution.  The best solution for our cafes is a single filter mounted across all four stacks.  The problem has been finding one that not only looks good, but actually works.

wannabridin - I think you are mixing the air box vs pods issue, with using stacks.  When people remove the air box, and install pods, one of the essential things they remove is the stock stacks.  These are an integral part of Honda's tuning of the intake system, and pods do nothing to re balance the system.  There have been a number of members who have removed the air box, but retained the plenum & stacks, and fitted a K&N on the back.  As far as I know none of them experienced the same tuning issues as those who only used pods.  bwaller's BOTM 590 uses this setup.  His only comment has been that he can only get 115 out of it, because the stock plenum eventually restricts air flow.  So the next step would be to remove this restriction, and just filter the stacks.  This is what I am doing.  So by all means use stacks, just make sure they're right for your application, and not bling with headaches.

Some thing to think about - the only time there is still air in an air box, is when the engine isn't running; the rest of the time it's about managing air flow.
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
1980 CB750F (project)
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products (SOLD)
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case (SOLD)
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline TwoTired

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Re: Velocity stacks????
« Reply #49 on: October 26, 2010, 03:09:11 pm »
Air flows the fastest/easiest when it is laminar, ie. without turbulence.
Any obstruction in a laminar flow air path creates turbulence, and the resulting drag.

Air filters of all types present an obstruction and turbulence.  Putting an filter in the vicinity of a velocity stack negates the beneficial effect of a velocity stack.

A velocity stack with a filter on it is purely for looks, not improved function.

The stock air box, filters the air and provides some distance between where the air has been turbulated by the filter, and the mouth of the inlet stacks.  The stock stacks also keep the inside diameter join to the carb step free.  As abrupt transitions in duct diameter also induce turbulence and drag.  I did look at the Steel Dragon web site.   And none of the pictures show the inner diameter mating with the inner diameter of the carb bores.  In fact, they mention nothing about the inner diameter of the stack.  If they don't match inner diameter exactly, they are producing turbulence in the carb bore, and I would have difficulty believing they had a beneficial function.  They do look shiny!

The real problem with the turbulence inside the carb throat is that it presents a modal pressure change in waves, with troughs and peaks against the wall of the carb bore.  These troughs and peaks change length with changing air speeds.  When these troughs and peaks move over the fuel jet exits in the carb bore, the fuel flow becomes unpredictable and not in lock step with the volume of air passing through the carb bore.

Cheers,

Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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