Topic: Piper Honda 8 Valve - Rare Dual Overhead Cam Head for CB350...ever heard of it??

[malcolmgb]

http://www.vintagebike.co.uk/Bike%20Directories/Honda%20Bikes/pages/Honda%20RC166%20250cc%201965.htm
a link to a slightly better picture here, also look at top for a link to sound archive.
I followed racing in the 60's and saw the Honda 50 twin, 125/5, 250/6, 297/6 & 500/4, then of course the Yamaha V4's, MV Agusta the list goes on.....
I believe there have been replica Honda 6 cylinders built over here in the UK.

[Bob Wessner]

That is a much better picture, thanks. Guess I will stop whining about trying to maintain my bike, this makes it look like a 4 cyl. should be child's play. 

[bill440cars]

     I remember seeing the 250 6 cyl in cycle magazines w/ Mike Hailwood and it was said that the 6 cyl
  had an incredible sound. I can only try to imagine since I never got a chance to hear it. The 1st Honda
  I saw at a race track was a 125 Benly Super Sport w/ a 150 kit in it and it had a fantastic sound at a
  race track in New Port, Arkansas. It sounded like a well tuned sports car going around that track.
  Those megaphones sounded great! Well, anyway I'm outta here. Later on, Bill

[malcolmgb]

Hi Bill, take a listen to the Honda 6 on the link I posted earlier.

Talking of the 125 Benly Sport I had one of those in the 60's

[crazypj]

It was still listed in the 1976 catalogue!!!??? I dont think they want anything to do with old motorcyles, I tried about 2 yrs ago to see if they had any interest in making cams for CB500/550 and got no reply
PJ

[bill440cars]

I have just read a book about early Honda race machines and am certain they had twin overhead cam multi-valve heads on some of their bikes, will have to get the book out from the library again to check

          That they did but, I don't think they ever did that to a 350 twin and if they did, it didn't make
    it to the street. Later on, Bill

[bill440cars]

Hi Bill, take a listen to the Honda 6 on the link I posted earlier.

Talking of the 125 Benly Sport I had one of those in the 60's

Thanks malcom,
                  Listen, when I was in my early teen's, I got to see one on those 125 Benly Super Sports
      running around a track ( I was told it had a 150 kit in it. Don't know if that's true) and it sounded
      fantastic with those megphones. The guy spun out, which killed the engine and he just grabbed it
      up and it was running again (that's when I found out about eletric starters on motorcyles( I didn't
      see him kick start it). I was in Japan from Dec 67 until Dec 69 and they were already hard to find
      and pricey if you did find one. Do you wish you had yours back? I'd better go. Later on, Bill   

[Sam Green Racing]

Billy and Malc, Honda did make a 350 class DOHC twin, the CR77 but it was only 305cc.

The head this thread is about is a conversion for the CB350 road going twin.

I hope this helps.

Sam.

[bill440cars]

Billy and Malc, Honda did make a 350 class DOHC twin, the CR77 but it was only 305cc.

The head this thread is about is a conversion for the CB350 road going twin.

I hope this helps.

Sam.

  Appreciate that Sam but, that's what I was referring to. I don't know a lot about the racing bikes, just bits and pieces. I guess I should have specified the CB,CL & SL350 twin. I have no doubt that you know what you're talking about and I clearly appreciate the experience that you and others bring to this site. That's why I'm here, to learn what I can and share what I know. Thanks again. Later on, Bill   

[Sam Green Racing]

Sorry Bill, I thought you had got at cross purpouses with all the chat about the factory bikes coming into it.   My fault. 

Sam.

[bill440cars]

                Not a problem Sam and while I've got your attention, was I told correctly that there was a
       150cc kit or conversion for the Benly 125 Super Sport? Also, what was the redline on it? The 1st
        Honda I ever saw was one running around a race track at New Port, Arkansas. It had
        megaphones that sounded like they were open and it was screaming around the track. It
        sounded beautiful. Better go. Later on, Bill

[Sam Green Racing]

Billy, the bike you saw at New port was probably a 125 Benly Super Sport with a CA95 150 motor.

The first twin cylinder Benly motors in 1957 were 125s, the C90 tourer and the sportier CB90. Not a lot of these was made.

The following year, 1958, they made the C95, a touring 150 and the CB95, the 150 version of what you know as the Benly Super Sport. (It's thought that only a few hundred was made and never left Japan)

In 1959 they produced the C92 125 and C95/CA95 150s, all three tourers and the CB92 125 Benly Super Sport.

In standard spec the CB92 made 15.5bhp and perhaps with the race kit another 1bhp, this was achieved at 10,500rpm.

The older CB95 motor produced 16.5bhp in standard trim, and also made an extra 1 brake with the race kit at 10,000rpm.

Any of these motors (sports or touring) will in the lower gears spin upto 14,000rpm and although the speed increases the power and rate of acceleration falls away dramaticaly.

My own bikes have not been pushed at the top end since 1971, but on the shorter sprint distances have improved dramaticaly with development over the years.

I hope to put one to the test later in the year over the flying Kilometer to prove just how fast these little bikes are.

Keep ya fingers crossed for me.

Regards Sam.

[bwaller]

Fingers crossed Sam. I'm always amazed at some of Hondas race engine feats in those early days. Those little engines would rev to the moon.

[bill440cars]

            Thanks for the info Sam, I knew some of  it but, you definitely have increased my knowledge
        of those bikes. There are a lot of people who don't even have a clue about them though. I
        WILL keep my fingers crossed. Like you, I don't want to see anything happen to your bike or
        you. I do want to know how it went so, keep me posted. When I think about it, I can still hear
        the sound of those pipes. I'll have to try to find that link, that malcomb told me about, of the
        6cyl Honda racer. I've always been fascinated by the sound from a good exhaust system. Well,
        I'd better go. Later on,  Bill

[malcolmgb]

Sam, any chance of seeing some pictures of your CB92 & 95.
I was lucky enough to get a pair of second-hand race-kit megaphones and seat for my CB92, i used them on the road for short periods, being the 60's and living out of town there wasn't a heavy Police presence so could get away with noise. Another trick was to cut a 'Coke' can in half poke some holes in the end and Jubilee clip it on end of the megaphone to silence it a little. The seat was excellent for the race look, it had a suede effect with ribbing identical to works racers, the hump was metal and sprayed silver.

[Sam Green Racing]

Malc  Billy, I am pleased if my posts have rekindled fond memories from the past for you both.
I have over the years heard some out of this world claims of speeds for these little bikes.
A well set up machine in still conditions, with a 150lb ish rider would perhaps see 80mph or just over.
The stock Benly Sport weighed in at 242lbs, but by getting rid of all the unwanted clutter, the weight would come down to about 185-190lbs. With the race kit this would give the same rider pulling a higher gear another 10mph, around the 90mph mark.
In the late 60s my friend and I both sprinted Benlys over standing quarter to flying mile distances.
Both bikes was stripped to the bare esentials, the front forks and wheel was taken from the C100 50cc Cub, resulting in the weight being cut down to around 150lbs.
My friend was a lot lighter than me and his motor had 4bhp more. My top speed was 87mph to his 99mph.
It just goes to show how important the power to weight ratio of a bike is.

Malc, I dont have any digital pics, but if you PM me your address I will photocopy some of the old pics that I have.

Regards Sam.

[Sam Green Racing]