Author Topic: anyone here had vertabra fused?  (Read 5587 times)

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Offline bucky katt

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anyone here had vertabra fused?
« on: December 24, 2009, 12:44:50 PM »
i'm being admitted to the hospital tomorrow afternoon, looking like i'm not going to have a whole lot of choice about getting some vertabra in my neck fused from where i fractured them almost 3 years ago. what can i expect as far as mobility, this is supposed to be c-4 and c-5, possbily c-3 as well. will i still be able to ride and/or drive or am i pretty much totally screwed now? as you can imagine, i dont want the only info coming from the docs that are going to cut on me. i figured that anyone that has had this done might be a more objective source of info here.
Of all God's creatures there is only one that cannot be made the slave of the lash. That one is the cat. If man could be crossed with the cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat.
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Offline azuredesign

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #1 on: December 24, 2009, 02:55:25 PM »
I don't know what you'll have for mobility, but I would want to make sure that I knew, and felt comfortable with that knowledge before undergoing any surgery. There's usually a couple of ways to do anything, so I'd make sure I had a good chance of getting what I wanted out of the outcome.

Good Luck!!

Offline Hush

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2009, 04:28:22 PM »
I was a Shunter (railway worker) for 13 years before I joined the Prison Service Bucky, I was nearly cut in half by a wagon and spent 3 years recovering and doing light duties, my C3/C4 vertibrae took the biggest hit and the disc between them is like a wavy potato chip in Xrays.
C3& C4 are more down by the bottom of your back it thought?
Anyhow I also had 2 vertibrae cracked by some moron during Control 7 Restraint training a few years back, woke up a month later and no feeling in my right arm, thought I'd had a stroke but more Xrays (shot through the mouth!) and that showed the damage.
Some of my friends have had discs replaced by plastic ones and most have had to go back later to have the same discs fused, you do lose "some" mobility but you won't be a cripple, we have staff at the prison who have had the fusing done and they are passed A1 fit for active front line duties.
You will need to learn to look after your back, no sweeping, vacuuming or lawn mowing, cracking 100 mph on your bike will be fine though.
Hope your surgery goes well and you are back on ya feet soon........Merry Christmas too mate...Hush.
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Offline mick7504

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #3 on: December 24, 2009, 04:51:05 PM »
Good luck with the surgery Bucky.
I've had a stuffed lower back for years although it's settled down a lot now.
Hard contact sport, motorbike spills and heavy lifting when I was younger took it's toll for a while big time.
I was walking chemist shop for a bit full of pain killers including prescribed morphine.
As time goes by you learn to live with any pain and also get to know your limitations.
It was a bit daunting for a while thinking about what might be but you get to know your body and it all works out in the end.
Positive thinking is the trick that helps a lot.
Merry Xmas mate and take care.
Mick
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Offline BobbyR

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2009, 05:30:44 PM »
You will not be able to turn your neck as you do now as those are up high. You will probably have to rely on your mirrors more, so you may want a wider mirror on each side. Here is the numbering system:

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Offline 78 k550

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #5 on: December 24, 2009, 05:40:20 PM »
I have C5,C6,C7 fused.
You should be still able to ride. I do everyday the ground is dry. :)
I have full movement to the right. The left I can go just about all the way. I had mine done in 2001.
I was late 30's and the Dr. said the worst thing to do is go into scar tissue twice. So he recommended the bone from my hip him instead of the bone bank. I have not had many issues at all. just get sore faster and do get some weird pains. but those are diminishing the longer it is.
The hip hurt the most.

Paul
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Offline 78 k550

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #6 on: December 24, 2009, 05:45:18 PM »
good point Bobby.
Mine is low.  The only thing is, he will be moving his shoulders more. If I have to look over my left shoulder i have to swing my shoulder a little.

Paul
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Offline bucky katt

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #7 on: December 24, 2009, 07:49:04 PM »
just got back from the ER again. right arm went totally numb, neck hurts like hell too. it appears theres a nerve pinched, causing me problems. doc refused to say one way or the other about what mobility i may or may not have. i told him until i could get an actual answer i wasnt going through with it. i was very nice and asked what i thought were good questions and the doc got 4 kinds of pissed off that i dared question him.
Of all God's creatures there is only one that cannot be made the slave of the lash. That one is the cat. If man could be crossed with the cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat.
Mark Twain - Notebook, 1894

Offline 78 k550

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #8 on: December 24, 2009, 08:07:06 PM »
find a new doctor thats like pissing the cook off.
If he can't tell you that he must not have much confidence in himself. very good Dr. out here at Swedish medical.
I was having a pinched nerve. I could make my right side go numb by just putting my chin down to my chest and when I raised my right arm above my head or up at a 90 degree I wouldn't have a pulse in my arm.
my doc thought it was my shoulder then I showed her that nd she commented on the MRI for my neck and everything was pretty fast after the result. I was under for 4.5 hours and he cleaned a lot up while in there. They went throuht the front and move everything off to the side so anything can happen to your voice cords or anything. I had full confidence in my Dr. and never ? his ability.
I have been great since.

Paul
« Last Edit: December 24, 2009, 08:11:44 PM by 78 k550 »
Paul
Littleton, CO

76/77 CB 750F, 
75 GL1000, (AKA GL1-242 NGWClub),
76 GL1000 LTD
84 GL1200 Standard
6 Bultaco's= 42, 49, 121, 152, 167, 188

Offline BobbyR

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #9 on: December 24, 2009, 08:39:34 PM »
just got back from the ER again. right arm went totally numb, neck hurts like hell too. it appears theres a nerve pinched, causing me problems. doc refused to say one way or the other about what mobility i may or may not have. i told him until i could get an actual answer i wasnt going through with it. i was very nice and asked what i thought were good questions and the doc got 4 kinds of pissed off that i dared question him.
Find another Doc, like my Prostate deal you want to get it right the first time. No one can promise you anything, and beware of the guy that says it is simple. If you know a Nurse in the local Hospital, they know who has it and who does not.
Dedicated to Sgt. Howard Bruckner 1950 - 1969. KIA LONG KHANH.

But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?

Offline bucky katt

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #10 on: December 24, 2009, 11:32:43 PM »
anything involving my spinal column is a big deal as far as i'm concerned. i'd rather live with the pain that reduced mobility and not being able to do stuff. tonight DID suck though, the wife had to brush my hair after my shower because i cant even raise my arms much.
Of all God's creatures there is only one that cannot be made the slave of the lash. That one is the cat. If man could be crossed with the cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat.
Mark Twain - Notebook, 1894

Offline Hush

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #11 on: December 25, 2009, 12:02:59 AM »
Ah thanks bobby, no wonder I get confused, it wa sthe L3 and L4 that I got hit when on the railways, the injury from training was C3 and C4.
Sounds like you need more advice from a doctor you trust mate. :)
I think the thing I most like about motorcycling is the speed at which my brain must process information at to avoid the numb skulls who are eating pies, playing the ukulele, applying make-up etc in the comfort of their airconditioned armchairs as they make random attempts to kill me!!!!!!!

Online simon#42

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #12 on: December 25, 2009, 02:04:07 AM »
find another doctor , like all professions some are better than others , also its worth traveling to find a specialist that is well known for that operation . three years ago i had an accident and was told by the hospital i would have to have my arm amputated that night , i refused and signed myself out , went to another hospital 50 miles away and they said the same thing , went to another hospital and they said the same thing but gave me a number for a specialist at a teaching hospital . went to see him and after two long operations and two months in hospital i now have a pretty useful arm [ as 78k550 said the bone grafts are not very nice ] it was the hardest few days of my life and i did upset a few doctors along the way but it was well well worth it
good luck bucky

Offline mlinder

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #13 on: December 25, 2009, 09:01:25 AM »
9 or 10 fused in my back. Different than neck, so can't tell you how much it will affect you. Affects me a little bit, for sure.
No.


Offline MickeyX

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #14 on: December 25, 2009, 01:24:46 PM »
So okay, I work with the surgeons who do this stuff, I'm right there in the OR as they are performing it, hearing their comments, the real truth type of stuff... First off, the doctor is correct in telling you that there really is no way to know for sure how much mobility you will have after this. Every person on the planet is built different, have different amounts of harm done in very delicate tissue and will put in different amounts of effort afterwards to achieve mobility. If you were a slug before, you will no doubt have crappy results. If you are someone who jumps in there to get the job done, you will have better results. It is up to the patient as much as the surgeon on this stuff.
The biggest difference is the amount of pain you will no longer have. It is meant to stabilize an unstable environment and prevent, as much as possible, more damage. It isn't meant to make you brand new again. There is no way to repair what is damaged but it can be cleaned up, made stable and you definitely should have a better life over all afterwards. If they can't guarantee that part, you walk away. You need to assess how you feel now, what you go through on a daily basis, what amount of progress would be enough to get you back to work or whatever you are missing out on. That is how you judge these types of surgeries. Steve Austin is only on tv. It ain't happenin, dear. I wish it could but that's life. There are some really delicate things in there and they use a big microscope, they have wires all over you to test your nerve responses to make sure they aren't bumping or hurting things, they have someone like me in there too, to take pictures at any angle needed to make sure they are doing a good job. There is such a thing as bolt cutters, torque wrenches and all of that crap in the OR. They use pneumatic drills with grinding tips and shave off bone, edges, dig out discs with little sharp edged scoop type of instruments. They do all of this without harming all of the stuff around it. Your spine actually kinda deep behind your esophagus, trachea, ...

I would say, after x-raying these patients before and after, 95% of them are glad they did it. What happened with the other 5%? Those are the whiney slugs who expect that if they have the surgery, everything instantly would be okay and they wouldn't have to put forth any effort to get it like that. They don't do their physical therapy, they don't take their meds to help it all relax so it can heal, they just b!tch, b!tch, b!tch.

I see you as the guy who will do what it takes to get the results. It all depends if they go in through the front and give you a plate or if they also go in from behind and give you rods. It all depends too on if they just fuse you or if they take out any pinched discs, smooth out your vertebral body surface and put in a spacer, which they tend to do on the plate one. (called an anterior cervical disc fusion if you want to look it up)  Overall, you should be able to tilt your head down and back, but it will be stiff feeling. You should be able to turn your head side to side, but it will have a limit. Those are metal rods/plates locked into screws that go into your spinal body. They don't give. What gives is the vertebrae next to the ones that get fused. If you abuse the work they do, you will be back in to get a longer fuse because you will damage the surrounding bodies and discs.

My biggest advice is... if you feel this guy doesn't have enough experience, go to a university hospital. They do the most intricate and best work usually. They do 10x what the others do and typically have a better outcome.

Oh, btw, if it makes a difference, the fusion would be metric, just like your bike.  ;D ;D

Good luck in your decision, but I know if it were me, I'd do it. It means no more massive pain which in itself will change your life for the better. I wish that for you very much. Take care.

~MX
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2006 HD 883 Sportster, stock. No use changing it, it's still gonna be a Harley.

Offline bucky katt

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #15 on: December 25, 2009, 06:28:30 PM »
the hospital i go to is a teching hospital, for the USC school of medicine. i have heard too many horror stories from people that have had it done, though they were mostly having it done in the lumbar region. this is something i have to think long and hard about. i DO know that not even being able to brush my hair this morning sucked.
Of all God's creatures there is only one that cannot be made the slave of the lash. That one is the cat. If man could be crossed with the cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat.
Mark Twain - Notebook, 1894

Offline 78 k550

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #16 on: December 25, 2009, 06:47:38 PM »
I think they get better results in the c area than the L area. Just from the people that I have talked to about the neck. They said there real happy with the results. Mine was the muscle in between the shoulders all I had to do was look wrong and it was going to bother me but I could lift something heavy and not even worry about it. It is getting better with time. It is the loose fast turns that get me. If I kinda lock up to lift or move something no problems at all.
The Medical MaryJane really helps on those day's.

Paul
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Offline BobbyR

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #17 on: December 25, 2009, 06:54:43 PM »
Quote from: bucky katt liweight nk=topic=63209.msg688639#msg688639 date=1261794510
the hospital i go to is a teching hospital, for the USC school of medicine. i have heard too many horror stories from people that have had it done, though they were mostly having it done in the lumbar region. this is something i have to think long and hard about. i DO know that not even being able to brush my hair this morning sucked.
My 92 year old mother had bone spurs removed from the cervical area. I think it has better outcomes in the cervical region since it does not carry the weight the lumbar region does.
Dedicated to Sgt. Howard Bruckner 1950 - 1969. KIA LONG KHANH.

But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?

Offline MickeyX

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #18 on: December 25, 2009, 08:08:34 PM »
Yes, cervical fusion tends to have much better results than the lumbar. Your neck doesn't have to carry your whole body on it afterwards, just your head. Our patients go home the next day or the 2nd at the most. It might be difficult for you on a cafe'd bike, leaning forward and holding up your noggin after the operation but can you do it now? Probably not, the way it sounds. Like I said, it's not to get you back to brand new. It's to stop further progression and make it stable. In other words, this is going to get worse if you don't figure something out to do about it now. It will not heal itself. Ever. This is the best you may ever feel again without some type of intervention. I wish I could give you other words, but it's true. Don't wait to do something until it is so far gone that no amount of surgery or other things will do any good. That's what many people do and then they wonder why they didn't get the good results others did. Preventative maintenance on our machines saves a lot down the road and we all know it yet we don't treat ourselves as good as we do our toys.

Happy Holidays and good luck on your decision.  :)
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Offline bucky katt

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #19 on: December 25, 2009, 08:21:48 PM »
oh, i got rid of the clipons and the adjustable tomaselli bars 3 years ago. i AM going to see another neurosurgeon sometime in january (i'll call after the holidays) happy days folks, i didnt mention what i got in thr mail yesterday.........my approval for medicaid, SO i might could start seeing the docs i'm supposed to. i WILL not abuse it like some people, i hated to apply but there was just no way around it.
Of all God's creatures there is only one that cannot be made the slave of the lash. That one is the cat. If man could be crossed with the cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat.
Mark Twain - Notebook, 1894

Offline MickeyX

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #20 on: December 25, 2009, 08:23:39 PM »
Congrats on the medicaid. I hope you get the help you need on your spine and get back to living your life more fully again.  ;)
1969 CL350 Scrambler... almost done!!! Well, until something else goes wrong. :)
2006 HD 883 Sportster, stock. No use changing it, it's still gonna be a Harley.

Offline 78 k550

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #21 on: December 25, 2009, 08:25:19 PM »
I don't think it was a week after my MRI came back I was under the knife. Mine was pretty messed up. Pinching a nerve pretty good. I wasn't loosing and strength in my squeeze and my Dr. stated that is a good thing. If you start loosing strength there is damage going on to the nerve.

Paul

Paul
Littleton, CO

76/77 CB 750F, 
75 GL1000, (AKA GL1-242 NGWClub),
76 GL1000 LTD
84 GL1200 Standard
6 Bultaco's= 42, 49, 121, 152, 167, 188

Offline bucky katt

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #22 on: December 25, 2009, 08:31:58 PM »
i've had numbness and some minor co-ordination problems in my right arm/hand since i broke my neck nearly 3 years ago. the skin surface on my back, from the spine area right, and between the neck and beginning of the lumbar area also has absolutely no sensation in it. i got stung by several wasps there a couple of months ago and never felt it.
Of all God's creatures there is only one that cannot be made the slave of the lash. That one is the cat. If man could be crossed with the cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat.
Mark Twain - Notebook, 1894

Offline 78 k550

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #23 on: December 25, 2009, 08:46:18 PM »
I didn't know you had previous injuries. This was the first time I had to go under.
Hope it's my last.

Paul
Paul
Littleton, CO

76/77 CB 750F, 
75 GL1000, (AKA GL1-242 NGWClub),
76 GL1000 LTD
84 GL1200 Standard
6 Bultaco's= 42, 49, 121, 152, 167, 188

Offline BeSeeingYou

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Re: anyone here had vertabra fused?
« Reply #24 on: December 25, 2009, 08:47:26 PM »
One of my long time riding friends had something similar done several years ago.  While he can still ride, and long distances too, he found that he needed a fairing to lessen the wind pressure.  He bought a BMW K bike and had to park the Norton in the garage.
« Last Edit: December 25, 2009, 09:41:51 PM by srust58 »