Topic: shop owners...advise us

[Alan F.]

Own a shop? used to own a shop?  tell us all why to just let the idea of getting into the business pass.

[bucky katt]

the biggest reason i finally gave up on having my own shop was all the hoops i had to jump through for both the EPA and DHEC here in south carolina. the insurance is also out of sight. the purchase of equipment and building (if you want to own your building) is the least of your worries. i had planned on opening my own shop after a few years working for dealers, but it just didnt make financial sense to do it on my own. i DO do some work for a few people here in town that have airhead BMW motorcycles but i'm trying to fly under the radar so to speak so i dont get nailed by the authorities. i looked and researched for 2 years before deciding it just wasnt worth it to try and make it with a small shop.

[Uncle Ernie]

Inspections, fees, taxes, accountants, book keepers, taxes, insurance, 12 hour days 6 days a week after you get through the 14 hour days 7 days a week, saving enough to buy into a Parts Unlimited account, taxes, insurance, paying enough to keep a decent mechanic, parts and figuring out WHICH parts to stock, finding someone to merchandise things because your sense of design SUCKS, saying OK to people with SOHC4 Hondas who want the bike to run after it's been sitting for 12 years on the original tires and they only want to spend $100 because that's all it's worth to them, then getting tired of pushing 15 bikes out every day because you're so backed up with bikes that aren't worth your time but you can't say "no" to because you think you need the business and it SHOULD have only taken half a day (but...) yet these POS's aren't getting done, and people will pick your head about what tire to buy then order it on-line and want you to put it on their bike for $15 otherwise you're SUCH A DAMN RIP-OFF! 


How'm I doing?

[Uncle Ernie]

Oh yeah- nobody is buying anything fdrom dealers/shops these days except spark plugs.

[azuredesign]

fine kettle of fish you opened here Alan!

[simon#42]

Inspections, fees, taxes, accountants, book keepers, taxes, insurance, 12 hour days 6 days a week after you get through the 14 hour days 7 days a week, saving enough to buy into a Parts Unlimited account, taxes, insurance, paying enough to keep a decent mechanic, parts and figuring out WHICH parts to stock, finding someone to merchandise things because your sense of design SUCKS, saying OK to people with SOHC4 Hondas who want the bike to run after it's been sitting for 12 years on the original tires and they only want to spend $100 because that's all it's worth to them, then getting tired of pushing 15 bikes out every day because you're so backed up with bikes that aren't worth your time but you can't say "no" to because you think you need the business and it SHOULD have only taken half a day (but...) yet these POS's aren't getting done, and people will pick your head about what tire to buy then order it on-line and want you to put it on their bike for $15 otherwise you're SUCH A DAMN RIP-OFF! 


How'm I doing?

absolutely spot on
you did forget that everybody thinks you are rich because you have your own business , and thanks for fixing it so fast  can i pay you next week ?

[mrbreeze]

Couldn'ta said it better Ernie .....however I'm sure we can add to the fine list you started!!

[Uncle Ernie]

Almost forgot;
Orders that get lost, get found under phone messages after you THOUGHT you called them in and promised the parts would be here Friday, orders that the vendor doesn't tell you they're out of and take the liberty of back-ordering anyway with means the molds have to be made in Taiwan and cast just for YOU Mr always in a hurry in America man (Well I ordered it I'll see if I can figure out what's going on"), oh that cable is too long after all can I return this even though the dog ate the package, I'd want to order a part for my 350 it's XYZ but he really has a 360 but no one told him and YOU should have known it wouldn't fit and yeah there's a little oil in there but a hotter plug will clear that right up, so what plug do you recommend and your ace mechanic heard something fall on the floor and that motorcycle just came to a screeching stop in the parking lot because he put it all (well not ALL) back together anyway because it would take too long to find what fell.  I swear that actually happened, too.  It was a BMW 1200C.  And YOU are responsible for when your ace mechanic lies his ass off.  

If you ever stopped smoking and drinking, this is a good time to start again.  
 

[Uncle Ernie]

Here's another one I saw;  The guys in the parking lot bragging about his donuts and wheelies and burnouts.  As soon as you come out his whole demeanor changes;  "I'm PO'd maaan!  Tha new clutch is wore out already!  What's the warranty like?"

One last thing and then I'll stop.  You're also in charge of public relations which means everyone wants to talk to you personally, and maybe even get a better deal (wink wink) because they have lunch after church every Sunday with your cousin Adele (who?!).  After the 99th time you hear about someone's father, uncle, brother, grandfather, cousin-in-law, DI, school janitor, and I've always wanted one but something always came up when I or someone had a chancce to get one of those (fill in the blank)- it's hard to be interested when your almost had that little screw in just the right place and now this putz is blocking your light.

[Alan F.]

fine kettle of fish you opened here Alan!

It would seem so, I figured someone really needed to let it all go though.

Cheers Uncle Ernie, sounds like you've been in it a while.
-Alan

[Uncle Ernie]

Oh no.  I read a magazine article once.


Are you really thinking of hanging out a shingle?  And who's "we"?

[Alan F.]

It's always been a thought, it should likely be a passing thought though.  Maybe I'll just do what many others do and build a bike then sell it to build another bike. 
-A

[Uncle Ernie]

I know 4 people who began working on bikes in their own garage.  If you're good, eventually you'll need to decide to drop the "regular" job and go full time, or the other way around.   Starting out with added overhead like parts stock, rent, etc is crippling.  Plus- this is just a crap time to start a business in general. 
If you want to really be educated and do it right, do a business plan.  Boy- can THAT be depressing.  That's why I'd suggest working at home, under the radar.   At least until you build up a clientele and reputation.  The added benefit is you get to pick and choose the jobs (bikes and people).

[MötleyRöx]

Is it illegal to work on bikes for friends and have them pay you for it as long as it is agreed upon, even if in writing, that there is no liability implied or expressed?
Beyond the running a business from an unapproved location nonsense?

Let's put it this way... is it illegal to barter motorcycle repair services?

[Uncle Ernie]

Laws like that are going to vary by state, county, and city.

[754]

 I learned I am better off working for someone, paying all the overhead (still have my shop), and STILL HAVE a little money!!
(except I cant find a job in this economy.. )

 Then if I work 3-10 hrs a week, in my own shop , I am doing pretty good and am in the shop 2 or 3 hrs a day instead of 8 or more.

 So tight now, I try to pay my overhead and get by. Having a shop is the biggest reason I missed 15 years of riding...

 But hey, I get a dry place for my machine tools, which cost more than any bike I ever owned..

 Things will get better.. they CANT get worse..

 Guess I have to start advertising again..

[hahnda]

Call me crazy or call me stupid but I'm opening up my own shop. I've heard all the horror stories but it has to be better than no job? I was an engineer for 10 years after college but now I can't find work. Been laid off since last May. Not sure I want to go back to that type of work anyway but that's another story.

The wife and I discussed it at length and decided it was now or never for me. She was able to pick up the heath insurance. In the beginning I pretty much just have to make it work enough to support itself.

Only me, no employees planned for the short term. Shop is going into a new shed that I am in the process of building on our property. Having it at home is obviously good and bad. You are never away from it which is bad but you are always close to it which is good. No plans to have set hours in the beginning. Appointment only. There are days where I will not be able to work as I will be watching our kids when its her turn to work. I can make no commitments to be open on certain days.

So it pretty much sounds like I won't be doing anything, right? Not so. I already have more work than I can handle. I'm up to my ears in yammie 2 strokes from the 60's and I'm not even officially in business yet. I lucked into someone wanting LOTS of them running again.

Insurance is going to be about what I expected, its a lot but doable I guess. Estimated at about $2000 a year.

I hope to make it work. I'll be focusing on vintage bikes. Repairs, rebuilds and renovation. I don't want to get heavy into resto because its hard to find someone to pay for it. I won't be keeping much for inventory. I see no way that I can. I can have the basics on hand but the types of bikes will vary greatly I guess unless I have so much business I have to specialize.

Again call me crazy or stupid but I'm in to far now and liking it to much.

Pic of my shop in progress. 32x48 with a 12' porch

[hoodellyhoo]

Only me, no employees planned for the short term.

Can I send in an application anyways? Plan on doing any apprenticeships? (only half joking)

These old bikes are the only thing that truely capture my interest.

[hahnda]

Can I send in an application anyways? Plan on doing any apprenticeships? (only half joking)

These old bikes are the only thing that truely capture my interest.

Half Joking? 
I'm not old enough to have an apprentice!
If you ever find yourself on this side of the state look me up.

[andy750]

Good luck Kevin! I hope its a success!

Nice looking place as well.

cheers
Andy

[MötleyRöx]

hahnda... I hate to inform you, but that is not a shed. 
Good for you, we'll be rootin' for ya!   

[Uncle Ernie]

Man- if that's a shed, does your house have it's own ZIP Code?

[Rocking-M]

I went by a shop last friday and bought some spark plugs.

[hahnda]

I didn't mean for this to be a thread hijack.....

Its big but not huge. I already think its to small and I'm not even in it. Heated floor. 16x32 room upstairs. Vaulted ceiling in the front area. 10x10 paint room. 10x10 grinding and blast booth room to keep the main area cleaner. I think I went a bit overboard but I'm only getting one chance at this.

I hope this doesn't happen but if things fall through I'll always have the shop I always wanted.

I hope it all works out, time will tell.

Now lets get back to the details as to why a person shouldn't do this in the first place.

[Uncle Ernie]

If someone is good; that means you can read a wiring diagram and follow wires, you can diagnose and balance a bank of carbs, you have the ability to say "I don't know- but I klnow how to find out", you can spot desperate moves that will get you in trouble, and you can keep pares and records organized- I think a person should be an independant mechanic.  I think it's a mistake to open a commercial space until you have money saved and ready when your overhead overtakes the business. 

I've watched a lot of businesses start and fail.  Some one who cooks;  friends are wowed and get together to set him up in a restaurant.  Only problem is, he isn't especially a good judge of character and hires asshats for waiters that don't show up and dishwashers who steal, doesn't understand how to buy supplies so he always pays top dollar for everything, doesn't understand what to charge for items and even how much he really needs to bring in in the first place, receipts? What receipts?
The same thing for a shop here with a great location.  His Partner is going down the drain because he can't/won't sink more money into a place that doesn't make enough money.  he can't pay a good mechanic, he doesn't really know how to work on bikes himself, doesn't write parts orders down, blah blah blah.

OTOH- I see guys very successful starting out in their home garage and building a reputation.  Two guys now pick and choose their customers- and they CHARGE FOR THE WORK.  They give a realistic estimate right up front.  That weeds a lot of deadbeats out- but you're not being hired to be a sympathetic grandmother.

Most shops won't touch an older bike and I believe a demand is out there- for sure.  (OK- maybe I worked in a couple of shops, too...    )