Topic: bruce springsteen sues a new york bar

[bucky katt]

i'm sorry but while i can understand the artists not liking filesharing and maybe going after major offenders but suing a bar because it charged admission to see a band that did covers of 3 of his songs? #$%* springsteen, he started to dig a hole in my eyes when the cheap seats at a concert he did here a few years ago were 175 dollars each, those were the cheapest seats too! but now this? i have lost whatever respect i had left for him.

http://music.msn.com/music/article.aspx?news=456503&GT1=28102



WENN -- Bruce Springsteen is taking legal action against the owners of a New York bar who allegedly failed to obtain permission to play The Boss' songs.

The "Born to Run" rocker filed a copyright infringement lawsuit against Connolly's Pub & Restaurant on Wednesday, claiming the venue's bosses charged customers a fee to hear a band perform three of Springsteen's tracks in August 2008.

But the bar, on West 45th Street in Manhatttan, allegedly failed to pay an annual licensing fee to the American Society of Composers, Authors and Publishers (ASCAP), according to the New York Daily News.

Photos: Bruce Springsteen

ASCAP is responsible for collecting royalties and distributing the money to artists.

A spokesperson for the organisation claims Springsteen isn't suing for profit, but instead to protect the rights of composers.

The ASCAP Senior Vice President For Licensing, Vincent Candilora, explains, "It's not about him as a recording artist. In this instance, he's simply a songwriter with rights.
"We had been after them (Connolly's) for complying for over two years, so it's not so much about who or where. Why should those places that are complying with the law be at a competitive disadvantage?"

The band is said to have played three Springsteen songs at the summertime gig: "Growin' Up," "Because the Night" and "You're No Good."

The latter was written by Clinton Ballard Jr., a co-plaintiff in the case.

[333]

I don't disagree with you on what you paid for those seats back then, but this case sounds like Spruce(*) and the ASCAP are just coming down on a habitual offender.


(*) Spruce Bedspring

[tramp]

get over it bruce

[bucky katt]

get over it bruce

+1

[MCRider]

I don't disagree with you on what you paid for those seats back then, but this case sounds like Spruce(*) and the ASCAP are just coming down on a habitual offender.


(*) Spruce Bedspring

True the way copyright and trademark rules work, if you don't defend your rights, you run the risk of losing them. And you can't pick and choose who you ignore and who you go after. Simply the rules. If you establish a pattern of not defending your copyrights against all comers, someone else can make the case that you don't want them and can take them.

Its the "copyright attorney full employment act" at work. The artist is helpless to be the good guy and will always come out looking bad.

[volkswagendan]

bruce is a down to earth guy.  he's not the type of person that goes after someone without  reason.
i bet if you really educate yourself on this matter you might understand why he is doing it.

[Don R]

I bet he got blinded by the light, revved up like a deuce, another runner in the night. Oh Oh. Now we're in trouble.

[MickeyX]

I think if you want to use someone else's stuff, you ask permission either by contacting them and getting the okay or you pay royalties. They knew the rules. They figured they would get away with it. They got slapped. Don't take what ain't yours. We all learned that by age 4.

VWDan is right, Bruce is a stand up guy. He doesn't need the $$. He is doing it because it belongs to him, not them. Just like if someone sat on your bike and then rode off on it and then sold it on CL. You better believe, every single one of you guys would be after them because you paid your "royalties" to own it with both $$ and hard work, so it's yours. If it was you and someone stole it and made $$ off of your stuff, you'd be going after them with more than a lawyer and you know it. (and we'd all be with you, IC with his billet rake of course  ) It's the same thing. Stealing is stealing. 

Hey VWDan... is Franks Deli still open over there? I remember ordering an egg salad sandwich and they made the salad fresh right there. Mmmmmm. We'll be out on the east coast during Labor Day week the way it looks, visiting my family and friends. I may have to take some time and show Kit around Joisey. They seem to be putting some $$ back into your area. It's about damn time. I saw I missed the zombie walk last year. I heard it was to die for.   

Great, now I'm getting hungry for some boardwalk fries, a cheese steak sandwich and a birch beer. And some brains.

[Retro Rocket]

I have been playing in "covers" bands for years covering most genre's and never once have i heard of anyone contacting the owner of any music before playing it unless they were a mainstream band and were getting airplay with it or were putting it on an album......Just saying..

Mick

[volkswagendan]

I think if you want to use someone else's stuff, you ask permission either by contacting them and getting the okay or you pay royalties. They knew the rules. They figured they would get away with it. They got slapped. Don't take what ain't yours. We all learned that by age 4.

VWDan is right, Bruce is a stand up guy. He doesn't need the $$. He is doing it because it belongs to him, not them. Just like if someone sat on your bike and then rode off on it and then sold it on CL. You better believe, every single one of you guys would be after them because you paid your "royalties" to own it with both $$ and hard work, so it's yours. If it was you and someone stole it and made $$ off of your stuff, you'd be going after them with more than a lawyer and you know it. (and we'd all be with you, IC with his billet rake of course  ) It's the same thing. Stealing is stealing. 

Hey VWDan... is Franks Deli still open over there? I remember ordering an egg salad sandwich and they made the salad fresh right there. Mmmmmm. We'll be out on the east coast during Labor Day week the way it looks, visiting my family and friends. I may have to take some time and show Kit around Joisey. They seem to be putting some $$ back into your area. It's about damn time. I saw I missed the zombie walk last year. I heard it was to die for.   

Great, now I'm getting hungry for some boardwalk fries, a cheese steak sandwich and a birch beer. And some brains.

 
mickey, if you two show up in ASBURY PARK  and dont shout me out you're on alot of trouble.=)
(i even have a guest room and a couple extra bikes for you.)
Franks is still open. 3 generations behind the counter now. AND they're still pumping out the best food here in AP!
I eat there at least twice a week.  ...and as for the town,  Its come back BIG time. google ABURY PARK, NJ.
GREAT PLACES TO EAT, AWESOME BEACH, AND AMAZING DIVERSE PEOPLE here now. (sorry about the caps lock.)
i'll show you two the town.  ...we might even run into Bruce.

[MCRider]

I have been playing in "covers" bands for years covering most genre's and never once have i heard of anyone contacting the owner of any music before playing it unless they were a mainstream band and were getting airplay with it or were putting it on an album......Just saying..

Mick

Of course no one would voluntarily contact the owner before hand. They'd have to pay for sure, or not use it.  But still that's the rule.  No one voluntarily turns themselves in for speeding either.  Just saying... 

I remember playing in our High School band, our band director was real anal about getting permission to play copyrighted material. Most band directors don't bother as permission is usually automatic (though not absolute) for non-profits. Still that's the rule.

[333]

I get the impression from the article Bucky posted that each club pays a yearly fee to the ASCAP for the right to have bands play covers, not a fee for each song.  So this would be transparent to any band playing a club.

[paulages]

i can find dozens of terrible covers of my bands' songs on youtube, and i can' tell you i don't give two #$%*s, and we're not millionaires. i can't find find any logic in thinking that a band doing a cover of another artist's song is affecting that artist in a negative way, unless the band becomes seriously profitable off of it. ASCAP sucks donkey dicks. for the most part clubs pay ASCAP, bands pay ASCAP, and most people wonder who's making any money besides ASCAP. my girlfiend receives a quarterly check from ASCAP, but it's small and she's the only person i know whose band pays in and actually makes anything.

someone's covering your song. it's flattery. people only want to hear the original more. it's not like a band playing covers in a club is the same as say, the Black Crowes covering Otis Redding and making a video of it, etc. and a whole generation has no clue that it's not BC's song.

get over it. you're a millionaire, bruce.

[paulages]

if none of you have ever worked at a club or bar and experienced the ASCAP folks, it's very mafia-like. basically they come in all tough telling you you'll be sued millions for listening to a song on your ipod while washing the dishes, and force payments out of you. a friend of mine's bar just finally ponied up the $600 a year after constant tony sopranos type dudes wouldn't leave her alone for playing mostly uncopyrighted punk songs on the employees IPODs.

[sangyo soichiro]

Bruce is getting a bad rap for this.  He had no idea of the law suit and demands his name be removed from it.

"Upon learning of this lawsuit this morning, Bruce Springsteen's representatives demanded the immediate removal of his name from the lawsuit."

http://www.dnainfo.com/20100205/midtown-west-hells-kitchen/bruce-springsteen-says-he-had-no-idea-about-lawsuit-against-midtown-pub

So much for giving Bruce the benefit of the doubt....

[paulages]

like i said, ASCAP sucks. good job, boss.

[MickeyX]

Good on ya, Bruce!! 

[bucky katt]

i can find dozens of terrible covers of my bands' songs on youtube, and i can' tell you i don't give two #$%*s, and we're not millionaires. i can't find find any logic in thinking that a band doing a cover of another artist's song is affecting that artist in a negative way, unless the band becomes seriously profitable off of it. ASCAP sucks donkey dicks. for the most part clubs pay ASCAP, bands pay ASCAP, and most people wonder who's making any money besides ASCAP. my girlfiend receives a quarterly check from ASCAP, but it's small and she's the only person i know whose band pays in and actually makes anything.

someone's covering your song. it's flattery. people only want to hear the original more. it's not like a band playing covers in a club is the same as say, the Black Crowes covering Otis Redding and making a video of it, etc. and a whole generation has no clue that it's not BC's song.

get over it. you're a millionaire, bruce.

this is exactly how i felt after reading this article, you just put it into words i couldnt!!

[mystic_1]

Good on ya, Bruce!! 

That seems like a reversal of your earlier position?  Before he was a stand-up guy for suing to protect his property, now he's a stand-up guy for saying he'd never have participated in the suit if he'd known about it?

mystic_1

[MickeyX]

No, I said he was a stand up guy. Then a "period". That is the end of a sentence and statement. Then I said he had the right to sue due to current laws and such was doing so to protect his property. I still believe he has that right. He, in my opinion, did the right thing over all by just walking away. But he would have still been in the right to sue. Bad karma if he hadn't walked away?  Probably but it was still his decision. As I said, he doesn't need the $$ but it's his stuff to fight over or not.

I too would rather have seen him walk away from this one but... whatever. If it was mine, I'd be hard pressed to just look the other way unless I knew the circumstances and felt I could "afford" it. But, I wouldn't fault a person for suing in this case. Is ASCAP a PITA? It seems so, as Paul has attested to. In this case, it wasn't a big deal to Bruce. But, if that was a struggling band who needed the money or a writer who needed it...   

Good on ya, Bruce!! 

That seems like a reversal of your earlier position?  Before he was a stand-up guy for suing to protect his property, now he's a stand-up guy for saying he'd never have participated in the suit if he'd known about it?

mystic_1

[bucky katt]

it seems he's demanding that his name is taken off the lawsuit. this makes me feel alot better about the whole situation. the "big bad record companies" are expected to do #$%* like this.

[oldbiker]

Who really cares about another overpaid musician?

[mystic_1]

They knew the rules. They figured they would get away with it.

He is doing it because it belongs to him, not them.

If it was you and someone stole it and made $$ off of your stuff, you'd be going after them with more than a lawyer and you know it.

There's a danger in assuming you know what is in the mind of others. 

mystic_1

[volkswagendan]

Who really cares about another overpaid musician?

i do. he's a good man. and he has done great things for our town.  dont be a hater.

[hs2k007]

We might as well start staking out every bar that has a band.  I have been to many that have bands playing tons of different music from tons of different artists.  The bar charged a cover as well, so are they in trouble too??  I would agree, if the bar bands were making CD's or getting airplay, they should pay royalties.  But come on, a half drunk band thats getting paid on whiskey and cigarettes give me a break.  Look for it, because it is coming, you will have to pay to listen to the radio before long (other than XM or Sirus).  Your standard broadcast radios will become talk shows and news, and any real music will be on XM or Sirus.  Look at MTV for example, no music on the damn station anymore, you have to buy the upper cable packages to get your music videos back.