Author Topic: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (warning LOTS of pics)  (Read 49498 times)

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Offline goaarongo

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #25 on: September 22, 2010, 09:47:32 AM »
Too sweet.  I love that picture with the jack inside the frame.  Can't wait to see more.

Offline Anti-Johnny

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #26 on: October 12, 2010, 08:57:29 PM »
I appreciate the detail in your post. I am on my first project bike and this has helped me learn a lot.
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Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #27 on: February 08, 2015, 12:14:33 AM »
Hello gents,

So it's been a very long time since I have posted here, life has been pretty busy in the last few years.  I've picked up a few new hobbies, been doing a lot of volunteer work and charity work, making new friends, goofing off in new and interesting ways, and also in between all that I've been managing to get a couple of things done on the bike project.

Recently I've decided to get back into posting here and have just finished a reading binge to try to catch up on recent events around the board.  Glad to see a bunch of familiar names still kicking around.  It'll take me quite a while to get this thread up to date, but I'll try to update it regularly.

In the meantime, I'll just leave this here....



mystic_1
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (new updates 2-8-15)
« Reply #28 on: February 08, 2015, 12:23:33 AM »
And a few more teasers, until I can get some more organized posts assembled (nearly 2000 photos from 2014 alone   :-[ )



























mystic_1
« Last Edit: February 08, 2015, 12:35:23 AM by mystic_1 »
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline seanbarney41

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (new updates 2-8-15)
« Reply #29 on: February 08, 2015, 12:38:41 AM »
just a young blood digging the sohc4 history
If it works good, it looks good...

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (new updates 2-8-15)
« Reply #30 on: February 23, 2015, 06:06:22 AM »
So I'd mentioned back in post #17 that I'd finished the bottom-end reassembly, but never got around to a detailed post. 

No-numbers replacement crankcase.






This crankcase was in good shape overall however I did find a single crack near the final drive area.  Looks to me as if the person disassembling this engine missed a fastener and tried to lift the cases apart with one bolt still in place. 







This is a non-stressed part of the case, so rather than having it welded I chose to fix this with JB weld, like so:

Cleaned everything thoroughly with acetone.  Blew some pressurized air through the crack to dry things out.  Marked the damaged area, masked things off.  Warmed up the crankcase with a light bulb.





Inserted some long bolts into the adjacent bolt holes and then applied pressure with a set of welding pliers to spread the crack out ever-so-slightly.



Mixed up some slow-curing JB Weld. 





Pushed this through the crack from the inside using my finger until the JB Weld oozed out the other side of the crack.



Cleaned the excess from the inside and outside of the case, then released pressure on the bolts.  Good squeeze-out observed on both sides, indicating plenty of JB Weld inside the crack.





Placed some wax paper across the mating surface to avoid things sticking together which shouldn't.  Bolted the case halves back together.  Pressure from the fasteners caused the crack to want to close up on it's own, this squeezed some of the JB weld back out of the crack.







Left the crankcase to dry overnight.

Disassembled the case, so far so good.





As you probably noticed above, it was not possible to get the JB Weld worked in the the full length of the crack because it was more of a hairline fracture away from the mating surface.  What I had accomplished at this point was to bring the part back into shape/alignment.  Now I'd seal the rest of the crack to prevent weeping.

Masked off the area again and chucked a carbide cutter into the Dremel.






V-grooved the full length of the crack on both the inside and the outside.





Mixed up some Fasweld repair putty.  This is a reinforced epoxy putty that is extremely simple to use, fast drying, and has some pretty amazing strength.  I actually keep a stick of this stuff in my car at all times in case of emergency, I literally don't leave home without it.



To use this stuff, cut off a hunk and then knead the stuff together to mix the two components.  This stuff has the consistency of somewhat dry modelling clay, so I wouldn't have been able to use it above to seal the inside of the crack, but it'll work well for what comes next.



Pressed and formed the Fasweld putty into the V-grooves.  Molded the putty into a pleasing shape that blends with the existing contours.  Tried not to lay it on too thick.  There's plenty of clearance on the inside of the case (checked with clay and the tranny shafts in place, plenty of room).  Once the putty dried, I sanded it down a bit and then used an extra-fine honing stone to make sure the mating surface was completely flush and smooth.  I touched this area up with some paint and the repair is practically invisible.







"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (new updates 2-8-15)
« Reply #31 on: February 23, 2015, 06:35:01 AM »
There are at least three variations on the CB750 final drive shaft.  The differences are in the outboard bearing, and the auto-chain-oiling mechanism.

The new crankcase is machined to accept the later-style final drive shaft with the dual-row bearings, so I sourced the appropriate shaft and gears.



The earliest final drive shaft had a single-row bearing, with a notch for a half-circle locating ring.



The next iteration of the shaft had a single-row bearing with no notch, and used a full-circle locating ring outboard of the bearing.





The third iteration of the shaft had the double-row bearing, no notch, using the same full-circle locating ring. 



In all three instances, the location of the outer surface of the bearing is unchanged.  The third variation of the shaft moves the bearing inward to accommodate the additional width of the bearing.  You can also see that in version 2, the shaft has been beefed up in between the bearing and the gear.



As far as I can tell, the first two versions of the shaft should be completely interchangable.  The third variation of the shaft is different and cannot be used with the single-row bearing setup.  The shaft required depends on how the crankcase has been machined.
















I also observed some slight variations between kick start shafts.  These seem to be purely cosmetic.  As you can see the lower shaft in this photo has a rough-cast appearance in the middle section of the shaft whereas the other two are machined in this area.  They seem functionally equal to me.




"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline MCRider

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (new updates 2-8-15)
« Reply #32 on: February 23, 2015, 09:44:17 AM »
Dang Mystic! 5 years. It'll take a while to get reaquainted with your thread. Carry on!   ;D
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (new updates 2-8-15)
« Reply #33 on: February 23, 2015, 10:32:03 AM »
Oh, you ain't seen nothing yet.  Part of my problem right now is digging through the thousands of pics I have backlogged and putting it into coherent form.  :o

Fortunately the bike itself is all done and buttoned up and I actually got in a couple hundred miles last fall before weather forced me to put it up for the winter.

Expect many more rambling, picture-heavy posts from me in the future  ;D

mystic_1
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline MCRider

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (new updates 2-8-15)
« Reply #34 on: February 23, 2015, 11:21:11 AM »
Oh, you ain't seen nothing yet.  Part of my problem right now is digging through the thousands of pics I have backlogged and putting it into coherent form.  :o

Fortunately the bike itself is all done and buttoned up and I actually got in a couple hundred miles last fall before weather forced me to put it up for the winter.

Expect many more rambling, picture-heavy posts from me in the future  ;D

mystic_1

Kewl!   8)
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild (new updates 2-8-15)
« Reply #35 on: February 24, 2015, 09:09:35 PM »
Blasted apart the transmission.    Mostly this was to clean out any junk from the damage pictured earlier in the thread.  Found the gears and the shafts to be in good shape, so no replacements were necessary.



All transmission bearings were replaced.



I also chose to replace the retaining circlips in the tranny while I had it apart, because why not?



Early CB750 transmission gears had bronze bushings.  Hondaman has mentioned these in some of his posts.  They look like this:



When reassembling the transmission, make sure that all the oiling holes are properly aligned.  Pictured is one of the bushings that run under the freewheeling gears.



Also don't forget the thrust washers.



One goes here:



The other goes here:



I also replaced the needle bearings in the primary driven sprocket.









Assembled, lubed, ready to install.



"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #36 on: April 25, 2015, 04:53:25 AM »
Crank was inspected/measured and found to be in reasonable condition, so nothing was done to it. 



I installed all-new bearing shells and measured with Plastiguage.  Clearances turned out a wee bigger than I'd prefer, largest was bigger than 0.038 but smaller than 0.051, I guesstimate around 0.047 mm.  Standard bearing clearance should be between 0.02 and 0.046 so this is just barely beyond that but well within the replacement spec of 0.08, so I decided to run with it.  If I ever get back inside the lower end I may step up a bearing size to bring down the clearances.






Stock rods were measured, checked for straightness, and then re-used with fresh bearing shells. 



I marked the rods to ensure I kept then in the original locations.  Using a spring punch I mark them on the flats like so.  This is number three. 



Don't know that it makes any difference, but I also maintained the original front-back orientation on the rods, so they're installed and oriented exactly where they came from.

All new big-end bolts and nuts.  Note there are some very small differences between the original parts and the superseded replacements, but nothing dramatic.















All torqued up.  Also visible:  Brand New primary chains.




mystic_1


"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #37 on: April 25, 2015, 05:00:10 AM »
I didn't end up re-using the original pistons however during disassembly I marked these also for their installed location.  I mark pistons on the wrist pin boss inside the piston.  Here's the #3 to go along with the rod pictured above.



mystic_1
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #38 on: April 25, 2015, 05:22:38 AM »
Although I was installing new primary chains and a new primary tensioner....



... I still decided to make a shim to fit under the primary tensioner spring, to give a little more pressure on the primary chains in an effort to further reduce chain noise.  I'm not sure this was necessary but the bike sure is quiet :)







This was all checked carefully to not interfere with the tensioner action.  The second chamfered hole makes sure it fits flat over the locating pin's "head".  The width keeps it snug inside the tensioner's ID and the reduced width on the tail matches the tensioner's footprint.



Probably way over-engineered  :P





As you can see this adds a moderate amount of preload to the tensioner, and may help more if you're re-using an older tired tensioner.





mystic_1
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #39 on: April 25, 2015, 06:06:39 AM »
A new cam chain was added at this point.



Here's the final drive shaft configuration I ended up settling on.  As per a Hondaman suggestion, I opted to go with a single-row outboard bearing and therefore used the middle of the three shafts pictured above.  I already had a new bearing single-row bearing; it has a notch for a locating ring but this will not be used because this case uses the full-circle retainer.







This all works because the combination of the case and shaft locates the bearing's outer surface in the same place that the dual-row bearing would be.  The later shaft would not work with single-row bearings because the bearing would be too far inboard.



I did decide to keep the final drive automatic lubrication system, but I adjusted it to minimum flow and will inspect/lube the chain manually for the most part.  So, the oil catch tray was installed. 

You can also see in this picture that this crankcase has a built-in shoulder to locate the inner bearing, and doesn't use a locating ring.  Therefore the notch on the inner bearing is also unneeded in this case, but again I already had the bearing so I used it.



The original (earliest) shaft takes a different auto-oiler assembly and that's what made me settle on this particular shaft as I didn't have the early-style oiler components.



Attached to this post is the Honda Service Bulletin discussing the differences in crankcases, output shafts, and bearings.





"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline koendd

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #40 on: April 26, 2015, 03:55:04 AM »
awesome build and info!

looks like rocket sience to me but hope to dive into this myself one day...
1972 cb750K2 brat
1976 cb360
1984 GPZ900R

Offline Desert-SOHC

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #41 on: February 23, 2016, 07:20:36 PM »
Any new updates?

Mable is a runner so the engine wont come apart, but what you did to the frame and geometry is similar to where I'm going with her.
90 F350 Lariat CS S/C Dually
90 S&S 11SC Cabover Camper
97 FLHTP (under construction)
11 Ranger S/C 2wd

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #42 on: February 23, 2016, 08:19:36 PM »
Yeah, um, I've been pretty remiss in updating this thread.

The bike is all done, painted, and been riding it for a while now. 

I'll throw down some details on what all I did to the frame soon.

mystic_1
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline Desert-SOHC

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #43 on: February 24, 2016, 08:08:31 AM »
^^^ cool  :D
90 F350 Lariat CS S/C Dually
90 S&S 11SC Cabover Camper
97 FLHTP (under construction)
11 Ranger S/C 2wd

Offline Sgt.Pinback

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #44 on: February 24, 2016, 01:33:49 PM »
Fantastic docu!
Doc, I love a motorcycle!

Offline mystic_1

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #45 on: February 24, 2016, 06:03:10 PM »
OH before I dive into things again, important tip:

Do not assemble your motor in your basement.  Hauling it up stairs by yourself sucks.

mystic_1
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #46 on: February 24, 2016, 08:07:15 PM »
OH before I dive into things again, important tip:

Do not assemble your motor in your basement.  Hauling it up stairs by yourself sucks.

mystic_1

That sounds pretty damn awful.  :P
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline wowbagger

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #47 on: February 24, 2016, 08:45:40 PM »
subscribed

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #48 on: February 25, 2016, 12:02:18 PM »
Given the title of the thread, it had to be done:

1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline budman

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Re: It's a chopper, baby. My CB750K0 rebuild
« Reply #49 on: February 26, 2016, 06:35:17 AM »
Can we see the finished bike?
Bud

1973 CB750K3 Chopper
2021 Indian Scout