Topic: My 78 CB550 says I need to change shops (or do work myself)

[locostbamboo]

Just had it in for cam chain noise and gas leak at interior carbs.  They replaced the float bowl gaskets and tightened the cam chain tensioner.  Said it was maxed out and that I might consider selling the bike and getting something newer. I have a little less than 11K miles on it and am just starting to get some time on it again after being off it since October or so.  Bike shop said ethanol shrinks the rubber gaskets and leaks will continue.  If my tensioner is maxed out, am I looking at a major expense to fix this?  Interested in your thoughts.
Thanks.

Rob in Oregon

[campbmic]

How well do you know this bike shop? I was 16 years old and had a 1982 Suzuki GS650 and abused the crap out of it and never changed the oil. I was young and stupid. Anyways, it got this terrible knocking noise and I took it to a bike shop. They charged me $250 and said they opened up the top end and my cam chain tensioner was maxed out and I had to replace the cam chain. They quoted me $1500 to do it. I took the bike home got a manual and quickly got into the top end. The cam chain was within spec and I could tighten the tensioner and it still had more room. The sorry SOBs didn't even open the thing up! It turned out to be a thrown main bearing by the way!

Anyways, ever since then I've done two things;
1) Treated my vehicles a lot better
2) Done all of the work I can do on my own

I'm very weary of anything a shop says now a days. These bikes are pretty noisey and maybe your cam chain is fine. In any scenario YOU can replace your cam chain with a weekend of work and a good workshop manual (found on this site for free). As for the float bowl gaskets, I've never heard of anyone having troubles like that. I'm pretty sure these gaskets are gasoline proof.

Download the workshop manual in the FAQ section and do all of the tune up procedures. When I first got my 1975 CB550 I had a ticking noise in the engine and it was smoking. All I had to do was clean out the carbs and adjust the tappet clearances THREE TIMES. The tappet clearances are hard to get right but they will make a noticeable noise if they aren't set perfect.

Hope that helps! Also, did they suggest buying a new bike at their shop? That can always explain a lot.

[Hush]

Ha ha ha ha ha what a crock man!
Ride it and enjoy it, bet you get a few years out of it before it needs all that work.
These bikes were meant to last, the Japanese had not quite got the idea of planned obsolesence when they made them.
My 650 knocks like a Jehovah Witness convention, live with it.

[dave500]

interiour carb leaks?im guessing you mean the "inboard" pair?what?so a slight weep or really leaking?itll be a major expense to pay a shop to do it all!if you dont have tools and cant fix a lawn mower then doing the cam chain and tentioner yourself is a little out of your bounds,,ill bet the shop is crapping you to trade a good old bike and sell you one of theirs!have you got any knowedgable buddies who might have a look at it?maybe a local forum member could have a look?it might just need a tappet adjustment?

[Old75_ratafe]

Hey guys he did say ethanol not regular gas right?  I know on some older car carbs you do have to change gaskets because it will shrink them.  As far as the cam chain though yea defiantly get a second opinion.

[jason teamshralp]

Which shop is it? some of the shops around portland are full of such arrogant pricks, they will tell you anything just to make you feel dumb and try and take your money. I had two shops quote me $35 per wheel to remove tires! went to another shop and the guy did four wheels for $40 out the door in an hour.

Sounds like you should try and adjust the tensioner, and if not take the top end off and look around. Just make sure to follow a manuel and take your time. If you get stuck ask questions here. I've been in the middle of fixing my bike multiple times and had to ask someone on here, which way does this go, or how tight on this?

[jason teamshralp]

Hey guys he did say ethanol not regular gas right?  I know on some older car carbs you do have to change gaskets because it will shrink them.  As far as the cam chain though yea defiantly get a second opinion.

I think they are talking about the 10% that is mixed into our gas. It hasn't been a problem for my '78 550 and I left gas in the carbs, tank, and fuel lines all winter. Only problem was a dirty jet I had to clean.

[dave500]

we still have eth free petrol here,,we have a 10% cheap option at most stations,,but are not condemned to it yet,um,,eth has caused fuel system foul ups here on later cars latetly,,ask if they have any asbestos based gaskets(keep a straight face),i dont think you should open up the top end if you dont feel confident about tackling it yourself,having said that plenty of guys have gleaned enough info from here and other sites to do what was needed in similar cases,,have you looked in the FAQ section?,how tooled up are you?good wrench and socket set at least?are you prepared to knock some skin off your knuckles?umm,with all due respect,plan A can become plan B within a few bolts being undone,i think the shop is stooging you,try and find a second free opinion,cheers.

[Old75_ratafe]

Hey guys he did say ethanol not regular gas right?  I know on some older car carbs you do have to change gaskets because it will shrink them.  As far as the cam chain though yea defiantly get a second opinion.

I think they are talking about the 10% that is mixed into our gas. It hasn't been a problem for my '78 550 and I left gas in the carbs, tank, and fuel lines all winter. Only problem was a dirty jet I had to clean.

Good point now that I'm really thinking on it that was pure ethanol race gas 110+ octane or something.

[lrutt]

There is no FOOKING way you have maxed out cam chain adjustment and have a worn out cam chain in 11k miles. They are so full of #$%* their eyes are brown. I wouldn't ever let them touch my bike again if I were you.

[andy750]

Bike shop said ethanol shrinks the rubber gaskets and leaks will continue.  If my tensioner is maxed out, am I looking at a major expense to fix this?  Interested in your thoughts.

hey Rob you have come to the right place! First off EtOh while not great for rubber gaskets when stored for prolonged periods is no problem at all when the bike is run regularly. Change your own gaskets (not so hard to do) since they cost low $$s and as long as they are seated correctly they should not leak (40,000 leak-free miles backs up this claim and all the bikes running on this Forum cant all be leaking!).

Unless your bike has been raced hard then the cam chain is unlikely to be "maxed out" and likely needs adjusting. Depending on the prior history of the bike (did it sit for a long period unused?) its possible the cam chain tensioner is sticking/stuck. I only have experience with the 750s but if the 550 is the same its easy enough to remove the tensioner to check working operation - a manual helps considerably here. As others have said download from this site.

Final point - if you are near Portland there are plenty of SOHC members who can help out (Paulages has a shop as well I believe - would be worth checking him out or asking him directly for advice). Old bikes require some hands on maintenance so if you want to ride a classic you need to get your hands dirty .

Also consider changing the title of this thread to:

"My 78 CB550 says I should consider changing bike shops" 

Good luck
Andy

[Stev-o]

Don't ever go back to that shop! EVER!!

[Simpson]

Some great advice here. Have to say that your cam chain could not possibly be maxed out.
Unless you have extremely good friends in the business, do your own work.
Folks here are everything you need for support system.

[KB02]

Just had it in for cam chain noise and gas leak at interior carbs.  They replaced the float bowl gaskets and tightened the cam chain tensioner.  Said it was maxed out and that I might consider selling the bike and getting something newer. I have a little less than 11K miles on it and am just starting to get some time on it again after being off it since October or so.  Bike shop said ethanol shrinks the rubber gaskets and leaks will continue.  If my tensioner is maxed out, am I looking at a major expense to fix this?  Interested in your thoughts.
Thanks.

Rob in Oregon

Honestly it sounds to me like they are overstocked on new bikes (probably last year's models) and are doing everything they can to sell them off - including scaring people who don't do their own work. Either that or they have gotten rid of their service manuals and are guessing when it comes time to work on the bikes.

Don't loose hope. Your bike is still ready to roll!

[Nikkisixx]

Hopefully the prior posts have you feeling better about your bike.  If not, I'm sure any of these guys will give you $10 for it.  I'll give you $15 

[ieism]

No need for a new bike. I'm pretty sure you can get the camchain noise out yourself, with a little time and pratice. Adjusting camchain tension is a bit tricky on 550's, but there are many treads on this specific topic here. It will take you a few hours the first time, but you'll probably do a better job than you bikeshop did.
Syncing your carbs will make it a lot less noisy in the top end too, especially at idle.

Floatbowl gaskets can still be bought new, and keep your carbs leakfree for a long time..

[bikerbart]

Almost everytime I go to a shop where they dont know me they always say,"what you need is a new bike."It drives me crazy,I hate when they say that,its usually fresh recruits from a MC training school who know nothing but sportbikes.But when they come out and look at my bike they always oooh and aah over it and change their mind.The local Honda dealer in town is horrible.I asked the kid at the parts counter to look for a part for my bike and he proceeds to tell me my bike doesnt exist,so I ask him if you have to know anything about bikes to work here?Then I proceed to school him on what he should already know.

[Inigo Montoya]

1 thing i would add is to ride the bike easy for a couple of days. I am not saying the shop would do anything to make you wreck but if they do not know these bikes, then they may have done something without knowing what would happen.

[Operator]

Hate to sound like a parrot, but I have come to trust forum members advice waaaaay more than a shop. The shop I order parts through is the only one I trust because he told me straight away....I don't know anything about bikes prior to 1990 and I wouldn't want to muck it up....but I can order you whatever you want.   That said, your bike will be fine, find a local forum member or a manual and off you go. I am a mechanical retard and have pulled off some jobs that are way out of my league due to the support of this forum.

Good Luck

[Hannibal Smith]

There is no FOOKING way you have maxed out cam chain adjustment and have a worn out cam chain in 11k miles. They are so full of #$%* their eyes are brown. I wouldn't ever let them touch my bike again if I were you.

Agree- Highly unlikely, I just got into a 24,000 mile motor and it looks brand spanking new. Cam tensioner slipper is worn, but still has life (I replaced it anyway) but it cost me $63.00 for the part.

Out of every 200 "mechanics" that work at a motorbike shop, 1 knows what he is doing.

Your only enemy with these old SOHC's is time, not the miles. Time destroys gaskets, and tensioners get little cracks where they are bonded to the spring arm.

I don't know what to tell you, but these old bikes are best served by the competent do-it-yourselfer.

[Ryan6838]

Idk about the 550 but the only tools it took to remover the carbs and bowls was a screwdriver and chain adjustment was a 10mm wrench. To by both is like 5 bucks lol.

[IHWillys]

There are independent shops worthy of taking old iron to.  They may be rare though.  Ray's Motorcycle Service in Fort Collins, Colorado is one of them.  I know it's no help to the OP but just figured I'd throw it out there that the dealerships and used bike  shops are a different breed from a service shop.

Ken

[754]

If the Tech is 35 years old or under,
 there is a 90% or more chance..

 That he neither knows how your bike should sound, nor how to work on it..

 Plus some shop owners, realize that they can get good buxs for early model bikes, from collectors that know how to work on them bikes..

[The_Crippler]

Really makes me wonder what will happen when I take mine to the shop for a once-over someday...

They've been great with my other bike, but it is also 18 years newer.

[TwoTired]

They replaced the float bowl gaskets and tightened the cam chain tensioner.  Said it was maxed out and that I might consider selling the bike and getting something newer.

If they really told you the cam chain adjuster was "maxed-out", then they have proven themselves too ignorant of how it works to be trusted with further work on the bike.  I would also seriously doubt that they properly adjusted it while in their shop.  (They may also be lying to you for some ulterior motive.  You decide which is more likely.)

The danged thing self adjusts if you put the crank in the correct position (slack side of chain against the adjustment shoe).  Loosening the adjuster lock nut then allows an internal spring to place the correct tension of slipper shoe force against the chain, automatically taking up the required slack.
There are normally only a couple of things to go bad. 
1)  The shoe can be worn out if ham hands put extra tension on the adjuster stud (or mileage above 40k).
2) The internal spring can fatigue and not put enough pressure on the slipper shoe against the chain.

The latter can be easily overcome by allowing the adjuster to "snap" back to position (put extra tension against internal spring via the adjuster stud and then let it go).  Or, applying just a little extra twist on the adjuster stud as you lock it down with the nut.  Ham-hands will overdo this.  And, it is far more likely to acquire ham-hands if you don't know how the cam chain tensioner operates.

Me thinks your shop has an agenda that does not include proper work on your bike.  I'll bet they happily received your money. though.