Topic: How hard can the front brake lever be really?

[GroovieGhoulie]

I replaced the pads today and bled the brakes.  I'm not very happy with how soft the lever is.  I'm going to try again tomorrow but I can't believe how squishy it is.  It was squishy before and It still is, but I think I might be expecting too much.

I am expecting it to be rock-firm from the first touch and eventually get unpullable (while delivering max braking) with around 1 inch of space left between the lever and grip.  As it is, it can be pulled nearly to the grip and feels "squishy".  Admittedly, it takes quite a lot of force to pull it that far. 

Dollars to donuts there's air in the lines but even with no air, how firm can I expect the lever to be at it's optimum?

[Lumbee]

...Groove these brakes can and will get rock hard if bled properly.  After bleeding mine about a month back its almost too hard...probalby only an inch play before it stops...well short of reaching the grip.

...to achieve this the technique I used was to attach a clear hose to the bleed nipple, then fill this tube with fluid.  Now crack the nipple and leave it open.  Then fill the resivoir with fluid and start pumping.  Pause intermittenly with the lever all the way to the grip and watch for bubbles escaping.  As the fluid moves from the resivoir to the tube over the nipple, you may need to tilt the tube over and drain some of the fluid out and pour it back into the resivior.  When it looks like all the bubbles may be out close the nipple, put the resivoir cap back on (so fluid doesn't shoot into the air) and give it a squeeze.

...hope this makes sense...

[TwoTired]

The lever can be rock hard.  I've done it.  But, certainly not with 30 year old deteriorated rubber hydraulic lines that swell when presure is applied.

If you want a rock hard lever, get SS brake lines and be certain to have no air in the system.

Also, new pads have to wear in to fully conform to the brake disk.  During the break in period, the lever won't feel as effective as later when full area contact will be made.

I am expecting it to be rock-firm from the first touch and eventually get unpullable (while delivering max braking) with around 1 inch of space left between the lever and grip.

On what do you base that 1 inch expectation?  And, is that expectation while driving or stationary?  At what distance, lever to grip, does the front wheel lock up?

Do test your hydraulic system (stationary) by using two hands on the lever and squeezing with all your might.  If something breaks, this is the time to learn about the weak spot!   The worst time is during a panic stop...attempt.

Cheers,

[GroovieGhoulie]

On what do you base that 1 inch expectation?  And, is that expectation while driving or stationary?  At what distance, lever to grip, does the front wheel lock up?

Do test your hydraulic system (stationary) by using two hands on the lever and squeezing with all your might.  If something breaks, this is the time to learn about the weak spot!   The worst time is during a panic stop...attempt.

Cheers,

The 1-inch is arbitrary.  Expectiation is while cold at rest.  I know that as they heat it'll soften up.  I've never gotten the front wheel to lock, no matter how hard I pull it.

I've got a MC rebuild kit as well and I think I'll do that as well to see how it affects things.

[TwoTired]

I've never gotten the front wheel to lock, no matter how hard I pull it.

Assuming hte system is bled properly, it's almost certain your brake hoses are no good.

 Or, you have very weak hands.


Cheers,

[GroovieGhoulie]

I've never gotten the front wheel to lock, no matter how hard I pull it.

Assuming hte system is bled properly, it's almost certain your brake hoses are no good.

 Or, you have very weak hands.


Cheers,

Could be the hoses.

However, I can always get a pew pinprick-sized bubbles (they're nearly invisible) out when I prime it and pull the lever.  However, I wonder how much of that is air in the lines or bubbles caused by cavitation as it accelerates and shoots out the bleeder hole.

[Lumbee]

pew pinprick-sized bubbles (they're nearly invisible) out when I prime it and pull the lever.  However, I wonder how much of that is air in the lines or bubbles caused by cavitation as it accelerates and shoots out the bleeder hole.

...bubbles are air...

...and in the interest of full disclosure I have SS brake lines, so I'm sure that adds to the hardness of my brakes...

[Jay B]

To get that last little bit of air out, I've used this method successfully.
1- Unbolt the brake caliper halves.
2- Pump the piston out quite a ways with the brake lever. Be carefull not to let the resivour go dry, don't push the piston out past the seal. In both cases, you're back to square one.
3- Sit down and pop a cold beer. Just let it sit like that for 5 or 10 minutes to let the tiny air bubbles coagulate in the caliper.
4- Hold the caliper upright so the line is at the highest point. Use a C clamp to slowly and steadily push the piston back into the caliper. Make sure the resivour doesn't overfill and spill brake fluid all over.
The volume of fluid in the brake lines is very small. You may want to repeat a time or two, but this will drive the air bubbles up and out of the master cylinder.