Topic: title question

[hotwire]

i went to check out my prospective 550 its nice and runs well. however one hitch, the title is one letter off of what the frame says. Now i understand why i would want the title to match the vin if it was stolen but is that it? the guy said it was easy to take care of and that the title is clear and the bike can be insured and reg. is this a big deal? should i stear clear i mean the bike is older than me and the vin isnt easy to make out anyway. just lookin for some thoughts thanks guys

[mycb750k6]

This same thing came up a month ago. What are the two letters that differ?

[laser145]

It shouldn't be a big deal, simply a transcription error and the DMV should either not notice it or correct it with no hassle...

However, we are talking about the DMV... so everything depends on the attitude of the person at the counter.

[gmonkey]

I'd wait for another 550 with a clear title.  They're not that rare that you should risk DMV hassle.  Of course I'm in MA and the RMV here has a special hassle department so I'm probably biased.

[ironbutter]

I sold a '58 Chris Craft Capri to a guy in New York, it came with a California title. When it came time, I faxed off the docs I noticed that the the manufacturer was listed as Cruiser instead of Chris Craft. The hull numbers in old woodies are stamped on a plaque on the underside of the engine cover. Missing as well. Crap, how did I miss all this? We got the deal done. I offered to fix it here in California, but he would have to wait for a new title. He decided to take the title and a bunch of photographs to the DMV and they accepted it and issued him a proper title. If it were me, I would just be patient, ask him to take it in and fix it, the DMV make errors all the time. Then if he wont, then find another bike. This bike has a clear title, just with an error, no big fix.

[lowflyingdutchman]

I suppose it really depends on where you are. Ive heard all kinds of horror stories about folks having to part out a bike that they spent a year on rebuilding. Im in TN. Guy I bought bike from had a title, but it went back about four po's, so that was pretty much useless. Talked to lady at dmv and she told me I could apply for rebuilders / abandonement title (considering it was last registered in like 1985) and all I would need to do is get the brass out to have 'm run the vin to make sure it wasnt stolen. Did just that and applying for a new title as we speak.

One word for the wise. Calling the brass to have your vin ran to make sure its not stolen is what vehicle thieves do for the same reasons so you want to make sure they know you're talking about a 35 year old relic that you've been rebuilding for a year to prevent the whole "guns drawn, screaming tires" scenario. But other that that.. no problem here.

[hotwire]

thanks i appreciate the heads up. Ha i liked the tires screaming and guns drawn scenerio seeing im "that guy" on the street all tattooed playing that rock and roll music oh the sport bike didnt win me any noteriety and neither will the cafe

[lowflyingdutchman]

thanks i appreciate the heads up. Ha i liked the tires screaming and guns drawn scenerio seeing im "that guy" on the street all tattooed playing that rock and roll music oh the sport bike didnt win me any noteriety and neither will the cafe

Hmmpf.. That's what's its all about though? Pretty sure my neighbors dont appreciate me too good neither. Especially since they spend their weekends polishing their 25k plus 3.9% apr american steel.. Like the giger in your avatar. Have you seen the "3d" stuff? thats mindaltering nonsense right there..

Anyway. Good luck man. Just make sure you mention "35 year old bike" and youll be okay. After the awkward silence and the following laugh attack, theyll probably send someone your way just to see what kind of fool would actually try and reanimate a relic. Little do they know.. muwahhahha!!

[Gaither]

Hotwire   FWIW

Obvioulsy, one can't be too careful. However, you might consider [among other things]:
1. How old it the current title?
2. Check the seller's driver's license and address against the name and address on the
    title to see if they match [he may have moved since buying the title].
3. Does he at least appear to be ligit and sincere?
4. Is it a good deal otherwise or is it too good to be true?
5. How badly do you want the bike to start with?
6. If he says he can get the title corrected, that will take some time but that is a good   
    way to proceed. You run the risk of him selling it to someone else. If you think you can
    trust the seller, you could type up a Conditional Bill of Sale providing for a small, return-
    able deposit [in the event he can't get the title corrected] to hold the bike til he gets
    the title corrected.
7. Call the DMV and explain the situation and ask their advice and your options.
8. Call the VIN in and have it run on the "hot sheet" to see if it has been stolen.

Just a few ideas.

In TN, if a bike is 25 years old, there is a special form with which to get a clear title where no papers exist - particularly if the bike has been stored a long time. Even then, you must start the process in Nashville [head knocker]. I did it and even with the papers they sent, the local idiots attempted to block me. I presented them with a letter of instructions from Nashville. Pissed the locals off - including the supervisor - but they coughed up a fresh title app. They now hate me but I got the title! Frankly, I enjoyed it!
Been dealing with them for 57 years and it's always been a hassle.

There are ways - it just boils doen to how badly you want the bike.

[hotwire]

good news guys i talked to the guy today and told him of my concerns he said (oh the title is good i took the bike out around the block and when i got back i checked the title to the vin i made a mistake) i dont know what to think i've been talkin to him and he seems straight up hes repeatedly told me that hes 66 and needs to get rid of all his bikes, he just sold a 77 hondamatic for 1500 he also said he is a retired cop (now i know hes setting me up) im going sunday i think im gonna grab it up for 750 im getting the 74 550 a 75 550 parts bike various other parts and new carbs. im bringing my uncle with me he used to be a mechanic for a honda dealer here in  nj for many many years so hopefully it will go well and i get the bike. thank you for your imput and i will post up pics if i get it

[Gaither]

Hotwire

You started out saying "nice and runs good" but "one hitch". Now, you've solved the "hitch".

Don't let it get away! Jump on it - @ $750 it has to be a winner even without the other goodies. [Don't wait tis Sunday - if you want it.]

Buy it and ride safely!

[Tennessee]

I don't mean to thread jack here but I noticed a Tennessean managed to get a title using the "certificate of ownership" paper.  I would like to to know more either here or through email as to how it all went.  I have been down to the state office twice trying to get them to explain the process but I still got no direct answer, and on top of that now they will not even give me the last known owner or address due to some new privacy act... I feel as though I'm going backwards with them because on the last bike I registered the clerks office printed me off a name and address of the previous owner so I could send the required certified letter asking for the title or his signature on a notarized bill of sale.  Now they will not even tell me if the vehicles title is clear of any negative history such as leans, theft, salvage, ect.  I have tried to explain that how am I to ever know if I am ever buying a vehicle(especially a locally registered one) is clear.  All I got in return was you can always take legal action against the seller.  It's frustrating because I see opportunity to save bikes all the time and also make some pocket change at the same time but the title process is so hidden and the knowledge protected by the few that know how to work the system.   

  Now, I have issues with the whole idea of the Certificate of Ownership they told me was really all I needed to fill out.  Due to the age of the vehicle (older than 30 years) and the value(less than $3,000) you can register a vehicle with out a title here simply by bringing that paper back and a notarized bill of sale.  The bill of sale does not need to be from the last known registered owner.  I went cross-eyed when he told me that.... With all this secrecy and vagueness with all my other questions now all I have to do is get John Smith to go over to the local Kinko's with me and sign a bill of sale saying he sold me a bike for $100! WTF!!!   Am I the only one that sees holes in the system here that can be exploited by anyone with no morals?

So in closing if you could please enlighten me on the simplicity of the Tennessee department of revenue/transportation title process.  Is it really as simple as a piece of paper?!?  I would greatly appreciate it, as would other I bet.

Thanks for reading,
Don

[lowflyingdutchman]

Hey Don!

In one word yes. It really is that simple. If you have a decent relationship with the local brass. They may give you the runaround because they have important speedingtickets to write, but just keep nagging them.  Cop that came to my house to run the vin, used to work for my wife at some point, so there was no hassle there at all.

All it REALLY takes is for them to come to your location to run the vin and make sure it doesnt have a shady history. You then go to the county clerks office and say, "officer soandso ran the vin and it is clean. you can call officer soandso on this number to verify this, Id like to apply for an abandonement title please?" (abandonement are for like 30 plus year old barnyard finds) and the lady should go, sure. That'll be 76 dollars please. This scenario is how it goes out in the somewhat rural, but im sure it should translate to the big city and anything other than the above should probably be translated as government employee ignorance of which there is plenty to go around here. 

These links should help you along your noble quest, oh knight of the iron steed;

http://www.tn.gov/revenue/forms/titlereg/f1311801Fill-in.pdf

http://www.tn.gov/revenue/forms/titlereg/f1310601Fill-in.pdf

http://www.tn.gov/revenue/forms/titlereg.htm


Lady at clercksoffice was actually nice enough to suggest the lost title route, but you can just as easily go with salvage (abandonement) title. If you have a clerck that knows what theyre talking about, you're halfway there.

[Gaither]

Don

Lowflying has some good stuff.

Last year I "took over" a '73 CB450 "basket case" that was given to my brother about 20 years ago - no papers at all. At the time, we knew the PO was the legal owner but made no attempt to get papers. No one was interested in assembling the bike so it didn't matter.

I wont bore you with all the details [see my earlier post here] but nephew and I decided to put it together [it's about half done as we both have bikes]. And, you are right - to work this deal the bike needs to be at least 30 years old in TN.

Your greatest mistake was in doing the right and logical thing by going to the 'title office". But as you know, if it isn't routine, those folks take great delight in saying "you can't get a title".

I suggest you email this "Lisa Long" as follows [as we did]: "Lisa Long" <Lisa.Long@state.tn.us> .

She is one of the top folks at state level - if she hasn't been fired for being helpful to folks. Explain your situation in your email in detail and ask her how to proceed. She will know what to do and will respond by email with instructions and necessary forms [if that is what you request]. Then, and only then, you will have what you need to go back to the "title office". They may not like it but they will not buck "Lisa Long's" written instructions - [which you also must request in your email].

When I went to the title office in Chattanooga, I knew I was in for a hard time. So, I gave the  the properly filled out papers from Ms Long. I did intentionally did NOT give 'em the letter of instructions from Ms Long. [Got to have a little fun!]The woman [lady?] studied the papers and took them to 4 other clerks before taking them to the "manager lady". The two of them yakked for 15 minutes before the clerk came back and said "You can't get a title". Only them did I give her the letter from Ms Long. She read it and went back to the Manager for another 10 minutes. She came back to me really pissed off - never said a word as she typed up the title stuff - looked at me and said how much I owed  -  took my money - handed me the title app and walked away. Those people ain't on our side! She will never forget me.

[D]

Am I the only one that finds it ironic that you are a new user asking about a possible stolen bike and your user name is "hotwire"     

[hotwire]

Ha im an electrician   however yeah i guess i see your point it is kinda funny. enough of this chit chat will somebody please explain how to restamp the frame??

[Tennessee]

Thanks so much for your help guys.  I think I'm going to try using the Ownership Certification process with one of my parts bikes first just to test the waters.  I can not help but be skeptical about this process.  I'll go the salvage route with another bike maybe in a couple weeks once i learn the outcome of this first try.  I worry a little about the stigma with a associated salvage title.
Thanks again guys!
Don

[gmonkey]

The frame does not have the VIN stamped in it, it has a "tag" that is riveted.

Mine's got a stamped VIN on the frame.  Think they come both ways.