Topic: Vintage racing, where to start?

[Shenanigans]

So I have always wanted to get into SOHC4 vintage racing so...


 ...where the hell do I start???

[Hasenkopf]

do you still have that trail 90 ??                                                                                                 just kidding, good luck !

[Shenanigans]

do you still have that trail 90 ??                                                                                                 just kidding, good luck !

Yeah but it has been sitting since I broke to the chain trying to (unsuccessfully) wheelie it 





I guess I should throw out that I am in PHX and I know that a lot of people say to just start with the CB350 twins but I really really like the 4's. I was torn between starting with a 550 or 750 but now that I am reading what I can find on the class rules, I think the 550 would be the way to go so I could be in the middle weight class. Thinking I will be sticking with stock bores and such for a while...

[Sam Green Racing]

Shen, go to a race meeting and talk to people in your chosen class, that would be a good start.

Sam.

[Bill/BentON Racing]

Do what Sam said and my .02 would be go with the CB550.Lot's easier to get right for a lot less than CB750.Good Luck,check out Turboguzzi's posts.Bill

[754]

 To start with, if you can get mags cheap..BUY THEM..
 Even if you dont run them, you can trade for other things you need..
 One thing about Good trading stock, you can get stuff in trade, that money may not buy...

[Shenanigans]

Do what Sam said and my .02 would be go with the CB550.Lot's easier to get right for a lot less than CB750.Good Luck,check out Turboguzzi's posts.Bill

After thinking about it more and more that does seem like the best way to start. I have a decent sized stash of 550 parts anyways. I think I would start from scratch and make a dedicated bike just for this. I dont really have the resources to go crazy motor wise a and I am not looking to be super competitive but a simple bike that is never going to be street legal should be pretty easy to build.

I know open track days are 135 bucks a pop here so I hope at least in that regard it will be a little cheaper...

[Nikkisixx]

I know open track days are 135 bucks a pop here so I hope at least in that regard it will be a little cheaper...

Have you considered drag racing? 
Test and tune night at Z-Max dragway ( a really nice track) is only $20.  You can bracket race a street bike and be competitive as long as you are consistant.  Plus, no trailer or tow vehicle so low cost to get into the game. 

[Sam Green Racing]

I know open track days are 135 bucks a pop here so I hope at least in that regard it will be a little cheaper...

Have you considered drag racing? 
Test and tune night at Z-Max dragway ( a really nice track) is only $20.  You can bracket race a street bike and be competitive as long as you are consistant.  Plus, no trailer or tow vehicle so low cost to get into the game. 

Now your talking


Sam

[Shenanigans]

I know open track days are 135 bucks a pop here so I hope at least in that regard it will be a little cheaper...

Have you considered drag racing? 
Test and tune night at Z-Max dragway ( a really nice track) is only $20.  You can bracket race a street bike and be competitive as long as you are consistant.  Plus, no trailer or tow vehicle so low cost to get into the game. 

Now your talking


Sam

That's what the blue 836 is for 

"Run what you brung" is actually very reasonable at Firebird raceway. Its about 1/5 of the cost of a track day and depending on how many people show up you can get a decent amount of passes in.

I know there is a good sized vintage club that visits here one or twice a year. (I sold a set of 1000 jugs and pistons to one of them who was a member here, cant remember the name...) but they are based out of New Mexico. http://www.smri-racing.org/vintage.php

I have been looking into the AHRMA but that might be a bit over my head.

[motocyconomad]

I still cant find the top speed record for ALL the CB750 years, road and drag are fun but I think the holy grail is Bonniville #$%* a ton I want two.

[Nikkisixx]

I still cant find the top speed record for ALL the CB750 years, road and drag are fun but I think the holy grail is Bonniville #$%* a ton I want two.

Back in the early 90's I had a slightly tuned 750 (no big bore kit) that ran consistant low 11's at 110+ quarter miles all day long (I could KILL the tree with that bike, wish I still had it).  Honestly, I think a full mile would only get you another 5-10mph on a mild 750, but I wouldn't mind making a pass or two on the salt    

The guys at Lowbrow Customs just went out to Utah and have a great blog:  
http://www.lowbrowcustoms.com/index.php?l=blogview&method=list&link=http%253A//lowbrowcustoms.blogspot.com/feeds/posts/default%3forderby=updated

[Nikkisixx]

So I have always wanted to get into SOHC4 vintage racing so...


 ...where the hell do I start???

I believe they paint a line across the track.  Every one lines up behind that and watches for the flag to drop.


 

 Awesome!
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[Shenanigans]

So I have always wanted to get into SOHC4 vintage racing so...


 ...where the hell do I start???

I believe they paint a line across the track.  Every one lines up behind that and watches for the flag to drop.


 

Yeah yeah, if you must.... 

[motocyconomad]

Isle of Man has a vintage class but those brits are crazy we'll never beat some of those old salty bikers even the old dudes on old bikes go death fast...that is another holy gail of vintage motorbike racing   I wish we had TT races like that here. even grassroot loop race ...ya know meet at this bar at this time ride this loop and if any of you win... I'll get you a beer

[Sam Green Racing]

I think you should visit the TT before talking about a loop race.

Sam.

[kos]

To start in vintage racing...it is not all that esay as you cannot go out and buy a CBR600RR or Suzuki 1000 sport bike, safety wire the bike and hit the track. You have to build a bike. Now most people that call me want to know all about the engine and what they can do to make it fast. I have to tell them that they first need to get the proper leathers gloves, and a good helmet, along with good gloves and boots. Now, we can talk about the bike. If they cannot construct  and or built there own...here is the hard part.....it costs a lot of money to build a vintage bike, no one said this is a low cost sport, and in fact it costs more to do vintage than modern... as there are very few turn key bikes and even less... vast lists of suppliers that you can just order what you want or need. You need to look up and locate, just about every little piece that you might need.

Having said that, and this hurts me as an engine guy....I always tell them to work on proper size wheels/rims, then suspension front and rear, bodywork, and exhaust, good ignition and all the little things that need to be do to make a safe, well handling machine. Then using as close to stock engine as you can...go out join a club, pay your fees, go to a good racing school and have some fun. And when you can brake as hard as the rest, go in as deep as the rest in your class, have good corner speed, but find your exit speeds lacking...call me. NOW it is time to work on engine, carbs and ex tuning.

Call me if you need help...

Mark @ M3 Racing.com

[Shenanigans]

To start in vintage racing...it is not all that esay as you cannot go out and buy a CBR600RR or Suzuki 1000 sport bike, safety wire the bike and hit the track. You have to build a bike. Now most people that call me want to know all about the engine and what they can do to make it fast. I have to tell them that they first need to get the proper leathers gloves, and a good helmet, along with good gloves and boots. Now, we can talk about the bike. If they cannot construct  and or built there own...here is the hard part.....it costs a lot of money to build a vintage bike, no one said this is a low cost sport, and in fact it costs more to do vintage than modern... as there are very few turn key bikes and even less... vast lists of suppliers that you can just order what you want or need. You need to look up and locate, just about every little piece that you might need.

Having said that, and this hurts me as an engine guy....I always tell them to work on proper size wheels/rims, then suspension front and rear, bodywork, and exhaust, good ignition and all the little things that need to be do to make a safe, well handling machine. Then using as close to stock engine as you can...go out join a club, pay your fees, go to a good racing school and have some fun. And when you can brake as hard as the rest, go in as deep as the rest in your class, have good corner speed, but find your exit speeds lacking...call me. NOW it is time to work on engine, carbs and ex tuning.

Call me if you need help...

Mark @ M3 Racing.com

For the most part that is exactly what I expect. Building the bike (assuming I will be using a, for the most part, stock motor) is the easy part.  I have a ton of 550 parts around. 4-1 headers, 750 carbs/forks, lester wheels, fork brace, an extra F frame... My own labor is free.  The focus would be on getting the handling and brakes dialed in first. When the motor starts to hold me back big time, I will worry about it then. I just dont want to be on the track with the slowest bike having to worry about being run over.

[bear]

Your spot on Mark all good advice.
The money we have invested in developing and racing our SOHC post-classic sidecar would buy us a brand new LCR F1 sidecar and still leave change.
There is a major advantage we have racing historic bikes apart from the fact we have an affection for them, they have a character and personality that a brand new wizbanger just can't give you.
Historic racing in most countries does not change it's rules or categories radically, so the money and effort you invest in your machinery is not wasted because something bigger, better or newer comes along.

Cheers,
Brian

[Shenanigans]

So basically, unless I have deep pockets I'm out? I am not trying to push the limits of these motors competitively. Maybe I should just get a "in" so trackdays are not so much but I feel like all its gonna be is modern rockets and such. Not to much fun in that.

[bear]

So basically, unless I have deep pockets I'm out?

No not at all, just the opposite in fact.
Just don't go into it half arsed.
Get to an historic race meeting, get into the pits and start talking to people that are running the type of machinery your thinking of using.
Join a club associated with historic racing, they will more than likely be able to provide a resource kit for new racers.
Make shore your bike will be eligible for the class you want to compete in before you start building it.
There's nothing more soul destroying than building your first race bike, rocking up to your first race meeting and getting knocked back because of eligibility problems. I've seen it happen.
Talk to people that are already doing it.
Sit down and work  out your basic start up costs.
Then ask yourself the question do I still want to do this?
If the answer is yes, take Mark up on his offer.
I can't think of anybody over there more qualified to help you out.

Cheers,
Brian

[gene03079]

So basically, unless I have deep pockets I'm out? I am not trying to push the limits of these motors competitively. Maybe I should just get a "in" so trackdays are not so much but I feel like all its gonna be is modern rockets and such. Not to much fun in that.

Getting started will run a bit of cash.

Gear including race suit, boots, gloves helmet can be done for $2000.00 Less if you located some good used suit.

Race school for license $300.00

Couple track days for practice $500.00

The cost of what ever you run for a bike. Add some cash for tires. Keep the motor stock at first is the way to go. Your goal is to learn the race line and corner speed.

I run a Honda 175 with the USCRA on the east coast. A typical weekend runs $180.00 fee for 2 races with 2 practice rounds. About $60.00 for fuel and oil. Cost goes up if you crash. Some guys spend a lot more but you can race on a budget.

Don't worry about doing track days for practice on a 550. I run my 175 with the modern bikes for practice a few times a year. Passing a new Ducati in a corner when your on an old underpowered machine is very satisfying.

Gene

[Sam Green Racing]

Hi Gene,I heard you've been doing quite well on the little JMR tuned 175 Honda.
Is it much better than it was as a 200?

Sam.

[motocyconomad]

I think you should visit the TT before talking about a loop race.

Sam.

I'll come see it someday, your one of those Englishmen that make me nervous though
any advice for this dumb yank to going about it would be awesome
like how much time will I need (a month?) crash spots(sleep) I know you guys have big money so what would it take $$$ DOLLAR wise 100 a day? I'm just talking about spectating and survival beer/food/hotel
 is it a flight or fairy ride to the island?

[Sam Green Racing]

I havn't been for about 15 years and it was quite expensive then.
I'll PM someone that can let you know.
You would have to fly to England or Ireland then get a flight to the Island.
As a rule, you have to book a year in advance for hotels and ferry unless you go as a foot passenger.

Sam.