Author Topic: What do you use for fork oil?  (Read 29774 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline CycleRanger

  • No comment about being an
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,482
  • Central Texas Shop Manual Advocate
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #25 on: August 27, 2010, 02:33:43 PM »
I think I read some where that originally they did use a fish oil at the factory for the forks.

I heard that rumor back in the '70's but I don't believe it ever was true.
But I think it's the Japanese penchant for all things that come from the sea that gives the idea plausibility.  ;)
Do you have a copy of the Honda Shop Manual or Parts List for your bike? Get one here:
https://www.honda4fun.com/materiale/documentazione-tecnica
CB750K5        '79 XL250s     CL350K3
CB750K3        '76 XS650      '76 CJ360T

Offline seaweb11

  • 1st Mate &
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,258
  • Ride & Smile
    • Playground Directory
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #26 on: August 27, 2010, 08:47:14 PM »

I believe I read it here somewhere many years ago and I just regurgitated the information ::)

I just went and did a couple of searches on the "fish oil" fork question.......and who knows is any of this is true ???  My 1st 750 fork change smelled like fish oil ???

"Honda used to ship bikes with a very light non corrosive oil in the forks (ATF and fork oil is hydrophillic like brake fluid - meaning it pulls moisture from the surrounding air). This was a fairly clear oil and was referred to as "fish oil" by the techs and eventually the hobbyists (because it smelled like fish). Part of the new bike prep was to drain this "fish oil" and replace with real fork oil or at least ATF. There have been tales of techs prepping bikes for sale and not draining the fish oil until the fork seals went. I'm sure there are a couple of bikes that went their entire service lives with super soft front ends. A couple of years ago I bought a set of forks from a guy that used to be a tech at mineola Honda (one of the largest Honda bike dealers BTW). He said they were used but low mileage and he had saved them as a backup for his own 75 CB750F. I cracked them open to change the fluid and sure enough - really really bad (I mean foul) smelling "fish oil"."


"The Japanese motorcycle industry used the thinnest oil they could use
and still get rebound damping.

Maybe it was 5 weight, 10 weight at the maximum.

The motorcycle magazines accused Japanese motorcycle manufacturers of
using "fish oil" in their forks, and the motomavens would recommend
switching to an American brand of fork oil, which helped out the
aftermarket lubricant industry.

Unaware of the orifice flow limitations, American riders would install
15, 20, or even 30 weight oil in their forks and they got a very harsh
ride over sudden sharp-edged bumps.

Some American suspension "experts" started talking about air getting
trapped in the forks and entraining in the fork oil because they
didn't know that fixed orifices were so velocity sensitive,

An article in one of the magazines (Cycle?) during the late 1960's/
early 1970's involved filling up forks with various fork oils and
stroking them on a machine while measuring the damping curves.

Spikes in the damping curves were noted, and oil consistency was
questioned.

The series of tests was performed with a certain laboratory oil and
interested riders demanded to know where they could get that oil,
which was unavailable at a price that riders would be willing to pay.

The motomavens suggested using ATF as a consistently formulated
suspension oil, even though there were definitely differences in the
consistency from one manufacturer to another.

The ATF recommendation got back to Japanese engineers, so they adopted
the
suggestion, just as they adopted many other ideas which came from the
Southern California hot rodding community, where the enthusiast was
often working in the *movie industry* and, if they had a degree, it
was in *cinematography*!

The California hot rodders simply had more practical experience than
the Japanese engineers!

As S'mee said, 10 weight fork oil will probably give you a baseline
feel and what you want to do is go out and ride your typical road and
see if you feel like the motorcycle controllable over undulating bumps
and that the fork doesn't feel harsh over sudden, smaller, sharp-edged
bumps.

If your wrists are getting tired and it feels like you're riding a
jackhammer, the oil weight is too heavy to flow consistently through
the orifices in the damper roads."






Offline bjohnsonassoc

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 35
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #27 on: August 27, 2010, 08:58:27 PM »
Baby Oil, what kind of Baby?
Big Baby
Cry Baby

Offline scottly

  • Global Moderator
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *****
  • Posts: 16,449
  • Humboldt, AZ
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #28 on: August 27, 2010, 09:06:57 PM »
I have always used fork oil for fork oil....
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
Helmets save brains. Always wear one and ride like everyone is trying to kill you....

Offline CycleRanger

  • No comment about being an
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,482
  • Central Texas Shop Manual Advocate
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #29 on: August 27, 2010, 09:45:37 PM »

I believe I read it here somewhere many years ago and I just regurgitated the information ::)

I just went and did a couple of searches on the "fish oil" fork question.......and who knows is any of this is true ???  My 1st 750 fork change smelled like fish oil ???


Oh, I completely agree.  The factory fork oil did smell like fish!

Interesting info!
Do you have a copy of the Honda Shop Manual or Parts List for your bike? Get one here:
https://www.honda4fun.com/materiale/documentazione-tecnica
CB750K5        '79 XL250s     CL350K3
CB750K3        '76 XS650      '76 CJ360T

Offline cookindaddy

  • I sure love this bike!
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,153
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #30 on: August 28, 2010, 03:01:43 AM »
What is being called fish oil is likely whale oil. A very respected lubricant for fine machinery like watches and clocks until the petroleum industry got going. Sold by US based Nye Lubricants until 1978. Available in very fine viscosity which as noted is desirable for shocks. The Japanese were (an still are) huge in the whaling business. I don't think I'd use it though.
George with a black 78 CB750K (in Lion's Head, Ontario, Canada)

Offline Kevin400F

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 600
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #31 on: August 28, 2010, 04:07:56 AM »
Motor oil has detergent/dispersant additives to help keep particulate matter in suspension so it can travel to the engine filter and be trapped.  In motorcycle forks, you really want a "non-detergent" hydraulic oil so the wear particles can drop out as sludge in the very bottom of the forks and not continue to wear away at the bushings every time the fork strokes.

I prefer to get a couple of bottles of fork oils of different viscosity so you can blend to get the desired suspension compliance.

Offline dhall57

  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,677
  • The 70's! SOHC4 Honda's & Marcia Brady of course.
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #32 on: August 28, 2010, 04:21:47 AM »
Makes perfectly good since to me ???
1970 CB750KO
1971 CB500KO-project bike
1973 CB350G- project bike
1974 CB750K4-project bike
1974 CB750K4
1976 CB750K6
1977 GL1000
1997 Harley Wideglide

Offline nitroeagle

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 72
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #33 on: August 28, 2010, 08:41:03 PM »
I would follow the service manual recomendation. My cb650 calls for ATF so thats what I used. Some rubbers, the seals may be included, don't react well to certain oils. The seals may swell if they come in contact with motor oil when they were designed for use with ATF.

Offline tomkimberly

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,113
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #34 on: August 28, 2010, 09:11:26 PM »
I use power steering fluid.


Tom


Offline dave500

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 17,054
  • WHAT?no gravy?
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #35 on: August 28, 2010, 11:58:41 PM »
I use power steering fluid.


Tom


unless you have a euro car power steering fluid here is atf.red and the same stuff.some jap high end cars may call for a special fluid.

Offline tomkimberly

  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,113
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #36 on: August 29, 2010, 08:30:07 AM »
unless you have a euro car power steering fluid here is atf.red and the same stuff.some jap high end cars may call for a special fluid.
[/quote]

Generic ATF is not the same as PSF just as Type F is not the same as Dextron ATF. The brand I use is made by Stabil.

Tom

Offline Flying J

  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,386
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #37 on: September 08, 2010, 08:58:58 PM »

Offline Old75_ratafe

  • CB750 Cave Spelunking
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 801
  • 1975 CB750K
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #38 on: September 08, 2010, 11:23:33 PM »
+1  ;D
1975 CB750K
Project Back in Black

Sent from my Texas Instruments TI99/4A Computer

Offline Dunstall_74

  • Enthusiast
  • **
  • Posts: 187
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #39 on: September 09, 2010, 06:08:54 PM »
Definitely gives credibility to cookindaddy's argument  ;D
''It is clear our nation is reliant upon big foreign oil. More and more of our imports come from overseas.''
—President George W. Bush, Beaverton, Ore., Sep. 25, 2000

Offline CBNJ74

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 297
  • Sweep the leg!
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #40 on: October 20, 2011, 11:40:06 AM »
This newb is using type F ATF. Which I've read somewhere that it's the equivalent to 13W
1973 Honda CB750K
1983 Honda VF750 Interceptor
2005 Triumph Thruxton
2012 Ducati Monster 1100evo

Offline Lostboy Steve

  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,088
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #41 on: October 20, 2011, 01:09:26 PM »
I used Maxima fork oil. Same stuff I use in my (SHOWA) Buell Inverted fork.
1968 Honda Z50
1977 Honda CB550K
2018 Indian Scout

Offline 70CB750

  • Labor omnia vincit improbus.
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 14,817
  • Northern Virginia
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #42 on: October 20, 2011, 01:27:56 PM »
What is being called fish oil is likely whale oil. A very respected lubricant for fine machinery like watches and clocks until the petroleum industry got going. Sold by US based Nye Lubricants until 1978. Available in very fine viscosity which as noted is desirable for shocks. The Japanese were (an still are) huge in the whaling business. I don't think I'd use it though.

useless information for today - atf is pretty close to whale oil.  That's what was used in first slash boxes and later on the oil was developed to mimic it's parameters.

I am full of useless information.
Prokop
_______________
Pure Gas - find ethanol free gas station near you

I love it when parts come together.

Dorothy - my CB750
CB750K3F - The Red
Sidecar


CB900C

2006 KLR650

Offline Lostboy Steve

  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,088
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #43 on: October 20, 2011, 01:34:15 PM »
LOL whats wrong with good old fork oil? You can get it at any bike store / shop/ or dealer.
1968 Honda Z50
1977 Honda CB550K
2018 Indian Scout

Offline Danno

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 715
  • 74 CB550,75 GL1000,76 KZ400,77 GL1000,73 CB750
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #44 on: October 20, 2011, 07:38:25 PM »
you can use 10w , 20 w, 30 w oil or fork oil or fluid or ATF like dave said if you want firmer ride use 10 w oil squishier ride use atf or if you want less dive go with 20w or 30 w oil
when you own a motorcycle the wife does not have to find you handy she just has to find you

Offline CBNJ74

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 297
  • Sweep the leg!
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #45 on: October 21, 2011, 10:39:42 AM »
LOL whats wrong with good old fork oil? You can get it at any bike store / shop/ or dealer.

ATF is cheaper but for me it's more about convenience. It's easier for me to go to Pep Boys.
1973 Honda CB750K
1983 Honda VF750 Interceptor
2005 Triumph Thruxton
2012 Ducati Monster 1100evo

Offline BobbyR

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 12,365
  • Proud Owner of the Babe Thread & Dirty Old Man
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #46 on: October 21, 2011, 01:56:41 PM »
I will drain a bit of oil from a Sardine can to give my fork Oil the OEM smell.  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Dedicated to Sgt. Howard Bruckner 1950 - 1969. KIA LONG KHANH.

But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?

Offline brooze72

  • Talk to my friends here at SOHC4 if you need an
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,308
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #47 on: October 21, 2011, 02:08:37 PM »
This is becoming a funny thread  :D Now you guys got me wondering about what the Japanese used for cooling fluid in the old Suzuki "Water Buffalo"??  ;D
2011, 2012 & 2013 Godzilla Relay Rally Rider
"Hold on loosely...don't let go
 If you cling too tightly...you're gonna lose control"
1972 CB500K1 - restored rider
1981 CB650C - new project

Offline Mantree

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 595
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #48 on: August 16, 2015, 09:01:34 PM »
LOL whats wrong with good old fork oil? You can get it at any bike store / shop/ or dealer.
I have a problem with going to the local honda shop and the harley shop is in the Loveland shoping center where I refuse to go so atf it is
i went from half emptl reeeeeaaaalllllllllyyy old watery mystery stink oil to 15w fork oil.  pretty damn stiff!

I use 50 percent pure virgin olive oil and 50 percent coconut oil.  :D


Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


Offline HondaMan

  • Someone took this pic of me before I became a
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 14,067
  • ...not my choice, I was nicknamed...
    • Getting 'em Back on the Road
Re: What do you use for fork oil?
« Reply #49 on: August 16, 2015, 10:46:43 PM »
Oil from baby seals is said to be the best, in its absence whale oil or oil from dolphins can be used as substitute. They are Japanese bikes after all.

When they were new, the fork oil stunk. Literally. We changed it at the 500 mile service interval: it was yellow and smelled like dead fish in the sun (really!). We used to call it 'fish oil'.

The old Honda manuals call for 10w30 motor oil, but those were from the days when these oils had zinc in them. This is important: the fork lowers are aluminum, the tubes steel, and zinc is the critical lube component between them. Modern synthetic fork oils will leak out past your 1960s-design seals, bet on it. So will ATF, as it is made to soften these seals, too. Hydraulic oils, although usually sold by the gallon, is not bad if you ride lightly loaded.

Otherwise, I use (in all the bikes' forks I touch) 10w30 diesel-rated oil - because it has more zinc than the 'regular' oil, and less foamy detergent, both of which are important.
;)
See SOHC4shop@gmail.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
Hondaman's creed: "Bikers are family. Treat them accordingly."

Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

Link to My CB750 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?adult_audience_rating=00&page=1&pageSize=10&q=my+cb750+book

Link to website: www.SOHC4shop.com