Topic: I can change gears without the clutch, is this bad?

[scott_cb650]

I have a 1979 cb650.

I have on occasion, in my excitement, forgotten to squeeze the clutch and shifted gears, both up or down at different times.
It shifted rather smoothly.

I know I shouldn't make a habit of it, but is this an indication of something that needs to be fixed?

Also, as a side note, or maybe a new topic, when I shift to 3rd gear I don't get the "click" feel/sound like the other gears.
Should I worry about it?

Thanks,
Scott

[dusterdude]

the shifting thing is no big deal,what happens is you are hitting the sweet spot in the transmission where the gears are turning at the same speed and the clutch is not needed.i do this with my car quite a bit.

[volz1fsu]

This is actually a good thing, because it shows that everything is in perfect harmony.  It is Not recomended to downshift like this, that will hurt the transmission.  Upshifting is fine as long as you are hitting those "sweet spots" right.  I used to do it all the time and there was no wear when I took that engine down.

[Lumbee]

some might say shifting like this is good for the bike.  First it saves the clutch as its not being used, and to change gears like this you can't rev to high so you really have to "baby" the bike to do it this way....

...just don't try it from neutral to 1st   

[bill440cars]

some might say shifting like this is good for the bike.  First it saves the clutch as its not being used, and to change gears like this you can't rev to high so you really have to "baby" the bike to do it this way....

...just don't try it from neutral to 1st   

 Yeah really, an attempt to go from neutral to 1st would be disastrous>  Later on, Bill

[Buffo]

a Clutch is cheeper and easier to replace than the transmission...and I dont recomend that you do it often

[eldar]

I would stick with clutch. Even draggers use the clutch in their cars.

[Sam Green Racing]

But we don't on the bike. 

[dusterdude]

I would stick with clutch. Even draggers use the clutch in their cars.

just to get out of the hole,then its no clutch at all,but they use transmissions designed to be used that way too.

[ohiocaferacer]

.....forgotten to squeeze the clutch and shifted gears, both up or down at different times.
It shifted rather smoothly.

What you are referring to is called "Speed Shifting" and is used alot in motorcycle racing. I've used this technique for years, while racing....and is pretty common practice. It is mostly used for upshifts...as doing it downshifting can be quite dangerous is scrubbing speed quickly.

A good rider, who knows his bike can speed shift thru the gears pretty fast....without ever letting off on the throttle. I usually like to like to let off just a tad to get some of the draw off the transmission dogs.

Using this technique on a streetbike wont hurt it.....just make sure you know your gearing. I do it all the time on my CR350 cafe bike.....and she still runs like a champ.

Later,
Greg

[JonnyHonda]

I've always done this on the way up thu the gears, but how many of us dropthe clutch slightly early on the way down, just to raise the revs?

[Pinhead]

I always thought that's how you were supposed to shift a bike. Clutch in first and no clutch the rest of the way up.

[oldbiker]

When I was racing, I made all up-shifts without the clutch but down-shifts are better made using the clutch to avoid jerking the transmission which can cause you to lose adhesion at the back if you are heeled over.

[Mark M]

I seem to remember Keith Code recomending this technique.

If you apply gently preasure on the gearlever then back off a touch on the throttle, if your gearbox is good it
will slip sweetly into the next gear.

It was common racing practice before quick shifters. 

[bill440cars]

I seem to remember Keith Code recomending this technique.

If you apply gently preasure on the gearlever then back off a touch on the throttle, if your gearbox is good it
will slip sweetly into the next gear.

It was common racing practice before quick shifters. 

         Hey Mark, Nice looking bike in your avatar. Yours? How bout some photos, like to get a look at it, as I'm sure others would also. Later on, Bill

[Super Sport 550]

Unless I am trying to ride slowly and smoothly (who does that?), I don't usually use the clutch except to get moving. Downshifting I use the clutch about half of the time. I have shifted without the clutch at wide open throttle on several of my bikes a couple of times, but you've got to be pretty much at redline.

Of course, I haven't ridden my CB550 enough to find out if it is any different in this respect than the old Kawasaki twins and single cylinder Hondas that I've been riding...

but how many of us dropthe clutch slightly early on the way down, just to raise the revs?

I have done that, usually when I am going to pull out of a corner fast.

[Demon67]

I don't know if anyone is old enough to remember the kill switches on brit bikes but it was common practice to wind it up then dab the switch to shift, one could get the bike moving reasonably rapidly that way.
Bill.

[bill440cars]

I don't know if anyone is old enough to remember the kill switches on brit bikes but it was common practice to wind it up then dab the switch to shift, one could get the bike moving reasonably rapidly that way.
Bill.

 

                  Oh yeah, I grew up around my Grandfather's motorcycle shop and in the last few years, he
        and my Dad had franchises for Royal Enfield (with and without the Indian name), BSA, Norton, AJS
        & Matchless. Plus, it was a button that you had to hold down (to ground out the magneto) til it
        died and if you let go before that, it came back to life. Oh yeah, I remember, as I'm sure some of
        the others around my age do. Also, the vertical twin and single cylinder Indian models had it too.
        I'm sure there were others (about anything with a magneto).  Later on, Bill

[putnaja1]

Hey, I have a related question here..

So, the general concensus here is that you can shift without a clutch- some guys say it's not hard on the trans, other disagree, but obviously it is possible to shift this way.

So, what if your clutch cable breaks away from home, and you don't have a spare?  You can upshift and downshift, but how would you start out?  If you're at a light, can you put the bike in nuetral, and when the light turns green, run with it, then slam it into first when you get back on the seat?  Also, how would you stop?  Shift it out of gear while moving, and into neutral?

Jason

[Lumbee]

...thats the way I'd do it if I was stuck away from home with no clutch...

[Super Sport 550]

I've ridden bikes with no clutches many times. Some you have to push faster than others to get started, but it really isn't that difficult. Some bikes you can just shove on the bars and put it in gear. Others you have to really run with. The only thing I have to say is that you had better be able to find neutral pretty easily, and remember that you won't be able to stop without shifting.

[bill440cars]

              Jason, As far as taking off (without a clutch cable) I'd get it rolling and carefully slip it into gear
      and proceed from there. And about stopping, you got it right. Slip it out of gear just before you
      need to stop and use your brakes as usual. If you have to downshift, be careful and try to get the
      feel of it. Hope that helps should the need ever arise. I've done the shifting without a clutch before
      but, it's been awhile. That's one thing about the old Jawas. They had a mechanism, at the end of
      the clutch pushrod, that actuated the clutch everytime you moved the shift lever. You could put it
      into gear, while stopped, and as long as you held the shift lever in that position, you could sit
      there. Now. it took some practice to do a good takeoff but it could be done.

       So, it seems there are several of us with the same basic advice.        Later on, Bill