Author Topic: Chinese CB500  (Read 5447 times)

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Offline Ted Nomura

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Chinese CB500
« on: February 27, 2006, 02:13:46 PM »
I remember seeing a photo of a Chinese-made Honda CB500 clone with different sheetmetal about two decades ago. Anybody else have any more photos?

The one I saw was in the motorcycle encyclopedia. It's a CB500 Four clone. When I find the book, I'll give you the Chinese name. The quality is a suspect on all Chinese made bikes but they had experience in their Honda Z50 clones. I'm hoping that someday they'll make a 1969 Honda CB750 clone, I'll sponcer it myself if I had the money but I only came close to winning the big lotto once. I don't mind it if the gas tank emblem says "Panda" instead of "Honda" as long as the pinholes are the same. To think that back in the 1960s and 1970s, Japanese bikes are considered "disposable". Some still think they are except that they are no longer cheap.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2006, 12:32:11 PM by Ted Nomura »
1969 Honda CB750, two 1970 CB750, two 1972 CB750K2, 1971 CB500, 1975 CB550, 1976 CB400F, 1968 CL450, 1973 CL450, 1974 CB450, 1970 1/2 SL350K1, 1971 SL350K1, 1972 SL350K2, 1972 CL350, 1972 CB350, 1983 CB1000C, 1976 Kawasaki KZ900A4, 1976 KH500A8, 1979 KZ400B, 1983 ZN1300, and so on and so on...

Offline bwaller

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2006, 03:24:40 PM »
Ted,

I never saw anything like that, but I did go to the bike show this past weekend here in Montreal and did see at least three different Chinese company displays. They really do like to copy the Japanese "look" although by the price & quality I saw these may be considered disposable!

Offline bill440cars

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2006, 04:14:45 PM »

          I haven't heard of that one but, They did copy the Jawa motorcycle called a Yezdi. I don't know if it's still in production or not. Be interesting to know about the Honda.  Later on, Bill
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Offline Ted Nomura

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2006, 12:17:13 PM »
Hey, I just found out the brand name of the Chinese-built version of the  early 1970's CB500 Four, it's called MIG.
1969 Honda CB750, two 1970 CB750, two 1972 CB750K2, 1971 CB500, 1975 CB550, 1976 CB400F, 1968 CL450, 1973 CL450, 1974 CB450, 1970 1/2 SL350K1, 1971 SL350K1, 1972 SL350K2, 1972 CL350, 1972 CB350, 1983 CB1000C, 1976 Kawasaki KZ900A4, 1976 KH500A8, 1979 KZ400B, 1983 ZN1300, and so on and so on...

Offline cb650

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2006, 12:22:17 PM »
At the local honda shop they have a sign that says they dont sell parts for the checker (china?) bikes.  Had to chuckle a little.   




             Terry
18 grand and 18 miles dont make you a biker

Offline Ted Nomura

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2006, 12:44:25 PM »
At the local honda shop they have a sign that says they dont sell parts for the checker (china?) bikes.  Had to chuckle a little.   




             Terry
I don't blame Honda. Chinese copies are mostly (or all) unlicensed so the quality is a suspect. Although I never heard of the term "Checker", except maybe they're referring to the chinese Z50 copies sold by Checker Auto Parts store. I remember when Honda Z50s cost $299 new back in the 1970s. I have three of them and no Chinese copies but they're hard to resist nowadays when they sell as cheap as $300.  I remember the days when Hondas were considered disposibles.
« Last Edit: March 25, 2006, 12:49:05 PM by Ted Nomura »
1969 Honda CB750, two 1970 CB750, two 1972 CB750K2, 1971 CB500, 1975 CB550, 1976 CB400F, 1968 CL450, 1973 CL450, 1974 CB450, 1970 1/2 SL350K1, 1971 SL350K1, 1972 SL350K2, 1972 CL350, 1972 CB350, 1983 CB1000C, 1976 Kawasaki KZ900A4, 1976 KH500A8, 1979 KZ400B, 1983 ZN1300, and so on and so on...

Offline cb650

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2006, 01:02:01 PM »
Checker is a auto parts store.  They have a bunch off diff bikes and they look just like hondas except for colors.  Suspect they are china but never looked.   Guy I used to race with bought one of those 50 bragin how you could but parts for it from honda.  No I dont blame honda but a sale is a sale.




                       Terry
18 grand and 18 miles dont make you a biker

Offline csendker

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2006, 01:08:58 PM »
There's a legal chinese clone out there. 

Check out this thread --> http://www.sohc4.us/forums/index.php?topic=7571.msg70944#msg70944
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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2006, 02:54:00 PM »
Checker is a auto parts store.  They have a bunch off diff bikes and they look just like hondas except for colors.  Suspect they are china but never looked.   Guy I used to race with bought one of those 50 bragin how you could but parts for it from honda.  No I dont blame honda but a sale is a sale.
                       Terry

So it's not checker as in "Chinese Checkers" as Terry (CB650) alluded? All the Jap manufacturers outsource from China and Korea at the moment, I believe that the Yamaha PW50's and some Honda scooters are made in China, and I can tell you, the quality is good, much better than Jap quality from the 1960's and 1970's was. I bought some alloy rims from China last year, and they are as good as any European rim, in fact, I believe that there is a very popular US rim and spoke shop selling the exact same Chinese rims for about 10 times what I paid for mine when I bought mine direct from the factory! Cheers, Terry. ;D
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Offline csendker

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2006, 06:35:20 PM »
http://220.198.196.104/index/index.jsp

Too bad I can't get the 'English' button to work.
Actually runs --> 1975 CB550-K1
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Offline 74cb750

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2006, 03:53:42 AM »
My brother just bought a Korean Hyosong ? gs250 v twin sight unseen for $2,000 from a Manchester nh dealer.
They normally sell for $2800-3,000. I will let you know about the quality after he rides it for a while.
He tried to get me to buy one also, but I think I'll stick with my old Hondas for a while yet.
michel

http://www.bikez.com/motorcycles/hyosung_gt_250_2005.php

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Offline Bodi

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2006, 07:41:01 PM »
A lot of Japanese bikes in the 60's really were pretty disposable. Honda seemed to go for durability and their 4-stroke engines earned a reputation for being bulletproof. But Suzuki, Yamaha, and Kawasaki made a LOT of faster 2-strokes that got them into the market in a big way. You still see lots of old Hondas - 90 Trails buzzing around the woods at the cottage, occasional Dreams and Super Hawks ridden daily - but when did you last spot a running X6 or Avenger?
Chinese bikes are at the same place now, just breaking into the world market with "dubious quality" machinery. The "pocket bikes" have left a bad impression but they are in fact toys, not actual motorcycles.
Don't underestimate Chinese engineering. Japanese products in the 50's were pretty much junk, cheap copies of American and European goods like cameras and watches. In the 60's they learned a LOT, and by the 80's Japanese products were becoming known as the world standard - cameras, watches, bikes, cars, heavy machinery, just about any high profit product.
I think that in 10 years there will be a major Chinese presence in the world bike and car market. I doubt if it will be 20 years before a Chinese vehicle wins "car of the year". Or "bike of the year", if such an award existed in any meaningful way.

Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2006, 05:21:30 AM »
My brother just bought a Korean Hyosong ? gs250 v twin sight unseen for $2,000 from a Manchester nh dealer.
They normally sell for $2800-3,000. I will let you know about the quality after he rides it for a while.
He tried to get me to buy one also, but I think I'll stick with my old Hondas for a while yet.
michel

http://www.bikez.com/motorcycles/hyosung_gt_250_2005.php



Hyosungs have a bad reputation in Spain. Cheap to buy, but not even under warranty are the spares available, and the aftersales service is poor. There is a power cruiser called Aquila that I like, but i think they need another 5 or 10 years to debug their engines.

Raul


P.S. I also believe that chinese will take on the world.

Offline Ted Nomura

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2006, 12:15:34 PM »
I mentioned in my own motorcycle comics series (Angels 750) that Chinese motorcycles now are probably close to what Japan was in the 1950s. Back then Japanese depended on foreign designs and many different manufactures had quality problems until Honda took over the market. Back in the 1960s, people still considered Honda as junk(so much that when I customized my first Honda in 1973, I removed all Honda logos!) but after the 1970s, they took over the quality control leadership. Hopefully Chinese will follow suit. I have nearly 40 Japanese built motorcycles now but no Chinese clones yet. I'm still waiting for them to make a CB500 or CB750 clone. I don't care if the tank barges says "Panda", as long as it's the same size of the Honda logo.
1969 Honda CB750, two 1970 CB750, two 1972 CB750K2, 1971 CB500, 1975 CB550, 1976 CB400F, 1968 CL450, 1973 CL450, 1974 CB450, 1970 1/2 SL350K1, 1971 SL350K1, 1972 SL350K2, 1972 CL350, 1972 CB350, 1983 CB1000C, 1976 Kawasaki KZ900A4, 1976 KH500A8, 1979 KZ400B, 1983 ZN1300, and so on and so on...

Offline Uncle Ernie

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2006, 01:00:13 PM »
From what I've seen, aside from the scooters, the Chinese bikes look like little Harleys. The Hyosungs- Korean I think- are pretty blatant with imitation. One looks like a generic Japanes sport bike, but the other loks very much like a HD V-Rod, only it's 650cc.
We won't take Chinese stuff at our shop because they're kind of nuts; the dealership has a deal with Cheng Shen (sp?) so that you can only buy a special sized tired through them. Parts Unlimited doesn't have them. They also have weird chains. Master links aren't available seperately, so you have to go to the dealership and get a whole new chain.  Sme of the chains are so tiny, even a chainsaw shop can't help you.  The sprocket on one I saw looked more like a saw blade- the teeth were tiny.
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Offline crazypj

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #15 on: March 27, 2006, 01:15:38 PM »
Bennelli copied the CB500 as well in the laste 70's then added a couple of cylinders to make a  750 Six. Engine quality was pretty bad from what I remember but would out handle the CB500f. Good upgrade was to change motor for a Honda CB500 with 600 kit. Cheaper than a Dresda.
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Offline Ted Nomura

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2006, 03:57:13 PM »
Bennelli copied the CB500 as well in the laste 70's then added a couple of cylinders to make a  750 Six. Engine quality was pretty bad from what I remember but would out handle the CB500f. Good upgrade was to change motor for a Honda CB500 with 600 kit. Cheaper than a Dresda.
PJ
Unfortunately when Benelli copied Honda's CB500 Four engine for their 500 Quattro and six-cylinder 750 Sei, they also copied Honda's original defective gearbox throw-arm design which Honda corrected theirs in 1972 but Benelli copied Honda's original 1971 gearbox. 750 Sei was introduced in 1973 but didn't go into production until several years later. By then there were much faster 750s by other makers and Benelli couldn't keep up even with their 900cc version. Italians did make excellent handling frames though. Too bad that Benellis didn't copy their own racing engine designs but even back in the late 1960s, Honda RC174 engines proved to be far advanced.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2006, 01:37:38 PM by Ted Nomura »
1969 Honda CB750, two 1970 CB750, two 1972 CB750K2, 1971 CB500, 1975 CB550, 1976 CB400F, 1968 CL450, 1973 CL450, 1974 CB450, 1970 1/2 SL350K1, 1971 SL350K1, 1972 SL350K2, 1972 CL350, 1972 CB350, 1983 CB1000C, 1976 Kawasaki KZ900A4, 1976 KH500A8, 1979 KZ400B, 1983 ZN1300, and so on and so on...

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2006, 06:23:27 PM »
Make no mistake - the Chinese can make engineered products at any quality level. I have a mate in Adlealide who works for an Australian company supplying disc brake rotors for Holden cars - or used to. The Chinese now supply these parts - not because the price is better, but because they can meet the tighter tolerances Holden requires - which the local company cannot.

It is only a matter of the time - when the Chinese decide to enter the higher value end of the market they have the potential to be as successful as the Japanese.

Hey, but when the Chinese scoiety becomes westernised like us, where will we buy all of our cheap products from?

Cheers,

Neil.

Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #18 on: March 31, 2006, 02:37:29 AM »
Hey, but when the Chinese scoiety becomes westernised like us, where will we buy all of our cheap products from?

Cheers,



My theory is that when the majority of the western civilization becomes unemployed, we will have to lower our minimum hourly rate. We will have to either migrate to Asia or work for them, as they will start to become rich. And the cycle will start all over again.


Raul

Offline 74cb750

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #19 on: March 31, 2006, 02:45:00 AM »
By the time the Chinese need to find lower-wage workers, we will
have found life elsewhere in the universe.... ;D
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Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #20 on: March 31, 2006, 03:29:40 AM »
Not so, because their wages will have to rise. As soon as they realize they can become the buyers of all that shiny stuff they have been building for decades, they will start to claim better work conditions. And no matter what the comunist laws say, the people will revolt if that's what it takes. You can't just open the window to show the prisoners how freedom looks like, and expect they will get back to their cells. Just my 2 cents.


Raul

Offline dusterdude

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #21 on: March 31, 2006, 10:35:17 AM »
rauls right,as soon as the rest of the world has priced themselves out of the job market it will revert back to us and everyone else making cheap stuff.
mark
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Offline Terry in Australia

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #22 on: March 31, 2006, 12:14:29 PM »
I like cheap stuff! ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

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Offline dusterdude

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #23 on: March 31, 2006, 12:15:28 PM »
so do i,but it will be tough living on 2.00 an hour.
mark
1972 k1 750
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1 1/2 gl1100 goldwings
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Offline Ted Nomura

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Re: Chinese CB500
« Reply #24 on: March 31, 2006, 01:48:39 PM »
When Chinese can build a clone of the original Honda CB750 with the same quality, I might convert. They can probably do it now if they had someone with commitment like Mr. Honda was. Quality on Japanese bikes during 1950s were highly suspect until most of the lesser brands died by the 1960s. By early 1960, Japanese pretty much kicked the quality problem but us Americans didn't take it seriously until the 1970s.
I remember the years when Americans complained about cheap Japanese labor. Personally I think we should let others produce cheap products so we won't have a big immigration problem. Imagine if Mexico can outproduce China! I still think Mexico can be a major economic power if there was real commitment. We should all take lessons of what Mr. Honda did. He adapted the American quality control and improved on it.
 I remember when we had Mexican built bikes for sale in the U.S. during the early 1970s. I had high hopes. They looked like early Hondas with Yamaha-type two stroke engines. What happened?
1969 Honda CB750, two 1970 CB750, two 1972 CB750K2, 1971 CB500, 1975 CB550, 1976 CB400F, 1968 CL450, 1973 CL450, 1974 CB450, 1970 1/2 SL350K1, 1971 SL350K1, 1972 SL350K2, 1972 CL350, 1972 CB350, 1983 CB1000C, 1976 Kawasaki KZ900A4, 1976 KH500A8, 1979 KZ400B, 1983 ZN1300, and so on and so on...