Topic: Eliminating Steel Line to Front Brake Caliper

[BobbyR]

I am refreshing my 78 CB750K. It dawned on me that I am depending on a 28 year old rubber hose to bring the bike and I to a stop. I ordered a new Stainless Steel braided line from HELUSA. They contacted me and asked that I call them. They say a lot of people are eliminating the steel line. I have looked a set up like this. Has anyone done this? The reason always given for using the braided line reducing is the expansion of the rubber hose under pressure. In my view existing steel line does not expand at all and has a smaller diameter than the hose which would give me lower volume to the caliper, but a higher pressure.  If I went all braided hose from the Master Cylinder to the Caliper, I may get less pressure due to some expansion of the braided line coupled with the larger diameter hose. I also the line sheathed in Black to maintain the original look.

[csendker]

I always thought the short steel piece was put in because it's right next to the wheel.  A hose, braided or not is more 'floppy', which may not be a good thing in that particular location.  I seriously doubt there would be any difference in either pressure produced,  volume delivered or performance in either case - steel piece or not.  Just make sure you secure it so there's no potential hose/wheel contact when bouncing around at high speeds.

[KCs76Cafe]

Im in the process of doing the same. I have a master cylinder off of a 98 Suzuki Kantana 600 and a 30" braided hose from Russell connected to the cyl with a 35* banjo.

 I just need a connector to go from the braided hose to the caliper. The Kirk catalog shows a #3 AN - 10mm x 1.25mm inverted flare adapter.......anyone know if this is the one I need?

 I had bought 2 banjo fittings and used the banjo bolt on the Kantana master up there.....and was hoping one of my stock banjo bolts would work at the caliper but theyre too long. So I guess I'll just go straight into the caliper from the hose....if I can find out what fitting to get.

[eldar]

Well I just sent my line to helusa to get copied. I think I will just keep the line. If you look between the fender mount and the fork, there is not a lot of room and I dont think a brake line would fit in there. The steel line is probably just as strong and can be bent some to fit good. Plus it will stay put and not move around.

[Zane]

I seriously considered eliminating the steel pipe when HELUSA made my lines for me a couple of months ago.  As much as I wanted as much of the new, smokey/clear finished, braided line as possible, I ended up staying with the pipe next to the wheel.  I did that for a couple of reasons, the main one being, that is the way the system was originally designed.  Somehow it just makes more sense to me that the part of the entire brake line that flexes the most is set back behind the fender, if you know what I mean.  I like it that, from the fender forward, the whole works turns with the wheel as one (more or less) rigid unit.

(As a probably worthless aside, I will say I'm pleased with the finish I chose.  The smokey/clear is dark enough to maintain the idea (at least) of the original line, but yet it plainly reads as braided stainless.  It's flashy but in an understated way .....)

[ProTeal55]

I am in the middle of a dual-disc setup on my scoot, and the time is near for spec'in out the brakelines. I def. want to get tid of that hardline, as I think it looks like crap (my opinion).
I feel that a braided line all the way to the calipers will look allot cleaner than that hard line.

I plan on running all Goodridge lines and fittings (I get a discount), so I would need an adapter
to go from the goodridge thread to the caliper itself.

Anyone know of what I need, where to get it , etc

[Zane]

I'm not too sure where I would look for an adapter like the one you will require.

And yeah, I know what you mean when you say "crap".

This is how mine usually looks.....

[ProTeal55]

The Kirk catalog shows a #3 AN - 10mm x 1.25mm inverted flare adapter.......anyone know if this is the one I need?

KCs76CAFE----->
Keep me posted on what you find out, seems we are looking for the same adapter...

[BobbyR]

Thanks guys, I think I will stay with the steel line next to the wheel for all the resons stated. That smoke finish does look hot, I am go that way.

[Zane]

Since you like that particular finish B.R., here's another look at the bottom, front line (where it connects to the pipe).

I'm really happy with the stainless, HEL fittings too.  The high quality is obvious once you see them.

I did make one mistake though, and I'll share it with you even though odds are very long you'd make the same error.  When I gave Craig (at HELUSA) the specs on my upper and lower lines I assumed my old lines were the stock lines.  But they weren't and I ended up with the upper line a few inches longer than it needed to be.  It works, and it fits and looks okay.  But it bugs me that it's longer than neccessary.

(Perhaps I'll have it shortened eventually, but for now I'm living with the (albeit small) error.

[KCs76Cafe]

The Kirk catalog shows a #3 AN - 10mm x 1.25mm inverted flare adapter.......anyone know if this is the one I need?

KCs76CAFE----->
Keep me posted on what you find out, seems we are looking for the same adapter...

Will do ProTeal. Im taking the old hard line with me to work tomorrow. I work for a company that makes truck bodies and we happen to have a chassis shop......so maybe I can find out what size the fitting is on the hard line that goes into the caliper. Im hoping it is the #3 AN - 10mm x 1.25mm  inverted flare . That sounds right.......being an inverted flare......seems like all hard brake lines have those.

I'll let you know what I find out.

[WHALEMAN]

I am also in the process of a dual disk setup and will be getting new lines. The 10x1.25 inverted flair on Kirk will work. The only problem in my mind is it looks bulky with all the fittings. Another way to go is Kirk sells a 10x1.25 single banjo bolt so a banjo fitting (10mm x 90 degrees or so) can be used. I can't decide which waay to go. Anyone ever go the banjo route?

[KCs76Cafe]

It would only be the one fitting going from the braided hose into the caliper........couldnt be too bulky.

 I think Im going to try and find one locally. I need it yesterday now that I've got my tank,seat base and side covers back from paint.

[ProTeal55]

The 10x1.25 inverted flair on Kirk will work. Another way to go is Kirk sells a 10x1.25 single banjo bolt so a banjo fitting (10mm x 90 degrees or so) can be used.

Good Information 
Have any part numbers or pics of both setups ?

I would think that the 2nd option would look cleaner, but I am just guessing here....

[Lumbee]

The reason always given for using the braided line reducing is the expansion of the rubber hose under pressure.

I've heard that before also, and its hard for me to believe that the difference in rubber and steel would make that much difference.  However, I have a braided line for hel on my chop.  I went straight from the MC to the caliper.  The brake is harder than whores heart!  I'm not saying its the lines, but within an inch or so, its rock hard...

[bryanj]

In my humble opinion it would be a very bad idea to go directly from the adaptor to the flexible pipe as that would mean the  flexible exiting straight upwards. Goodrich do make what is called a swivel elbow to go from the adaptor to the flexible. I think some in this thread have had pictures from me others are welcome if you email me your address direct.

[eldar]

Once I took a look at the small space the line hasto go through, I decided to stick with the tube. The space is very small and while a braided line MIGHT fit in that space, I do not feel like having to take the fender off everytime I need to  do something with the brake. I also did not want to have the line sit on top of the fender as that would look VERY bad and expose it to even more possible problems.

[dusterdude]

Once I took a look at the small space the line hasto go through, I decided to stick with the tube. The space is very small and while a braided line MIGHT fit in that space, I do not feel like having to take the fender off everytime I need to  do something with the brake. I also did not want to have the line sit on top of the fender as that would look VERY bad and expose it to even more possible problems.

fender off?you mean you have to work on that k8?

[eldar]

Not a lot but even brake lines wear out! Spokes need truing and all that basic stuff that happens to all bike.

[dusterdude]

uh huh,ok.

[ProTeal55]

I do not feel like having to take the fender off everytime I need to do something with the brake. I also did not want to have the line sit on top of the fender

Just don't run a front fender, and you won't have any issues 

P.S--> The american v-twin bikers have bene running stainless braded lines , from the caliper to the master for years , without any issues. As long as the lines are free from obstructions, they should be fine...

Any part numbers for these "adapters" ?

[eldar]

Thats fine and dandy but I do not have the equipment or time to make a brace for the fork. So using the fender is my option right now. And keeping the area clean looking means running the line between the fender and fork. there is barely enough room for the steel line there and so I doubt a braid line would fit without being pinched. I dont mind the tube though. I actually think it look better on this style of caliper as opposed to a banjo. Now if I had and F, welll that would be different but then the F uses banjos anyways I think.

[ProTeal55]

Thats fine and dandy but I do not have the equipment or time to make a brace for the fork. So using the fender is my option right now.

I took the stock brace out of the front fender, instead of buying some high dollar one, or having one made just for my scoot. This project is all about low $$$. There is a pic of it in my gallery.

[eldar]

Did you just drill the rivets out? I got a second fender cause mine got beat bad by hail. What about crap all over the engine? Kinda sucks to have #$%* flying everywhere doesnt it?

[BobbyR]

Zane, it look very nice. You may find an alternate route to take up the slack. I guess size does matter in some cases.