Author Topic: Kick Start Questions (71 CB500) (Read 11133 times)

Čina · « **on:** September 28, 2010, 10:16:34 AM »

I've modified this question to be more specific.....I hope. I put on a new kick start lever that I just got. With the clutch engaged the kick start will turn the engine in both directions. With or without the clutch engaged the lever does not spring back. If I turn the lever all the way around until it stops it does spring back just a little bit with the clutch disengaged, but not by much. How does the kick start mechanism work and is there a problem with mine?

Thanks

Čina · « **Reply #1 on:** October 05, 2010, 06:41:34 PM »

Just bringing this to the top because of the new question.

ferroussphinx · « **Reply #2 on:** October 05, 2010, 07:07:35 PM »

not sure it seems something is amiss hopefuly someone can help

bryanj · « **Reply #3 on:** October 05, 2010, 09:19:40 PM »

Kickstart will only work with the clutch lever left alone andit it doesnt return properly the return spring (inside the clutch cover) is broken or fitted wrong

Čina · « **Reply #4 on:** October 05, 2010, 09:41:24 PM »

Ok, thanks. I guess now my biggest concern is that the lever turns the motor in both directions. To the best of my limited understanding, that should not happen. If the spring is the only issue then I'm not terribly worried. If the ratchet mechanism isn't working then I have a little more work ahead of me.......Which seems to be the story every time I look at something new with this bike.

Dennis · « **Reply #5 on:** October 05, 2010, 11:02:46 PM »

Quote from: Čina on October 05, 2010, 09:41:24 PM

Ok, thanks. ............. my biggest concern is that the lever turns the motor in both directions. To the best of my limited understanding, that should not happen.

You are correct, that should not happen.
Kickstart function is to turn engine on the down stroke and to "ratchet back" on the upstroke.

If it can turn the engine in either direction, it is not ratcheting.
Something is wrong here. Sorry but I can't tell you what is causing that.

videopunk101 · « **Reply #6 on:** October 06, 2010, 12:03:10 AM »

Your kick starter shaft might be stripped out so it might not grab and turn the engine over.

Frostyboy · « **Reply #7 on:** October 06, 2010, 02:08:54 AM »

[Edit] I just realised I'm lookin' at my 550 parts list. Not sure if is the same, sorry just in case.

Was the kick start okay before you changed the lever?
I wonder if you might have used a hammer to get the new one on? Was the pinch bolt removed before you slipped it onto the spline?
If force was used, I wonder if the circlip (#43 in the pic below) hasn't been displaced and ~~shaft is too far in now?~~ [Looking at that, I don't think it can happen. Sorry

]
I've never heard of the kick start pinion seizing on the shaft but who knows until maybe you get into it a bit further.

Good luck, I hope you don't have to split the cases.

dave500 · « **Reply #8 on:** October 06, 2010, 02:27:13 AM »

remove the clutch cover,the last bloke with kick starter on 500 problems had it sieze whilst riding locking the rear wheel and causing a bit of a kerfuffle internaly.,you can also drop the pan and have a gander up into that area.

Čina · « **Reply #9 on:** October 06, 2010, 07:57:40 AM »

Thanks guys.

I was trying to see what could be the problem before I opened it. I really only had the bike for almost a month. I noticed this problem right from the start. I guess I'll have to open it and take a look. With the spark plugs out it turns nice and easy so there's no problems anywhere else I can see. The clutch seems to be working fine as well. I'm hoping it's just the ratchet mechanism. This bike hasn't been registered since 1986 so who knows what happened back then and what's been going on the last 24 years. I want to wrap this up and the electrical before the winter comes and I can only work on small things indoors.

Čina · « **Reply #10 on:** October 16, 2010, 02:38:12 PM »

I removed the clutch cover and the oil pan and the spring looks like it is on correctly based on other photos I have seen. The mechanism looks to be ok. Maybe the spring that separates the two components is failing. I didn't do much with it because I ended up being more preoccupied with the small parts I found in the clutch cover and oil pan. Here's some photos.

Any ideas?

Thanks

scottly · « **Reply #11 on:** October 16, 2010, 08:19:14 PM »

Quote from: Čina on October 16, 2010, 02:38:12 PM

Thanks

This does not look good...

dave500 · « **Reply #12 on:** October 16, 2010, 09:06:16 PM »

thats a gear shaft bearing,is the bike ridable?

Čina · « **Reply #13 on:** October 16, 2010, 10:46:58 PM »

No, the bike isn't rideable. Check the build thread in my sig.

Seeing the rollers made me eventualy assume it was a bearing. I'm just having trouble figuring out which one. It has an end to it so the shaft doesn't go through at all. I'm going to have to go and take a look underneath again. I've studied the drawings and now have a better idea which one it might be. I was hoping to not have to pull the engine this winter but it seems I may have to.

dave500 · « **Reply #14 on:** October 16, 2010, 10:51:52 PM »

pull the engine and split the cases,its a major,if the bearing let go the shafts would have gone out of kilter and you might have mashed teeth aswell,dont pussy foot around take it all apart.

Čina · « **Reply #15 on:** October 16, 2010, 10:57:52 PM »

Yeah, I realize I'm going to have to. I was just hoping I wasn't going to have to before I found all the bits in the oil pan. There is a local shop who has another full bike and offered it to me for not a whole lot. I wasn't going to buy it but am thinking about it now. It may be worth it just for the engine and then to part the rest.

What would be the best source to get transmission parts for this. There is a local dealer or are the internet sources better/easier/cheaper?

dave500 · « **Reply #16 on:** October 17, 2010, 12:46:16 AM »

keep the whole bike cina,major parts like shift forks and shafts are unobtainium,if its cheap and you have the space keep it all.,im trying to picture where that circlip came from,anyone?id guess your kickstart mechanism is ok,its the clutch or countershaft bearing it works with has failed,po dumping the clutch and trying to do burnouts?these are tough bikes but some abuse is just too much.

Čina · « **Reply #17 on:** October 17, 2010, 11:03:22 AM »

I took another look and am now more confused than ever. There seems to be nothing wrong in there. Everything turns nicely, the gears change, nothing is out of alignment, there is absolutley no way those pieces came out of anywhere as it sits. There is just no space and nothing is damaged inside. Maybe something happened before and it was repaired and somehow those pieces stayed inside because there was nothing else in there. I'm certain the oil pan for sure was removed in the past.

I put it on its side and took some photos. Do you see anyting out of the ordinary?

Thanks

Stev-o · « **Reply #18 on:** October 17, 2010, 11:09:08 AM »

Go make an offer on the parts bike!

scottly · « **Reply #19 on:** October 17, 2010, 07:27:26 PM »

Quote from: scottly on October 16, 2010, 08:19:14 PM

Quote from: Čina on October 16, 2010, 02:38:12 PM

Thanks
This does not look good...

The big piece looks like part of a shift drum?

Čina · « **Reply #20 on:** December 13, 2010, 09:51:58 AM »

Well I found the rest of those little bits and will be replacing that. It doesn't seem to have done much damage elsewhere and is probably unrelated to my kickstarter issue.

Now, I think I've figured out why the kickstarter is not working but I thought I would as to make sure and also get some advice since I'm a little stuck right now.

In the photo below, is this gear supposed to be able to turn freely on the shaft? Should I be able to remove it from the shaft without majore issue? Because at this point it won't turn and the I can't slide it off no matter how much I pry. Becuase of this I can't get the shaft out of the housing either. It's stuck there until the gear comes off. The shaft will turn and will slide about a 1/4" in and out.

bryanj · « **Reply #21 on:** February 16, 2011, 10:46:12 PM »

Yes that gear should slide off easy and those bits are definately from one of the shaft ends

Čina · « **Reply #22 on:** April 14, 2011, 11:04:49 PM »

The last reply was some time after my last one and this one is even later yet but I may as well update this in case someone truly wants to know.

I found out that the gear is supposed to spin freely on the shaft so I had it removed (destroyed) to get the shaft out. Turns out the shaft is slightly bent but that could be from me applying too much force. I did get a new (used) kickstart assembly off of ebay.

The pieces are the needle bearing at the end of the counter shaft. It turns out all those parts I need are NLA so I got a whole new (used again) set of transmission inerds off of ebay. The same guy actually.

Now it's just a matter of getting off of my ass, cleaning all the housings and such and reassembling the thing. I guess I'll be buying some new crank bearings and rings since I have it apart.

Roach · « **Reply #23 on:** April 14, 2011, 11:25:49 PM »

hurry up you have no excuse there is no hockey for you to watch

Čina · « **Reply #24 on:** April 15, 2011, 03:51:12 PM »

Quote from: Roach on April 14, 2011, 11:25:49 PM

hurry up you have no excuse there is no hockey for you to watch

Ha, you're right, no excuses whatsoever. I'm kicking myself for not being as productive as I should have been. Oh well, I'll get it eventually.

And I may live in Calgary but I'm from Southern Ontario and a Habs fan so I do have hockey to watch.

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Author Topic: Kick Start Questions (71 CB500) (Read 11133 times)