Topic: lame.......

[jro75]

Among other important reasons, this is bad news for our SOHC/4's:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/39653350/ns/us_news-environment/

[Duke McDukiedook]

Proof yet again that our gubment is just a pocket that the corporations stuff money into to screw us people further.

[CycleRanger]

Proof yet again that our gubment is just a pocket that the corporations stuff money into to screw us people further.

Actually, when it comes to corn it's the corporations pockets that the government is stuffing money into...

Corn production is subsidized by the government to keep American farmers "competitive".
American "farmers" like Cargill, Monsanto, ConAgra, and ADM.....

[Duke McDukiedook]

I think the backrubbing kumbaya circle rubs both ways there.

[Terry in Australia]

My ageing father made a pertinent point about converting food crops into fuel crops, he said that the price of corn, sugar etc will go through the roof as a result, and as farmers see the wisdom in gowing fuel crops, they'll get rid of their less profitable crops. While I'm all for "greener" fuels, I don't think converting food crops to fuel crops will help anyone. 

[Retro Rocket]

My ageing father made a pertinent point about converting food crops into fuel crops, he said that the price of corn, sugar etc will go through the roof as a result, and as farmers see the wisdom in gowing fuel crops, they'll get rid of their less profitable crops. While I'm all for "greener" fuels, I don't think converting food crops to fuel crops will help anyone. 

Couldn't have said it any better.....Turning food into fuel is a selfish and short sighted money grab by the farming lobby {corn growers}....nothing else.

Mick

[Steve F]

AS it turns out, making ethanol from corn is the least productive and most expensive in regards to energy consumed per gallon produced.  I don't remember the figures, but there are other substances that can be used such as algae, and plain old grass which have a higher yield than corn.

6-BILLION in subsidies paid to the oil companies? WTF!

[Retro Rocket]

Pisses me off too Steve, they never let the truth get in the way of a good story.......

Mick

[demon78]

How screwed up is a system that makes fuel more important than food, and no I'm not jumping on the states, they do it every where, if a skilled propagandist disseminated that info in a bunch of 3rd world countries there might be upheaval in the rest of the world. Watching you family wither and die so some fat Canadian/American/European, can drive to the Ice Cream parlor rather than walk, would be enough set them off.
Bill the demon.

[Bob Wessner]

There are several different sources with slightly differing stats, but this seems as good as any.

http://www.slate.com/id/2122961/

This, from the above article pretty much spells out the issue.

But the ethanol critics have shown that the industry calculations are bogus. David Pimentel, a professor of ecology at Cornell University who has been studying grain alcohol for 20 years, and Tad Patzek, an engineering professor at the University of California, Berkeley, co-wrote a recent report that estimates that making ethanol from corn requires 29 percent more fossil energy than the ethanol fuel itself actually contains.

The two scientists calculated all the fuel inputs for ethanol production—from the diesel fuel for the tractor planting the corn, to the fertilizer put in the field, to the energy needed at the processing plant—and found that ethanol is a net energy-loser. According to their calculations, ethanol contains about 76,000 BTUs per gallon, but producing that ethanol from corn takes about 98,000 BTUs. For comparison, a gallon of gasoline contains about 116,000 BTUs per gallon. But making that gallon of gas—from drilling the well, to transportation, through refining—requires around 22,000 BTUs.

[syth82]

I read an article a while back about all this. Brazil runs on ethanol made from sugar cane. They use the wood from the cane as fuel to process the sugar. Make a lot more sense to me. Corn is the problem, not ethanol. Though, I think bio diesel is a much better answer in the long run.

[Duke McDukiedook]

Switchgrass and industrial hemp has a way higher btu than corn does and they are better to grow for the environment.

Corn is one of the worst crops you can grow from an environmental standpoint.
 

[tramp]

ethanol is also less effective than gas
less power less mpg
so you have to buy more to go less

[dave500]

ethanol is also less effective than gas
less power less mpg
so you have to buy more to go less














so they have to truck more using more fuel,the perfect commodity

[scottly]

Ethanol production from sugar based crops, such as sugar beets and sugar cane, is far more efficient than with corn. These crops are also more "soil friendly"....

[Retro Rocket]

All the ethanol in Australia comes from sugar cane. No food stuffs should ever be used for fuel unless it is old unusable food.

Mick

[dave500]

the world can starve,but we have to fuel cars in this way to save a buck?and the promo is that its green,,what a load of )(*&^%$#@!,i put all those characters there myself because i knew it would get censored,trouble is the general public are fed this "its green tactic" and go for it!,ive created less green house crud driving my old car all these years.,,i want a pre- mix two stroke v8

[Terry in Australia]

A two stroke V8? Fark, I want one too!

[demon78]

Something the size and shape of the Guzzi V-8 ?
Bill the demon.

[dave500]

big outboards have been v6,come on car makers,you have an untapped market here.6 litre piston ported reed valve with boost bottle v8 in my hq?eight tuned expansion chambers,move over lc rd350.

[Terry in Australia]

This has got to be the ultimate 2 stroke motorcycle!

http://il.youtube.com/watch?v=6ratfuML9QA&feature=related

[dave500]

what the?i love two strokes,i can ride both four and two stroke dirt bikes,i prefer two stokes off road,most dedicated four stroke dirt riders cant ride a two stroke properly,so they call them rubbish.