Topic: Air Filter & Stack Filter Kit for 550's & 750's / The end, see post #898, pg 36

[Tintop]

Quick update, the filters are getting closer to shipping.  Sounds like they may be ready to leave the UK by week's end.

750 frames

550 frames

[DYSKORD]

So do we have any actual performance reports with these yet? Did I miss it somewhere?

[wannabridin]

awesome!!  let me know when you need the money and how much i owe you and i'll get it over to you!

[shinneh]

So do we have any actual performance reports with these yet? Did I miss it somewhere?

+1 to this here. I too have been curious of any performance updates. Haven't you at least tried the filter on your own bike?

[voxonda]

Hi Tintop,

Please sent one the other way.

Rob

[Tintop]

So do we have any actual performance reports with these yet? Did I miss it somewhere?

+1 to this here. I too have been curious of any performance updates. Haven't you at least tried the filter on your own bike?

I have not been able to get mine on the road because of the weather, which is why I asked Terry to do some testing.  As Terry had the issue with his motor (tappet adjuster), things there have been at a standstill.  He is currently waiting for some jet drills so he can create some sizes he currently doesn't have for testing.  At this point both he and I have found that the carbs are as easy to setup as with the stock air box.  Both engines idle cleanly, and do not show any sign of the pod induced low speed flat spot off idle.  Terry is running the stock low speed jet, I'm running one size up (#40 vs 77K #38).  I have my needles lifted one notch, Terry's are in the stock position (?).  Both engines have non stock exhausts (Yoshi 4/1, Swarbrick 4/4).  Currently it looks like Terry's 836 will require x3 steps over stock on the main.  Mine is currently one size over (#90 to #98), however it is too lean on top.  I will be going to the next size up before road testing.  I also need to add baffles to create more back pressure.

So at this point the following has been confirmed.  The filter change does not effect low speed drivability like pods do, and may not require a slow speed jet change.  A needle lift may be required, and I will be experimenting with 1/2 lifts using the Suzuki shims.  An exhaust change does require a main jet change, as does a displacement increase.  This is both normal, and to be expected.

Given all of the above I would expect the following to hold true:
Stock carbs / engine / exhaust - x1 on the main because of the increased breathing above 1/4 throttle, and possibly a x1 notch needle lift.
Stock carbs / engine / after market exhaust - x2 on main, and needle lift (?)
Stock carbs / modified engine / after market exhaust - x2/3 on main, needle lift, possible increase in slow jet.

[odiewan]

Tintop, when you say x1 on the mains how much change are you talking about? 110 to 120?

So do we have any actual performance reports with these yet? Did I miss it somewhere?

+1 to this here. I too have been curious of any performance updates. Haven't you at least tried the filter on your own bike?

I have not been able to get mine on the road because of the weather, which is why I asked Terry to do some testing.  As Terry had the issue with his motor (tappet adjuster), things there have been at a standstill.  He is currently waiting for some jet drills so he can create some sizes he currently doesn't have for testing.  At this point both he and I have found that the carbs are as easy to setup as with the stock air box.  Both engines idle cleanly, and do not show any sign of the pod induced low speed flat spot off idle.  Terry is running the stock low speed jet, I'm running one size up (#40 vs 77K #38).  I have my needles lifted one notch, Terry's are in the stock position (?).  Both engines have non stock exhausts (Yoshi 4/1, Swarbrick 4/4).  Currently it looks like Terry's 836 will require x3 steps over stock on the main.  Mine is currently one size over (#90 to #98), however it is too lean on top.  I will be going to the next size up before road testing.  I also need to add baffles to create more back pressure.

So at this point the following has been confirmed.  The filter change does not effect low speed drivability like pods do, and may not require a slow speed jet change.  A needle lift may be required, and I will be experimenting with 1/2 lifts using the Suzuki shims.  An exhaust change does require a main jet change, as does a displacement increase.  This is both normal, and to be expected.

Given all of the above I would expect the following to hold true:
Stock carbs / engine / exhaust - x1 on the main because of the increased breathing above 1/4 throttle, and possibly a x1 notch needle lift.
Stock carbs / engine / after market exhaust - x2 on main, and needle lift (?)
Stock carbs / modified engine / after market exhaust - x2/3 on main, needle lift, possible increase in slow jet.

[Tintop]

The next jet size up, so yes, if the increment is by 5 then 110 to 115, if by 10, then 110 to 120.

[odiewan]

So, if I go from stock engine, pods, 4 into 1 do I read a possible needle lift and bigger on the mains?

I am actually running 130s and I did a plug chop recently and if anything they look on the light side of tan. Can I interpret that as a bit on the lean side?

[Flying J]

i see where this thread is going.   

[odiewan]

Woops, sorry if this thread is meandering.

Let's talk about the #$%*in' stacks and filters....

[DYSKORD]

So if somebody is already running pods and 4-1 on an otherwise stock motor, no change in jetting or float should be necessary with your creation, right?

[odiewan]

Well, I am going to dyno my CB this weekend to get a base line, anyway. So, when I get these Air Filter/Stack assembly, I will do another run to see what is required.

[scottly]

Well, I am going to dyno my CB this weekend to get a base line, anyway. So, when I get these Air Filter/Stack assembly, I will do another run to see what is required.

When you get your dyno results, please post them on the High Performance forum. There is a thread dedicated to dyno tests.

[Retro Rocket]

So if somebody is already running pods and 4-1 on an otherwise stock motor, no change in jetting or float should be necessary with your creation, right?

Seeing though these are more efficient than pods i would say there would be initial changes , just like going from an airbox to pods but after that there should be no more setting up at all. I think you may have to go down on the jets for this set up from what you run for pods.

[odiewan]

Will do. Graphs and everything.

Well, I am going to dyno my CB this weekend to get a base line, anyway. So, when I get these Air Filter/Stack assembly, I will do another run to see what is required.

When you get your dyno results, please post them on the High Performance forum. There is a thread dedicated to dyno tests.

[Kong]

When you make that Dyno run, what I'd like to see is a comparison of the exhaust-gas residual oxygen levels up and down the RPM spectrum before and after the system is installed.  Those are the numbers that tell you what the carbs need; horsepower and torque numbers don't tell you much of anything useful for immediate tuning, they either give you bragging rights or an impetus to lie.

[odiewan]

Oh, the air/fuel mixture curve is what I am most interested. Those will be posted.

When you make that Dyno run, what I'd like to see is a comparison of the exhaust-gas residual oxygen levels up and down the RPM spectrum before and after the system is installed.  Those are the numbers that tell you what the carbs need; horsepower and torque numbers don't tell you much of anything useful for immediate tuning, they either give you bragging rights or an impetus to lie.

[DYSKORD]

So if somebody is already running pods and 4-1 on an otherwise stock motor, no change in jetting or float should be necessary with your creation, right?

Seeing though these are more efficient than pods i would say there would be initial changes , just like going from an airbox to pods but after that there should be no more setting up at all. I think you may have to go down on the jets for this set up from what you run for pods.

Oh, I was unaware you have been testing one. How did you test the "efficiency?"


This was actually more of a question to the few (2, I think) who have even seen these, not a question in general theory. But thanks.

[Flying J]

You know people are just trying to be helpful around here but you always seem to get defensive a be a prick. Read the thread. 2 people have the filters, neither were running pods, one hasn't ridden the bike due to weather and the other is overbore. So why would they know what your stock motor with pods needs? And when someone takes the time and speculates to help you out why are you a d!ck about it. Try to be a little more excepting of peoples advice if your just going to be a leach around here.

[Terry in Australia]

Yeah, it's a pity that Dyskord has decided to make himself the consumer advocate here and commensurate with his self elected authority, the right to ask the hard questions.

The fact is that Brian (Tintop) has come up with an alternative to the OEM airbox and pods, the only commonly available options for SOHC'ers at the moment. He's not asking anyone to buy his product, he's just putting it out there. The only "reports" that I'm going to provide once I get my jet drills (coming from Japan, so I hope they left before the quake hit) is my opinion of how well (or otherwise) it works on my bike.

There won't be any dyno runs, exhaust gas analyser readouts etc, because I don't have the facility, (I can get it dyno'd if Dyskord would like to pony up the 300 beans to pay for the run, if he wants to put his money where his mouth is, and actually contribute something to this thread apart from dissension) it'll just be my opinion on how well it works on my bike, with my setup, on my end of the pond.

I hope Brian isn't getting dejected reading some of these apparently negative posts, he's invested considerable time and money trying to make a viable alternative to pods to help us all out here, and it's disappointing in the extreme to see that the knockers have shown up to take some cheap shots. Dyskord by name, "Discord" by nature, or so it seems. Cheers, Terry.      

[Retro Rocket]

All i can say to Dyskord is that if he had any knowledge of how induction systems worked then maybe he wouldn't make stupid ignorant comments. Now if he could also learn to read he would know that these "anti pods" have velocity stacks {which are far superior to pods} and the manufacturer has already given horse power ratings over 300HP, but some people round here just like stirring #$%*, common sense just left the room.....There is also a growing trend around here for people to ask questions {some quite obvious} and then trash the responders with petty stupid answers......Grow a brain people....

[Tintop]

Thanks Terry, ffj, RR for the comments & support.

The fact is enough members here do understand what it is I'm offering.  As of this moment all of the next batch of 750 filters are spoken for.   That includes a nice new one for you Terry, and my K3 project.   There are a couple of 550 ones still available.  So no, I'm not dejected, I'm ecstatic that so many have stepped up, and supported what I'm offering.

No two engines are going to be the same, nor respond exactly the same to any change.  Early carbs vs PD's also enter the mix.  I plan to continue to post were I go with the 550, and the K3 project; and expect as the filters get delivered, others will also post their own results.  I do know, and Terry seems to have had the same result.  At idle, and rolling off idle is as good, or better than the stock air box.  Better than Pods.  As for the top end, as RR pointed out it can support 300HP, and is essentially 4 open velocity stocks at WOT.  So yes, it's probably going to need more fuel vs the restrictive stock air box.

[seanbarney41]

basically  there is no reason to get salty... idle is simple...full throttle is simple(do a freakin' plug chop!)...it's all the throttle positions in between that give us all the problems when we ditch the airbox...200 some odd $$'s is some heavy cabbage if this problem is not solved...right?...mofos want some real world test results...I love you all...lets go fast together

[DYSKORD]

Tintop, I hope you dont seriously think anybody said anything negative about you or your product. I am intrigued by your efforts and am curious about alot of aspects of your design. Seemed like a reasonable question so I asked, as inncocent as that. No offense/insult intended

Terry, the original question was geared towards you and what your experience has been with Tintops product. No dyno analysis or anything of the sort is needed, or mentioned. Really just wanted someone with real world experience/testing with these to say "yeah, they kick ass! Buy them!" I was/am holding out for your educated opinion. Let us know.

FFJ and RR, nobody was being a "dick" or "prick" or "leach" or any other slandering word you have in your vocabulary. It was a pretty straight forward question to those that are testing, which would not be either of you. If it is so simple then there wouldn't be any need for testing in the first place would there. Nobody said anything negative about anybody, until a couple of recent posts by you two, FFJ and RR. Most of us have some sense about jetting w/ pods and exhaust etc. and some of us dont, thats one of the many reasons we are here. Nobody asked for a dyno run! Where did you all even come up with that? The fact of the matter is I dont like my pods and these are supposed to be better. Since some more experienced members than myself, Tintop and Terry, had some questions about performance and benefits, they decided to test them out, so naturally I followed with questions and would like to know their findings before dropping $200. This is a "for sale" thread about a prototype, if you will, and therefore your request for "contributions" seems a little misplaced since only Tintop and Terry can really "contribute."  Retro Rocket and FFJ, quit throwing your insecurities around for all to witness like a couple of pre-teen girls, nobody said anything negative about either of you! Quit being pus**s and go ride your motorcycles.