Topic: Carb sync gauges. Do I need adapters?

[Nortstudio]

1976 CB550k: 

I'm looking to get my first set of carb sync gauges from Z1.  They are the cheapest they have.  I see that they have 5mm adapters that come with them.  Is there anything additional that I need? They offer additional adapters on the same page.

I've never used these before - so I want to make sure I get the right thing.
http://www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=2727


Thanks

[Spanner 1]

Yep, good to go... I have these same gauges and they work great..... good price too.

[Frostyboy]

The adapters that come with it are the right ones. I have a set of these also.
What you will need however is something to extend your fuel hoses so that you can do it all with the tank out of the way to get to the adjusters.
I use some extra hoses connected to the petcock & couple them to the standard hoses. I sit the tank across the front of the seat & haven't had any disasters with the tank falling off, I make sure to have the bike on the centre stand though.
Another thing to do is to make sure all the gauges are calibrated the same.
Connect each gauge to a single port one at a time & make sure each gauge reads the same on that one port. That way you can be sure of accuracy when adjusting your carbs.

[Nortstudio]

Thanks so much guys. Good call on the extension hose and coupler.

Can you tell me if I can grab a coupler at the auto store?  Z1 only has Y connectors (actually not sure what those are for). 

Appreciate your time.

Scott

[Frostyboy]

Can you tell me if I can grab a coupler at the auto store?  Z1 only has Y connectors (actually not sure what those are for). 

I use a couple of elbows from automotive DIN battery vent tubes. You could use a couple of elcheapo inline filters I suppose.
There was enough leftover hose from the replacement hose kit I got from Honda for the length.

[Nortstudio]

Thanks frosty. I was thinking the online filter route, but I already have some in line, so I feared that would effect the sync.

I'll see if I can grab some couplers at the auto store - and if not, I'll give the filters a try.

[tango911]

yeah i just have an extra line and use a in line filter to attach to he carbs, and i use a fold up saw horse to put the tank on.  But then i have a garage and am not hardcore out on the curb in Brooklyn wrenching like you are Nort.  I have these gauges as well and seem to work great.  i checked all of them on one carb to see if they are showing the same reading.  then i hooked them all up and seem to work great.  My bench sync must have been right on cause they all read the same, you have to have the rpms up tho, or the needles bounce around like crazy.

steve
 

[Nortstudio]

Thanks steve. I realize now I can just attach some longer line to the one side of the current filter I have. The line was so tight before that I had to cut it off, but this new line I have on there is looser/more pliable.

[Frostyboy]

........... you have to have the rpms up tho, or the needles bounce around like crazy.

Not really. If you close the taps on those little valves on each line, you should be able to achieve a steady reading at least down to 1,00rpm.

[tango911]

........... you have to have the rpms up tho, or the needles bounce around like crazy.

Not really. If you close the taps on those little valves on each line, you should be able to achieve a steady reading at least down to 1,00rpm.

   With all due respect, out of the box at low rpms the needles do bounce around.  Plz show a pic and explain more about closing the taps on "those little vavles on each line".

thanks!
steve

[Nortstudio]

I would love to know how to do this also, since hopefully they will be in my hands and ready for the final stage of the tune-up soon.

Thanks

[srook]

"With all due respect, out of the box at low rpms the needles do bounce around.  Plz show a pic and explain more about closing the taps on "those little vavles on each line"

The damper valves limit the pulses by limiting the amount of volume that is measured.  If you have these type of guages without the damper valves then they will jump around like you said, but how good is a carb synch if you have to guess at which point the reading of the swinging needle is accurate?  If you use the damper valves you can cut down the swing of the needle tremendously to get a nice steady reading.  The amount of vaccum is determined by the intake tract and carbs all you are doing is cutting down the amount of vaccum that you want to read at the guage.  By limiting the volume the guage reads you are not increasing or decreasing vaccum. 

Think of measuring the temperature of a glass of water.  If you measure the entire glass you get a reading.  If you dump out half the glass you get the same reading.  The damper valves essentially dump out half the glass for you.  Hope this makes sense.

Scott

[tango911]

so your saying we need to buy damper valves?  If thats correct then your statement "not really" is incorrect.  They actually do bounce around at low rpms straight out of the box.    Can you link us to what a damper valve looks like?   The gauges we are talking about are the blue ones that come with hose and the brass stems.

heres a vid of a guy checking his 550 out with these cheap gauges.  He i think has his cylinder #'s mixed up. And seems to be a back yard mech. I resemble that

thanks
steve

[domer]

get these little suckers at any aquarium supply type place... add them inline and adjust till they dont bounce anymore. works great and they only cost a buck or 2 for all 4....

[tango911]

question,  whats the difference if you can get the needles not to bounce at a little higher rpm?

[srook]

Steve,

I'm not Frostyboy!  I'm not trying to engage you in some argument about who is right or wrong.  I believe the guages come with the damper valves already.  They are the white t-shaped things in the picture on Z1 Enterprises site http://www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=2727  If you have those type of guages you need the damper valves.  They should have come with the set of guages.
Scott

[tango911]

I understand now, and sorry to confuse you with Frosty.   Im not trying to ague just trying to understand what he was talking about.

Steve,

I'm not Frostyboy!  I'm not trying to engage you in some argument about who is right or wrong.  I believe the guages come with the damper valves already.  They are the white t-shaped things in the picture on Z1 Enterprises site http://www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=2727  If you have those type of guages you need the damper valves.  They should have come with the set of guages.
Scott

[srook]

"question,  whats the difference if you can get the needles not to bounce at a little higher rpm?"

The difference is that you need to synch the carbs at idle becuase differences in slide height effect rpm the most at idle.  Very small differences in slide height at idle can cause the dreaded hanging idle at 3,000 rpm.  At 1/4 throttle and above the slides don't effect rpm as much becuase a larger volume of air is entering the intake tract and you are moving into the mainjet/needle settings and not relying on the idle circuit for mixture.



Scott

[tango911]

oh how i love pictures,  thank you for that explanation, srook.

[Kong]

CHECK THIS ONE OUT. YOU CAN GET IS CHEEPER BY GOOGLEING IT PLUSS FREE SHIPPING.

http://www.motionpro.com/motorcycle/partno/08-0411/

I think you missed something somewhere, the price of that device you linked to is $99 and the one in the original post is $57. 

[Nortstudio]

Thanks for all the posts folks.  I ordered the ones through Z1.  I had another suggestion from a member about a good set - but they were too pricey for me at this time.

I wanted to mention also that somehow, after forgetting the exact address of Z1, I came across the Z1 site through a search, and these gauges showed on the page as "on sale.". Turned out, when placed in the basket - they showed as $57.  I emailed Z1 and they told me that the page I had 'accidentally' found was a sale page from 3 years ago.  Despite this, they honored the price.  Very cool indeed.

Srook, I am hoping these gauges help me with the "hang up" at 3000 rpm or 1/4 throttle.  After getting things pretty close today, there is still just a hair hesitation at that spot.

[benjamin550]

After reading this, I just ordered a set as well. Thanks for all the info guys.

[Nortstudio]

Mine should be here tomw.  I'm excited and nervous at the same time . Hoping it finishes off my first tune-up with good results.

Good luck with them.

[Nortstudio]

No garage. I did the better part of yesterday on the curb with the bile trying to get stripped screws out and replaced (almost every screw is stripped on this bike!). Probably about 5 hours.

It wasn't too bad, but a full day of sitting on the cold concrete makes you feel a bit beat up later. Felt like I had played a football game. But I hadn't lifted a thing!!!

[Kong]

I ordered a set of those gages on monday, they arrived today.  That's fast.   The gages are of adequate quality, though the hoses are not.  The little moderator valves are of higher quality than the ones at the pet store; they probably cost six cents each to make rather than two.  The hoses are junk. One of my hoses split right up the seam when I tried to put it on the gage - and even after cutting it back the split continued in the fresh hose.  Off to Lowe's on that one, should cost far less than five bucks.  My only complaint was that there was a considerable disparity between the resting needle positions of the 4 gages.  I popped off the lenses and adjusted each one of them so that they all read the same - its the large silver screw.  I also ordered the 6mm tubes even though I have no particular use for them - but you never can tell.  Delivered cost with both sets of tubes was pennies under $75, which seemed quite reasonable to me for what they are.