Author Topic: Let's go roadracing...continuing saga (Read 196137 times)

Bill/BentON Racing · « **Reply #1400 on:** November 10, 2018, 04:02:57 AM »

Brent, damn, Good luck fixing it, glad Tyler's ok. That's the main thing.

bwaller · « **Reply #1401 on:** November 10, 2018, 08:58:09 AM »

Thanks Bill, that happened in June and we managed a repair in time for the next round. Spare bodywork sure helps!

Back from Rick Stetson's last night and some dyno work. I hadn't been able to check what our last winters work accomplished. It was mostly to check for any power gain as any jetting had been taken care of through the race season. Small step but in a positive direction, +1.2 HP gain.

Rocketman · « **Reply #1402 on:** November 11, 2018, 04:03:12 PM »

So what kind of HP do you have that 550 making now? If it is not a too closely guarded secret? Was really pleased with my last dyno runs as it is almost always easier to pass on a straight.

RAFster122s · « **Reply #1403 on:** November 13, 2018, 10:15:50 PM »

Tyler is very talented, he has learned well and the bike is a joy to listen to as well as watch being put through its paces on the track. I always enjoy a good race video and especially on board like that. He seems to use the 550 as a very potent weapon. Given opportunity to run a bigger bike in a more advanced class it would be interesting to see how well he would do. You and Mike have built a phenomenal machine.
What was the season results and did he take 2nd in that race against the bigger bikes or was he 1st in the class and racing against the bigger bikes does he place in their race?

Or, were there front runners in the 750 class ahead of those guys?
He may get out run on the straights against a 750 but he can out brake them and out ride those in that race.

Kudos to all involved!

David

bwaller · « **Reply #1404 on:** August 03, 2019, 02:39:34 PM »

Well it's been a while and a difficult off season personally. As a result this will be a shortened race season for us, but I feel much better about our progress after last weekend which was the first time the bike has been raced.

Last fall the engine leakdown was 2-4% across all cylinders. The rings were showing they hadn't completely sealed so the plan was to re-use. There was some scoring on one skirt especially that I attributed to a slight chunk out of one 5th gear tooth in the gearbox. This was one of the gears Ellis Moore had made for me. Ellis suffered a devastating crash during a race last September so I found a shop closer to home to make a new gear. (there was a delay which prevented us being ready in time for the first race) I would appreciate any news on how Ellis has managed if anyone knows.

Over the winter I built new wheels, for wider rims and used a front hub in the rear with a small TZ disc and my own cush drive. Thanks to Ted for these vintage DID alloy rims which trued nicely. My plan was to adopt the 650 primary ratio to speed the clutch rotation hoping it might help the clutch on hard launches. This swap to 650 parts isn't difficult, but there is a need to remove some material from both the clutch cover & cases. The first plan was to cut both 550/650 clutch covers and weld the 650 outer half to the 550 inner half because the 650 cover doesn't seal on the 550 cases. That became too difficult to align so dropped that idea.

I wanted to use the 650 lifter plate and bearing, but the 550 internal clutch lever is so much different than the 650. In the end I machined a hybrid lifter guide with a larger OD to fit the 550 mainshaft. This replaces the 550 pushrod that uses two bearing balls friction welded to either end of a tube. Long story short there was a slight alignment issue with this lifter guide which in turn broke the clutch adjustment screw inside the cover.

The 6mm adjustment screw lasted for about an hour of racing. I had a spare and when that one broke late Saturday, I had to make one from whatever bits I had in the pits and re-installed the 550 clutch and primary gear for Sunday. Tyler missed one race Saturday as a result, but managed 1st in P2M, and 4th in P3H.

Sunday went very well and he won his P2M class, 2nd in P3L, and 4th in P3 Heavy Superbike. The clutch worked fine.

Over the winter I installed new damper rubbers in a 650 clutch basket. I was unable to find rivots the correct size so tapped the basket for 6mm flat head machine screws with red locktite. This seems to work perfectly fine and this basket is like new.

So the plan is now to use the 650 primary ratio, 650 clutch parts with the 550 lifter plate and push rod. This should solve any negative issues and still give us any potential advantage of the 650 ratio. I was in need of all new rear sprockets so over the winter calculated the difference in clutch speed and ordered larger final drive rear sprockets to return to original wheel rpm.

The next race is Aug 30th weekend and there are a bunch of fast guys & bikes coming from AHMRA so we will be ready!

RAFster122s · « **Reply #1405 on:** August 03, 2019, 04:05:47 PM »

Wow Brent! Nice bit of engineering!
Sorry to hear about Ellis.

Good on Tyler for the great finishes after being off the bike for a extended period. Is he still racing the other bike?

David

bwaller · « **Reply #1406 on:** August 04, 2019, 04:06:06 AM »

David, Ty sold his FZR but does race a short stroke 750 Ducati in the endurance series every Friday afternoon during race weekends.

bwaller · « **Reply #1407 on:** September 03, 2019, 05:39:26 PM »

The 2019 season has ended for us. We had a great turnout for Mosport and the weather was excellent until Sunday at noon!

After the clutch fiasco last race, I decided to use the 550 lifter plate and pushrod with the 650 clutch basket, still with an extra plate & disc. This allows for the taller primary ratio. I'm not sure ultimately there is much difference, but in theory it will help launch from a race start.

Tyler won two heat races and also had a 4th in the P3 Heavyweight class Saturday. He enjoys racing with these guys, it's mostly a matter of mixing it up with ex pros on their 80's superbikes. The long straight at Mosport should allow good drafting except he laughingly admitted that although he was pinned to the rear of someone almost every lap as they straightened up on the throttle, those huge engines just exploded away and the 550 was left in the dust! a 4th place amongst these guys is respectable.

He managed a 1:36.2 which is a personal best on this CB550. That's a 92 MPH lap average, shows how fast Mosport is for a closed circuit.

Sunday after lunch, just as I was firing the bike, it started to rain. It was just enough to dampen the track, and the surface became greasy. For two hours it never rained enough to wash the track clean so traction was sketchy, at best. The Nascar truck race was recent and when dry, the track was awesome. Add a bit of moisture to all the dust and rubber bits and it was hell.

I installed a new front Avon Saturday evening and he had a chance to scrub it in during practice in the dry Sunday morning, so that was fortunate. Some of the usual good rain riders were tossing it because of the lousy conditions. Tyler slid around and won 2 races, but opted out of the 3rd race when conditions didn't improve.

All in all, a pretty good weekend. Beside that one tire, it was simply add fuel, check tire pressures and chain....easy! Just the way I like it.

I'm hoping there is not much to do over the winter except to plate and set up a new cylinder. Have new pistons in stock. However there were the tiniest of cracks (under a 25X macroscope) partially between exhaust valve seat and plug hole in two other cylinder head chambers when I assembled this past spring. I need to take a close look at those and perhaps Jim French will need to work more welding magic.

XR69 Replica, big Katana, and the lowly 550!

turboguzzi · « **Reply #1408 on:** September 04, 2019, 04:05:19 AM »

so he's racing against XR's and such? 4th is like a win no?

congrats!

check your email BTW....

bear · « **Reply #1409 on:** September 04, 2019, 04:11:37 AM »

Good to see the little Honda giving it to the big dog's on a 150km track.
Well done team Waller.

bwaller · « **Reply #1410 on:** September 04, 2019, 03:32:36 PM »

TG, there is only that one class where he's racing with those guys. Nearly every weekend this is the class he runs his fastest times. Often alone & chasing, no surprise!

Last weekend Dave Roper raced an MV350 (former Ago ride) three cylinder which belongs to Team Obsolete. It was music to everyone's ears!

Rocketman · « **Reply #1411 on:** September 04, 2019, 08:19:38 PM »

Congratulations to you and Tyler on your “abbreviated” season. Turning a 1:36 at Mosport is a great way to end the season! You and Tyler have set the bar high. Hope you have a great off season.

Old Scrambler · « **Reply #1412 on:** September 09, 2019, 05:36:48 PM »

Good on you and Tyler..........its always good to see a small motor go head to head with the big boys

RAFster122s · « **Reply #1413 on:** September 09, 2019, 08:29:09 PM »

Brent and Tyler, great work on ending with a high note! Good to hear the 550 is punching above its weight as always.
Hope the motor improvement program continues to yield good results.
David

bwaller · « **Reply #1414 on:** September 10, 2019, 07:33:19 AM »

Well thanks guys. I suppose there is always a little extra power if one tries hard enough. Unfortunately to remain in our period 2 means some of the potential gains would be outside the rules. We're making 75RWHP @572cc and the thing is dead nuts reliable. It runs away from anything else in it's P2 class, or bump up class for that matter, (P3 Superbike is another matter!) so trying harder for more might just create a grenade!

I have thought about switching from 35 to 38mm forks that the class allows. Or possibly calling it a Period 3 bike which allows 17" wheels, race slicks, or true rain tires, and tire warmers. Slicks alone would seriously drop lap times. However then racing in AHRMA with those wheels wouldn't allow us to run the F500 class where it belongs.

Maybe just keeping it fresh and easy to ride is a good thing afterall, at least for now!

turboguzzi · « **Reply #1415 on:** September 10, 2019, 09:04:58 AM »

38mm ok, have them now on my 500 too (with cartridge damping

)

But 17" rims?

please no!

itll make the bike such a strange bastard of 70's design with 90's stance, like sticking some A/C units to the tower of Pisa

Never mind the fact that the extra grip will take frame forces to a completely new level IMHO.

thought you were more classy Brent

bwaller · « **Reply #1416 on:** September 10, 2019, 09:41:59 AM »

I agree TG. In the VRRA it is a Period 2 bike, there are these other options, but creating a bastard of different periods doesn't appeal to me either.

The reason for consideration of 17" and the biggest problem we have here is tire availability. The last three Avon rears I bought had to be ordered out of the UK and I paid $400+ CDN. Fronts are easier. I plan to propose a rule change so we can use the Conti radials which now are against the rules. That would help make using 18" wheels easier.

The fact the bike does well in a later different period is a bonus. Nearly a decade plus SOHC vs DOHC engines. Tyler has raced several newer bikes but tells me he appreciates the 550 for the linear power delivery, and how well planted it is at speed. It's a small bike but is fun to ride..... I always felt the same.

Also, I thought you knew me better, classy is not a word used to describe moi!!

simon#42 · « **Reply #1417 on:** September 10, 2019, 10:09:15 AM »

forget the 38mm forks they will just be heavier and have more wind resistance !

turboguzzi · « **Reply #1418 on:** September 10, 2019, 10:34:13 AM »

Agree on the wind resistance

but i weighted them and the 38 zx600 fork i've put is lighter than the stock 35 honda! the wall thickness of the honda tubes is simply staggering, they must have been made off some ship building left overs from kawasaki HEAVY industries that they got for cheap

simon#42 · « **Reply #1419 on:** September 10, 2019, 01:41:42 PM »

yes you are right yossef the standard tubes are a touch over engineered ! if you have reached the limit of reliable power i would concentrate on getting rid of weight
they say a couple of pounds off is the same as one hp on when it comes to lap times .

bwaller · « **Reply #1420 on:** September 10, 2019, 03:09:15 PM »

Sure the stock tubes are ridiculously heavy, guess it's so they can be straightened over & over!

I have two sets of really nice 35mm forks, makes changing to 38mm more difficult.

Weight removal is always a good thing, but naturally at this point, becomes expensive. I built wider wheels last winter, now use a small disc in the rear. End result...no change in weight. I seriously looked at buying a set of Magnesium wheels from Ted, but the rear was narrower than I wanted. Plus can you trust old mag wheels?? Sure have them tested for cracks, but then how often after that? I chose not to.

Apparently the Continental tires are heavy, #$%* what next. The bike weighs 322 dry which isn't a lightweight but this was on a forklift scale that is certified often so is exact. I hear about other bike weights and I wonder.

I can't use anything other than a stock frame, so this one has been modified. There could be several pounds shed there alone, but alas....

Besides Simon, the magic number is 7 lbs per HP, not 2. Methinks I'm leaving it alone.

scottly · « **Reply #1421 on:** September 10, 2019, 11:22:52 PM »

Quote from: simon#42 on September 10, 2019, 01:41:42 PM

they say a couple of pounds off is the same as one hp on when it comes to lap times .

It really depends on the total weight and the HP to weight ratio. A couple of pounds makes less of a difference on a bike/rider weight of 600 pounds than a total weight of 500 pounds, given the same HP from the motor. In Brent's case of 322 dry, plus fuel and suited pilot, I'm making a wild ass guess of 500 pounds?
500/75=6.66:1. 498/75=6.64:1, which boils down to adding .226 HP to the 500 pound bike.

simon#42 · « **Reply #1422 on:** September 11, 2019, 10:11:09 AM »

seven brent , that might work for a fat bloke on a heavy old road bike but for a skinny teen on a 125 the numbers are much lower !

bwaller · « **Reply #1423 on:** September 12, 2019, 09:41:58 AM »

Quote from: simon#42 on September 11, 2019, 10:11:09 AM

seven brent , that might work for a fat bloke on a heavy old road bike but for a skinny teen on a 125 the numbers are much lower !

Hahaha, oh my, the truth hurts Simon!

Old Scrambler · « **Reply #1424 on:** September 12, 2019, 10:55:23 AM »

I like that formula............7-lbs. = 1-hp..............a mix of me and my bike could loose (mostly me) 15 or more lbs.

I'm running 18-inch wheels with BTs to stay light.........and narrow........I saved over $100 on Amazon and my service-center was happy to learn that other tires were available somewhat below his wholesaler price with no minimum purchase.

News:

Author Topic: Let's go roadracing...continuing saga (Read 196137 times)