Author Topic: pamco ignitions . . . (Read 19648 times)

thehammer · « **on:** April 03, 2011, 06:54:22 PM »

has anyone got one? good experiences? bad experiences. sure is alot cheaper than the dyna.
thanks in advance for any testimonials.

extek66 · « **Reply #1 on:** April 03, 2011, 07:33:43 PM »

I've got one on my xs650 and plan on putting one on the 72 750 I just bought
.simple install work great,and Pamcopete stands behind his products with quick answers and tech support.
John

thehammer · « **Reply #2 on:** April 03, 2011, 07:42:23 PM »

yeah, i've read nothing but good reviews, but all from people with xs650's. I need coils for my cb550 and the pamco kit with the coils is not much more expensive than oe or dyna coils. I think I might go this route, unless someone changes my mind.

Scott S · « **Reply #3 on:** April 04, 2011, 05:08:17 AM »

I'm running one of the first ever SOHC4 Pamcos on my CB500. No issues at all. I'd say I have close to a thousand miles on it so far.

The "guts" of the Pamco are well proven with thousands and thousands sold for XS650's with many more thousands of miles on them. Give it a shot. Pete's a stand up guy and will be there for any tech support you may need, as well.

cobrajunkie · « **Reply #4 on:** April 04, 2011, 06:39:43 AM »

I installed on my F1 but haven't got her running yet. Install was pretty straight forward. My only complaint was that the wires from the ignition to the coils was about three inches short when running up the back bone and under the tank like the OEM wires.

thehammer · « **Reply #5 on:** April 04, 2011, 07:57:50 AM »

there you go, thanks guys. I'd like to know what you think once you get that thing going, cobra.

ddanz27 · « **Reply #6 on:** April 04, 2011, 08:03:09 AM »

Glad I read this post! I had no idea there was another option out there for electronic ignitions for the 350f. Sounds like these Pamcos are a great deal. Can anyone tell me, does the Pamco system install in to the factory wiring harness like I believe the Dyna S does? Are there reasons to chose one over the other?

GammaFlat · « **Reply #7 on:** April 04, 2011, 09:14:28 AM »

Some thoughts...

The Pamco is apparently $116.00. "The system is $109.95 plus $6 Priority Mail in the US and Canada." from http://www.cb750ignition.com/

I've seen the Dyna-S for $139.95 shipped on ebay recently. ...thought I had seen it for $119.95 - probably not including shipping.

These are both "hall effect" and probably work very similarly. The Pamco in theory, works with 2.5 to 4.5 ohm coils. The Dyna works with 3 to 5 ohm coils (needs verification). Many on this forum would recommend 5 ohm coils.

The HondaMan ignition is $68 plus shipping. It uses existing points as it's trigger (as opposed to "hall effect" for the others). On my CB750s, I've used a) a points systems, b) Dyna-S and c) HondaMan ignition. From here forward, I'll never run anything but a HondaMan ignition on my CB750s. As a matter of fact, I'll be selling my Dyna-S as soon as I can get it packaged up.

Dyna-S:

Pamco:

jumpnkill · « **Reply #8 on:** April 05, 2011, 04:38:52 AM »

I bought the ultimate pamco kit for my rebuild. Unfortunately, it's just sitting in the box next to the frame as I'm not to that point yet. I too would be very interested in any install pointers from my fellow gear heads.

petersan · « **Reply #9 on:** April 05, 2011, 07:15:24 AM »

GammaFlat - you mention you'll only run HondaMan ignitions from now on -- aside from his stellar reputation on this forum, can you explain what you like about his ignition vs the others?
thanks

GammaFlat · « **Reply #10 on:** April 05, 2011, 09:41:32 AM »

Quote from: petersan on April 05, 2011, 07:15:24 AM

GammaFlat - you mention you'll only run HondaMan ignitions from now on -- aside from his stellar reputation on this forum, can you explain what you like about his ignition vs the others?
thanks

Here's a quick summary not in any particular order.

Electronic Component Failure. I've heard of plenty of Dyna-S's failing. I have no knowledge of failure rates or reports of failure with the Pamco (it does sound like there are lots of happy people running them). I'm not aware of any HondaMan units failing. Let's face it. It can happen with any of these units. If a Hall effect unit fails, you're calling a pickup truck. With HondaMan unit, you go back to points in a few minutes just by changing a few plug in connectors. This is particularly important for when the martians come and flood our planet with EMPs rendering all of our solid state electronics useless.
Cost. I can sell my used Dyna-S for the price of a new HondaMan unit.
Portability. It's very easy to go back to a stock configuration and remove the HondaMan unit (10 minutes). It may be important if you want to sell a bike and want to take your electronic goodies for your next bike. With a Dyna or Pamco, it's more time consuming to go back to factory - put points plate on, reset points, etc. To many, portability is unimportant.. but you asked "what I like" .
Power Consumption. The HondaMan ignition uses about .1 amp more than just points. The Dyna-S uses about 1 amp more. I don't know about the Pamco unit. Most of our bikes aren't doing stellar on their already tight power budget with additional problems due to aging/corroding connectors and components (like fuse holders). Using less power is good.
Factory Dwell is maintained with the HondaMan unit. If you look at your points and the way they operate and then look at a hall effect unit, it's pretty easy to conclude that the "on" and "off" periods have different durations between the two. Now we're getting into coil saturation, coil depletion, power consumption, coil heat, RPM operation range, etc.

I conclude that the "aftermarket solutions" can work well and any of them are probably better than plain points from the maintenance perspective.

Deltarider · « **Reply #11 on:** April 05, 2011, 12:25:15 PM »

I would like to read testimonies of people that have done a ton with a Pamco or whatever.
Personally I have my doubts with circuitry mounted on the hottest spot of the engine (apart from the combustion chambers) with the most vibrations...

Scott S · « **Reply #12 on:** April 05, 2011, 12:36:38 PM »

OK, then....I've done almost a ton on my CB500 with a Pamco.

I've had it up to around 90mph. I've driven it on the interstate for 45 minutes straight. I've sat in traffic at an idle in South Carolina in July and August, with temperatures nearing 100 degrees and humidity hovering around 85-90%.

I just filled up last week before an 80 mile ride through the country and I got 37.4 MPG on my CB500.

Anything else you want to know?

I'm really shocked that so many people seem to have an aversion to the Pamco. It's a proven product with proven tech support, Made in USA and competitively priced. Why not give it a shot?

Deltarider · « **Reply #13 on:** April 05, 2011, 01:17:57 PM »

Quote

I'm running one of the first ever SOHC4 Pamcos on my CB500. No issues at all. I'd say I have close to a thousand miles on it so far.

Quote

OK, then....I've done almost a ton on my CB500 with a Pamco.

Not very consistent, are you? Overhere a ton means 100.000 (kms).

Quote

Made in USA

So?

Tugboat · « **Reply #14 on:** April 05, 2011, 01:23:02 PM »

I think he means "THE Ton" - 100mph

Scott S · « **Reply #15 on:** April 05, 2011, 02:29:05 PM »

Yup, "THE" ton vs. "A" ton. Communication break down, language barrier, whatever.

I'll post back when I have over 1K miles on it. Give me a week or so.

What about the XS650's we (my Dad and I ) have that have, oh, about 5K on their Pamcos?

pamcopete · « **Reply #16 on:** April 05, 2011, 03:09:50 PM »

Here is a video of my '74 CB750 after a short run in 61F OAT.

CB750 Ignition Heat

The temperature under the cover was 105F. By comparison, typical hot water is 125F. The Hall effect sensor on the PAMCO is rated at 302F operating, meaning that the temperature would have to go almost 200F higher that this video shows.

The hottest part of the engine is the head, and that is where the PAMCO for the XS650 is installed and has been working fine for 4 years where the temperature goes as high as 210F. The same electronics are used in the CBXXX model.

I think that a lot of people are familiar with electronics from the '60's and '70's where transistors were rather delicate and susceptible to thermal damage. Modern electronics components, such as those use in the PAMCO, do not have the thermal issues of transistors from that era. Think about all of the electronics under the hood and in the block of a modern car engine.

nayto550 · « **Reply #17 on:** April 05, 2011, 04:02:47 PM »

If you're looking for options outside of Dyna or OEM, you may want to check out http://cyclexchange.net/IGNITIONS%20HONDA.htm. I realize they're a bit spendy and it's fairly new technology, but I personally think an optical sensor is a great improvement over the hall effect magnetic sensors.

pamcopete · « **Reply #18 on:** April 05, 2011, 04:20:21 PM »

Well, I think that when people say that an optical sensor is better than a Hall effect sensor, they may be misinformed. As an example, the factory ignition on the DOHC CB750 is often refereed to as a Hall effect ignition, but it is not. It uses a coil pickup to trigger the spark.

Also, Hall effect technology has been around for a long time and people often mention Hall effect while thinking about the fairly elaborate circuits that the early Hall effect systems used. The modern Hall effect sensor is a monolithic, solid state very small chip that has it's own built in voltage regulator and other features that produce a very consistent output over a very wide temperature range, like from -40F to 302F with an operating voltage range of 3 to 30 Volts. There are no discrete components that could be subject to thermal or age related degradation, so they are very stable. If you have a car made in this century, then you have numerous Hall effect sensors in the car performing various functions, including ignition timing.

Here is a picture of the hall effect sensor used in the PAMCO ignition. Notice the almost total lack of discrete components:

The original PAMCO was an infrared sensor (optical) type of system, but that technology was abandoned in favor of using the latest Hall effect technology.

nayto550 · « **Reply #19 on:** April 05, 2011, 05:27:16 PM »

Well... after looking further into this (and the electronic devices behind it all), I would like to withdraw my argument, and ask pamcopete if the $110 price tag includes the ignition coils? I think I might need a couple of these for my 750 and 550.

Skunk Stripe · « **Reply #20 on:** April 05, 2011, 05:42:48 PM »

I think the pamco system is quite impressive. It is well priced and no one has reported failures on this site with it.
If someone is stuck on points, that is fine, they can use what they want but really, you can't badmouth this unit merely because you know nothing about it.
Seems many of you missed the poll about ignition failures, seems points failed almost as much as electronic did. While not super scientific, it does show that people have had actual POINT failures and that the system is not foolproof.
My bike still has the dyna s I put on it a few years back. I sold the bike to a friend and then bought it back. So, something like 6 or 7 years. Still ticks like a champ. And I have done the REAL (not crappy kph)ton with no problems at all.

I still maintain that if points were so awesome and great, then why are they not being used in ANYTHING anymore?

Retro Rocket · « **Reply #21 on:** April 05, 2011, 06:07:56 PM »

Quote

I still maintain that if points were so awesome and great, then why are they not being used in ANYTHING anymore?

Exactly......

cobrajunkie · « **Reply #22 on:** April 08, 2011, 03:30:04 AM »

Quote from: nayto550 on April 05, 2011, 05:27:16 PM

Well... after looking further into this (and the electronic devices behind it all), I would like to withdraw my argument, and ask pamcopete if the $110 price tag includes the ignition coils? I think I might need a couple of these for my 750 and 550.

$109 does not include coils. You can use your existing OEMs or you can get the complete package for $175 or $239 with coil upgrade. More here...

http://www.cb750supply.com/products/1/featured-products#product-14-0801

chickenman_26 · « **Reply #23 on:** April 08, 2011, 05:01:46 AM »

Quote from: pamcopete on April 05, 2011, 04:20:21 PM

Well, I think that when people say that an optical sensor is better than a Hall effect sensor, they may be misinformed. As an example, the factory ignition on the DOHC CB750 is often refereed to as a Hall effect ignition, but it is not. It uses a coil pickup to trigger the spark.

Pete,
I trust your product based on its track record, but I have a question. On the units that use two Hall effect sensors, is at least one of them adjustable? I ask, because I'd prefer to have both coils firing right on the mark rather than using a split-timing technique and having to settle for "close enough" - one coil firing slightly advanced, the other slightly retarded.

Stu

pidaster · « **Reply #24 on:** April 08, 2011, 05:54:54 AM »

I put the Pamco system on my 750 last fall/ early winter. I've probably only put about 300 miles on it but it's done great. I got the complete setup with new coils and all.

News:

Author Topic: pamco ignitions . . . (Read 19648 times)

pamcopete

pamcopete