Topic: Steering damper anyone?

[Tintop]

Don't think you read his whole description of the incident.  His forks bottom'd because of impacting the sand berm, not braking.

[Greggo]

My forks bottomed out, and the bars started slapping back and forth..........................

You appear to braked too hard for the surface you were on, shut the throttle let the engine do the work, maybe apply a little back brake.

IIRC, I gave it gas before going over to lift the front end.  No front brake, as it compresses the forks just before they really need that travel.

[Retro Rocket]

My forks bottomed out, and the bars started slapping back and forth..........................

You appear to braked too hard for the surface you were on, shut the throttle let the engine do the work, maybe apply a little back brake.

Set up well you should be able to brake hard enough to almost lock the front without the suspension bottoming out otherwise you won't be able to stop properly, especially in a critical incident....If he braked too hard with the front in sand he would have been off before he knew it...

[malcolmgb]

If he braked too hard with the front in sand he would have been off before he knew it...

Since he didn't mention sand until the end of story, I was not sure at what point he started braking. Always important to read the road well ahead, including what other vehicles are doing.
Had a similar episode recently where a road had been redressed, the surface is covered in liquid tar and gravel chippings put down, the road isn't rolled just rely on passing vehicles doing that, the excess gravel is brushed up days later, I could see it had been done slowed right down to about 5-10mph and then it is the same as riding on loose marbles.

[octagon]

so - speaking to the crowd that likes dampeners - is there any consensus on a well-made dampener to put on say a 750k?

[Tintop]

I have an NHK on my 550, with the alloy fork leg type bracket.  From what I've heard Mike'sXS has some of the better prices on the NHK damper, and the alloy bracket.

[octagon]

looks like he gets 64. for the damper and 24.50 for the bracket.

[srbakker]

I know this is a bit old, but... has anyone ever used or tried to use the stock Ohlin's dampers that come on some of the newer bikes, from a wreck or a part out or something?  I think some of the ZX6 and 10s came stock with them.

[Retro Rocket]

I see no reason why they wouldn't work, after all a damper is a damper. Aren't they mounted of the neck of the frame to the fork leg.?

[srbakker]

Yeah, far as I can tell, you could mount it with a clamp or bracket at the neck and then use one of those $20 billet fork clamps for the eye end.  Seems like a cheap way to get a nice (and nice looking!) damper.

[Retro Rocket]

Either that or just weld a small tab on the steering neck and use a fork clamp. I am sure i have seen one mounted inside the frame neck, between the tank, at the front...

[srbakker]

Hmm.  Anyone got closeup pics of a similar mounting scheme on a CB750?  I'd like to give this one a think - it is in the plan for my project as I'm using longer rear shocks then stock.  Thanks!

[Retro Rocket]

I have literally hundreds of 750 pics, i'll have a browse and see if i have anything....

[srbakker]

Hah, thanks.  I also asked Brent to maybe snap a few... I'm sure someone has what I need to see! 

[Terry in Australia]

Steering dampers and fork braces........where's the popcorn.....
{i agree %100}

Oooher, I just saw this thread for the first time, I think I sort of skimmed over most of the posts, so excuse me if someone's already mentioned it, but did you guys know that Honda sold a hydraulic steering damper for the CB750 as an option?

I've got one in a box in my garage, I bought it from a guy in the US on Ebay around 10 years ago, but never installed it as he "forgot" to send me the mounting brackets. It's not a particularly attractive damper and doesn't appear to be adjustable like the popular Kawasaki dampers of the same era. (I never met a Kawasaki that didn't need a steering damper back in the day........)

I think Honda mounted steering dampers to some of the earlier twins too, as I've seen pics of a couple of old Honda's with similar dampers to the one I've got in a box. I'm a big fat bastard now so that's probably why I haven't had a "slapper" in recent years, but I remember a massive slapper I had on my BMW R100RS when I took the big fairing off and fitted a smaller "R90S" fairing, it took me by surprise because I'd never experienced one on that bike with the bigger fairing, which obviously flowed the air around the BMW panniers better. The BMW had quite narrow bars too, which made it harder to control, but probably due to good luck rather than good skills, I survived it without throwing it down the road.

Here's a couple pics of Goldie (in pre-goldie guise) the day I bought it. The owner, Ken, (on the bike) wasn't as lucky as me when he suddenly discovered the joys of tankslappers. He spent 3 months in and out of hospital and had only started walking again when I bought his bike. He's got new kneecaps now, and he doesn't wear Levis on his bike any more. I'm so looking forward to the arrival of my new Kevlar jeans! Cheers, Terry.

   

[srbakker]

I did not know that, Terry.  At this point I'm looking for something to match up to my shiny new rear suspension...

[grcamna2]

   I had a mild tank slapper once...it never did get BAD,what I did was gave it a VERY gentle feel touch to the throttle; about ".002" more. I want a steering damper for insurance because tank slappers SUCK.

[Really?]

I have had a tank slapper at 80mph on a kawi 750 H2.

The main reason for the H2 handling issue was in the swing arm bushings. That could be fixed with accurately made brass bushings. The machine came stock with either a friction or hydraulic steering damper. Mine always hit 120 mph easily with no wobble issues. I had 5 or six of them from high school into my early 20s. Way more fun than any other bike of that era Puts the Honda fours to shame for play value.

RT

Well, that explains it.   The one I had did not have a steering damper but then the front end bolts were loose too.  Well, they were when I checked them the next day.  Darn 1%ers we bought it from were messing with the front end before I rode off with it.  I think I was 15 years old too.  A wild bike for sure!

[Retro Rocket]

I have had a tank slapper at 80mph on a kawi 750 H2.

The main reason for the H2 handling issue was in the swing arm bushings. That could be fixed with accurately made brass bushings. The machine came stock with either a friction or hydraulic steering damper. Mine always hit 120 mph easily with no wobble issues. I had 5 or six of them from high school into my early 20s. Way more fun than any other bike of that era Puts the Honda fours to shame for play value.

RT

Don't forget th frames were made out of spaghetti.... , the Early Z900's weren't much better....

[grcamna2]

   Has any one seen a good steering damper that will fit a Honda CB350 twin ? I hear they had some that were used on the factory road racers of the day(early 70's)...but I want to find one that will fit onto the frame of my 72 twin;the threaded hole is already drilled on my lower triple tree.I think if it's possible I could adapt a hydraulic style to the bike.The forks are completely shielded w/ covers just like the CB350F four so I would need to find something adaptable to my particular application.

                                                         ANY IDEAS ?

[Terry in Australia]

I have had a tank slapper at 80mph on a kawi 750 H2.

The main reason for the H2 handling issue was in the swing arm bushings. That could be fixed with accurately made brass bushings. The machine came stock with either a friction or hydraulic steering damper. Mine always hit 120 mph easily with no wobble issues. I had 5 or six of them from high school into my early 20s. Way more fun than any other bike of that era Puts the Honda fours to shame for play value.

RT

Don't forget th frames were made out of spaghetti.... , the Early Z900's weren't much better....

+1 Mick in fact I'd go as far as saying that ALL Kawasaki frames before the mid eighties were shiit. I had a 1975 Z900 which was a beautiful very low mile bike, I thought it's handling was a touch weird, so replaced the swingarm bushes and steering head bearings, with no obvious improvement, so I spent a lot of money on good tyres (Pirelli Phantoms, the best you could get back then) then rear shocks (Marzocchi Strada's) then fork springs (Progressives) then a fork brace and a steering damper, and it handled about as good as a stock CB750.

I loved that big bullet-proof DOHC engine, and the DOHC Honda's of the era were rubbish, so I switched to GS1000 Suzuki's (the best handling big Jap bike of the 1970's) and it was (and still is) nice to be able to ride a bike fast and know that it's not gonna spit you down the road! Cheers, Terry.    

[Retro Rocket]

I had a lot of fun in the early 80's blowing my mates on their big Kawasaki's away, i always liked corners and knew that was no mans land for the big Kawasaki's. Funny thing, way before i owned a Z1000, i had only ever ridden one, it was an immaculate late model 900 and it weaved like a #$%* in the corners, even on long sweepers, gave me chills.... I was always able to get my old Honda's handling quite well.... The old Kwaka's had great engines though....

[Terry in Australia]

The old Kwaka's had great engines though....

Yep, Suzuki made no apologies for stealing the Z900 Kawasaki engine and copying it for the first GS750 to the point where some parts are interchangeable, but the marriage of a big Kawasaki-esque engine in a decent frame made for a brilliant bike, both in a straight line, and around corners too...........

[Terry in Australia]

At least the GS didn't need the cams lifted to set valve clearances having shim on top of bucket rather than below.

rt

Yeah, but the downside is that they occasionally spit the shims out mate, so anyone racing one will convert it to Kawasaki's "Shim under bucket" arrangement. Good thing though, is once set, they shouldn't need adjusting for another 10,000 miles or so. Cheers, Terry.

[Terry in Australia]

Yeah, the problem with the GS Suzuki's was that if the clearances were too large, it was pretty common for the shims to get spat out. Cheers, Terry.