Author Topic: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.  (Read 3410 times)

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Offline caffeineandpixels

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Just had a chain break and crack my engine case. This is the second engine of mine in this bike that this has happened to. (Not going to go over the specifics of how it happened.)
The question is, has anyone made any engine case savers for a CB750? If so can you post pics?

Offline gnarlycharlie4u

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2011, 03:32:53 PM »
(Not going to go over the specifics of how it happened.)

no need...
I really doubt it was because you were making 100+ hp though.

the simple solution to this is... replace your chain.
there's not a lot of space between the cases and the sprocket so it'd be kind of tough to fit anything of any significant protective abilities in there.

Offline CrankyOldGuy

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2011, 04:24:50 PM »
When the chain broke the case on my K1 back in the 70's Honda replaced the case and supplied me with a small guard that went around the front sprocket and chain.  I have not had the opportunity to see if the guard works  ::) 

Harry O.
750 K1 Original Owner

Offline gnarlycharlie4u

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #3 on: June 17, 2011, 05:41:12 PM »
When the chain broke the case on my K1 back in the 70's Honda replaced the case and supplied me with a small guard that went around the front sprocket and chain.  I have not had the opportunity to see if the guard works  ::) 

Harry O.

that's good to know.
is it made of steel?

Offline CrankyOldGuy

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2011, 06:32:57 PM »
gnarly

It appears to be made of steel.  The Honda part no is 113 53300 010 "Protector Case".  I checked DSS and they have a few at $79.22 US and a damaged one at $63.05 US.  Western Hills Honda appeared to have on for $58.56 US.

Harry O
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Offline HondaMan

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #5 on: June 17, 2011, 07:47:47 PM »
The idea behind Honda's little pressed-steel "guard" is more of a "guide". It is supposed to keep the chain on the sprocket long enough to throw it out behind the bike if the chain breaks. If the chain is properly lubed and has no kinked links (from galling or rust lock), then it works: otherwise it just crumples up from the chain and helps to crack the engine cases, anyway.  :-\

In the K0 sandcast series, the sprockets were 16/45 teeth. This proved too small for the 530 chains of the day, and many broke from American abuse (it was interesting to note that almost no such incidents were reported in the rest of the world at the time!). The first "fix kit" was a 17T front sprocket with a 48T rear, and with the little guide to which you refer, in the hope of sending the broken chain out the back, and an endless chain that required removal of the swingarm to change out. The next step was to replace the top clutch plate with a slanted-cut-cork style plate to induce a little slip when burnouts were attempted. This clutch mod went away before the K1 appeared, though, as the single plate wore quickly from all the slip.

The "final solution" was to use the 18T countersprocket and 48T rear, with the 530 endless chain of 100 links, and the rear sprocket was changed to have tapered teeth and a base circle of 0.5mm larger diameter than ASME specs. This proved to make VERY long-lasting chain and sprocket life, but it overgeared the 750 and reduced top speeds by almost 15 MPH.

It was this history of chain breakage that made Honda use the 630 chain on the later "F" bikes, with their added horsepower.
See SOHC4shop@gmail.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

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Offline gnarlycharlie4u

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #6 on: June 17, 2011, 10:34:02 PM »
It was this history of chain breakage that made Honda use the 630 chain on the later "F" bikes, with their added horsepower.

and the K7-K8

although... didn't the K0 and other earlier bikes make more HP than the later K's?
the F's got all their HP from the oversized valves which the K7-8 did not have. afaik

Offline crazypj

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2011, 06:58:29 PM »
It sounds like the piece fitted to CB550F's?
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Offline Stev-o

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Offline mrbreeze

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2011, 07:34:43 PM »
The idea behind Honda's little pressed-steel "guard" is more of a "guide". It is supposed to keep the chain on the sprocket long enough to throw it out behind the bike if the chain breaks. If the chain is properly lubed and has no kinked links (from galling or rust lock), then it works: otherwise it just crumples up from the chain and helps to crack the engine cases, anyway.  :-\

In the K0 sandcast series, the sprockets were 16/45 teeth. This proved too small for the 530 chains of the day, and many broke from American abuse (it was interesting to note that almost no such incidents were reported in the rest of the world at the time!). The first "fix kit" was a 17T front sprocket with a 48T rear, and with the little guide to which you refer, in the hope of sending the broken chain out the back, and an endless chain that required removal of the swingarm to change out. The next step was to replace the top clutch plate with a slanted-cut-cork style plate to induce a little slip when burnouts were attempted. This clutch mod went away before the K1 appeared, though, as the single plate wore quickly from all the slip.

The "final solution" was to use the 18T countersprocket and 48T rear, with the 530 endless chain of 100 links, and the rear sprocket was changed to have tapered teeth and a base circle of 0.5mm larger diameter than ASME specs. This proved to make VERY long-lasting chain and sprocket life, but it overgeared the 750 and reduced top speeds by almost 15 MPH.

It was this history of chain breakage that made Honda use the 630 chain on the later "F" bikes, with their added horsepower.
I coulda sworn I heard they had 15 tooth counter sprockets.................anyone know for sure? Anyways...I always heard the cure for breaking the case was when they went to 18 tooth. 630 chain is total overkill............my opinion. 8)
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Offline MCRider

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2011, 07:43:27 PM »
When they went to the 630 they had to use a 15t sprocket. But its diameter was roughly equivalent to the 18t on the 530 chain. So the large diameter idea was maintained.

It seems to me that by 77/78 Honda had plenty of good experience with the 18/48: 530 chain set up. Plus by then there were 10s of thousands of 836s running around without breaking any more chains.  So, it seems to me the switch to 630 was more because it was the tech of the time, and did allow for longer chain adjusting intervals. In fact with the ORings they were virtually maintenance free. Not so much an issue of needing them for the Fs horsepower. As pointed out they were used on the anemic Ks as well.  May have been an issue of being easier to put them on both rather than having Ks with 530s and Fs with 630s.

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Offline mrbreeze

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2011, 08:25:29 PM »
FattMatt will tell you how hard it is to find a 630 chain out on the road. I'm an eye witness!!! ;D
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Offline MCRider

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2011, 09:13:57 PM »
FattMatt will tell you how hard it is to find a 630 chain out on the road. I'm an eye witness!!! ;D
I think technology evolution has come around to where a really fine 530 is as good as a 630 without the weight.

Hayabusas use 530. They cost about $250, but its a 530.
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Offline mrbreeze

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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2011, 09:21:33 PM »
My Diamond 530 is the most trouble free chain I've had on any bike......I recommend 100%!!!
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Re: Engine Case Savers for CB750_To protect when a chain breaks.
« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2011, 10:21:26 PM »
Oh come on tell us how it happen :)We won't laugh promice ;D