Topic: Turn Signal size.

[TwoTired]

I was wondering if the same people who put the tiny hard to see turn signals on their bikes are the same ones that complain when other drivers don't see them.

I'm not saying large sigs are a total preventive.  But, I sure like to think that a big flashing light will help avoid some incidents.

Then there is the signal dispersal pattern or intensity at angles other the straight forward or rearward.  Many of the tiny ones are simply invisible from side view.

Go ahead, tell me I'm wrong.  Or, style is more important than survival.  Personally, I don't see the "style" in scar tissue.  Perhaps that's just me.

Cheers,

[Bluegreen]

Haven't ripped into anybody for a while?

You have so much knowledge, and a lot of smart stuff to say, for instance I think you're 100% right about this subject. But so often you present things from this high horse/finger pointing/negative stand point that is in no way required to get your point across. There is no need for it.

[strynboen]

i have an 78.k3 550. europa modell.this big rear light and turn sig,, are to big for this small mc..but germen models turn"s and old 400 four rear light looks fine..and it still honda parts..i keep mine stock..but that is the right way to mod...stop light are the most inportment light on a bike..after turn sig.

[Skunk Stripe]

Our lights are big but that does not really mean they have a super wide viewing angle. You can get lights half the size with the same brightness and view-ability. It all depends on the design of the lens and housing.

[DJ_AX]

Funny you should post that. 
Recently I've done a few minor mods... handlebars, mirrors... Handles better and I can see better.

I've thought about adding cool low profile led winkers. Gave it lots of thought and decided that with the type of riding I do (amongst other vehicles) that I kind of like the big honking blinkers.

Then just yesterday I was not far behind another biker and noticed only after he changed lanes that he had a itsy bitsy tiny blinking winker right next to his brake light. Very hard to see. Looks great in pictures but does nearly nothing on the road. ... That confirmed my decision.

And I kind of like the original style :-) One of the great things I've always liked about these bikes is that there's a lot of engineering to the design and style as well as the mechanics. ...

It's like putting pods on the carbs.  Steps backwards... for what?

[Skunk Stripe]

So why not put larger signals on then? Bigger is better and all that. A person should use tractor style units that have a lens on both sides. OR we just choose a decent blinker that is visible and bright regardless of size

[Duanob]

Haven't ripped into anybody for a while?

You have so much knowledge, and a lot of smart stuff to say, for instance I think you're 100% right about this subject. But so often you present things from this high horse/finger pointing/negative stand point that is in no way required to get your point across. There is no need for it.

Sometimes that's the only way young punk-assed people listen!

[Radam]

My bike came with some close to flush mounted super dark lens rear signals that are almost impossible to see in the day. I just use my hand signals in the daytime. At night they're real bright and easy to see. No, I don't see them myself, but I've had friends following me tell me. I'd like to find some clear lenses to put on instead of the dark ones, but I can't find any like them. I had some old guy tell me that he thinks they're for a big (18 wheeler) truck and I may be able to find them at a trucker shop. I guess I'll check that out.
Anyone have any other ideas on these?

[c(b)hris]

i put smaller signals on because i thought they would look better.
as soon as i have time though, im putting the stockers back on because i decided that I like the way they look more.
i haven't noticed a change in the number of people who treat my signals with courtesy between the two.  it's about 10-15% i think.
people here cut you off whether they see a signal or not.  car or bike.  signal to change lanes equates to "that guys gonna get in my lane, i better speed up so he's not in front of me."

[mjstone]

When I installed my Vetter luggage I wired the two outer trunk lights as tail lights/turn signals and the two inside lights as tail lights/brake lights.  When my stock brake/tail light went out I still had the lights on the trunk.  The socket was all rusted solid to the bulb.  I got another unit from a forum member. It took a week to get to me, but during that time the lights on the trunk did the job.  Even when Cops came up behind me I never was stopped.  More lights and big lights can't hurt in my opinion.

MJ

[CycleRanger]

I just use my hand signals in the daytime.

As should everyone.  Never rely on your turn signals alone to communicate your intentions.

It's not the size of your turn signals, it's how you use them! 

[TwoTired]

My bike came with some close to flush mounted super dark lens rear signals that are almost impossible to see in the day. ....

Those certainly look like the semi truck clearance lights they put on cabs and elsewhere.  Which can help them determine which bridges they will clear (or not).

Technically they are federally illegal for your use.  And, states usually adopt federal rules for vehicle mandatory equipment.

Cop gets a bee in his bonnet, and you've got a ticket, or at least delays while you get a personal sermon and demonstrate your papers are in order.

The requirements are in: FMVSS No. 108
http://fmvss108.tripod.com/fmvss108text.htm

I haven't read it all yet. 

 
Cheers,

[zackblack]

They ignore you regardless of winker size.  People just don't "see" bikes 90% of the time (if you don't believe this then look up any accident involving a car and a bike and look at the car drivers statement.  Betcha they told the cop: "I didn't see the motorcycle").

[lone*X]

"Betcha they told the cop: "I didn't see the motorcycle""

Anyone involved in any accident where they might be at fault, regardless of what they are driving or what the hit will say the same thing.  "I didn't see the motorcycle" or "I didn't see the pedestrian", or "I didn't see the other car coming".   It's all the same excuse and is ALWAYS used by the guilty regardless of the type accident.

It's not just about motorcycles!

[TwoTired]

They ignore you regardless of winker size.  People just don't "see" bikes 90% of the time (if you don't believe this then look up any accident involving a car and a bike and look at the car drivers statement.  Betcha they told the cop: "I didn't see the motorcycle").

Which may be true or simply a made up statement.  People tend to see what they are looking for.  And they don't always look for things that won't endanger them.  They do look for flashing lights/ bright lights (mostly).  And big lights are more likely to be associated with big vehicles.

But, do you believe a smaller/ dimmer run light/turn signal is more or less likely to get their attention? 
And, this applies to all people with no exclusion, right?

I fully support driving as though no one sees you, as I think that best for your personal survival.  But, if you are human, you're not infallible.
Maybe giving that other human an extra chance to avoid you isn't such a bad idea?

I'd kind of like to give the opportunity for the other driver to do the right thing.  I know they won't always.  But, some may be aware enough to do so.  Even if it doesn't help you personally.  If they notice your bike, they may extend their scan to include MCs for a while.

Cheers,

[coldwave007]

I'm running with the stock, big turn signals on my bike - I like 'em!  Mostly because they make me think, "Yeah, that's right.  You see these lights?  See how big they are?  That's right, I'm the Boss!!!" 

The extra visibility doesn't hurt either. 

[DJ_AX]

My 550 beeps when it blinks... as loud as the horn!

[zackblack]

But, do you believe a smaller/ dimmer run light/turn signal is more or less likely to get their attention? 

I believe that I could have the biggest red flashing lights on the road AND a siren and I'd still be ignored...
...ambulances and fire trucks have big flashing red lights and sirens but drivers still ignore them (and not move out of their way...)

And, this applies to all people with no exclusion, right?

Yes it does.  I ride like everyone around me could kill me (which they can).  Loud pipes don't save lives (people lust ignore them) so why should I trust my life with large flashing lights?

Note: This isn't an argument for or against large or small winkers - I'm simply stating my belief that a guy in a clown suit and rainbow hair riding hot pink motorcycle with straight pipes and six inch diameter winkers will still be ignored (and cut off) and when the cops come the driver in the car will say "I didn't see him". 

[TwoTired]

And, this applies to all people with no exclusion, right?

Yes it does.  I ride like everyone around me could kill me (which they can).  Loud pipes don't save lives (people lust ignore them) so why should I trust my life with large flashing lights?

I never said to trust your life to them.  I'm saying you should use the tools available toward the goal of survival.  It's called minimizing risk.
I drive cars, too.  And I watch for motorcyclists.  I have never run them down or off the road, or forced them to make evasive action.  I react to their run lights and blinkers if I can see them.

I think the lights matter.  Even if I see many motorcyclists ignore using them.

Cheers,

[CycleRanger]

Note: This isn't an argument for or against large or small winkers - I'm simply stating my belief that a guy in a clown suit and rainbow hair riding hot pink motorcycle with straight pipes and six inch diameter winkers will still be ignored (and cut off) and when the cops come the driver in the car will say "I didn't see him". 

I hit from behind in broad daylight.
I was wearing a day-glo green shirt, a red helmet with reflective tape on the back, and riding a red motorcycle. 
And my blinker and brake light was on!   
Guess what the driver said before they arrested him for outstanding warrants?

[zackblack]

I hit from behind in broad daylight.
I was wearing a day-glo green shirt, a red helmet with reflective tape on the back, and riding a red motorcycle. 
And my blinker and brake light was on!   
Guess what the driver said before they arrested him for outstanding warrants?

...I didn't see him? 

[333]

I'm with you on this one, Lloyd.  And about not being the be all, end all answer to being seen, as well.  I was never a fan of running the headlight during the day, as I upgraded to a halogen 55/60, and didn't know why my battery couldn't electric start my bike at the end of the day.  I know better today.

But I did get an interesting mailing from the DMV about 25 years ago that might help explain why we aren't seen, and interestingly, it has nothing to do with lighting, and everything to do with how we "see".  It was an extra flyer with a license renewal.  It was folded width wise, so when you opened it, it was almost 17 inches wide, and 3 inches tall.  On one side was a graphic of a motorcycle, the other side was a simple dot. You were instructed to look at the dot, and while at first you can see the bike in peripheral vision, within about 15 seconds, it disappears.  So I guess that while we are concentrating on "driving", what we're not concentrating on, disappears.  Screwy, isn't it?  The human brain is out to run us over!

So that is why we, as riders, must be ever vigilant. 110% or more.  My old boss at the dealer had a phrase, "enlightened paranoia", and basically it's the ability to assess any and all situations and "know" what anyone else will do in any given situation. An example might be being ready to brake when going through a green light, just in case someone runs it from the red.

[fmctm1sw]

But I did get an interesting mailing from the DMV about 25 years ago that might help explain why we aren't seen, and interestingly, it has nothing to do with lighting, and everything to do with how we "see".  It was an extra flyer with a license renewal.  It was folded width wise, so when you opened it, it was almost 17 inches wide, and 3 inches tall.  On one side was a graphic of a motorcycle, the other side was a simple dot. You were instructed to look at the dot, and while at first you can see the bike in peripheral vision, within about 15 seconds, it disappears.

Nowadays, that dot is replaced by a cell phone....  The bike disappears even faster..

[Spanner 1]

It's true that the narrow front profile of a bike approaching is not threatening to car drivers waiting to turn right, or worse left, at a junction. It fools the brain and can cause the driver to go ahead and pull out. When I see a car at a T junction I 'cover' both brakes and keep I hawkeye on that front wheel for any rotation from the stop position.  Again and again I see riders increase speed oblivious 'cos they .... wait for it;  ' have the right of way '...... very scary 

[Tews19]

My bike came with some close to flush mounted super dark lens rear signals that are almost impossible to see in the day. I just use my hand signals in the daytime. At night they're real bright and easy to see. No, I don't see them myself, but I've had friends following me tell me. I'd like to find some clear lenses to put on instead of the dark ones, but I can't find any like them. I had some old guy tell me that he thinks they're for a big (18 wheeler) truck and I may be able to find them at a trucker shop. I guess I'll check that out.
Anyone have any other ideas on these?

Hey Radam, can you help me and tell me where I can get a nice fairing like yours for my Honda CB550k 1978?\

Thanks