Author Topic: How much front brake drag is normal - CB750  (Read 8827 times)

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Offline SohRon

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Re: How much front brake drag is normal - CB750
« Reply #25 on: May 29, 2012, 05:16:19 PM »
Here's a pic of the seal slot. Make sure it's meticulously clean, and be sure to open up the center groove



+1, what he ^ said; the grease on the back of the pads not only cuts down on squealing and chatter, it acts as a "glue" that keeps the pads mated to their seats.

Also, are you setting the fixed pad to .006"?

Good luck!
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Offline buffaloejon

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Re: How much front brake drag is normal - CB750
« Reply #26 on: May 30, 2012, 05:33:35 AM »
With no real experience on these bike's brakes, but as a guy that designs much larger hydraulic brake systems, check all the seals/o-rings that are in between the caliper and the piston. This has been mentioned above, and it can't be understated. We've had brakes that have 40-50 lbs of force pulling back on the pads (so as to position them the correct distance from the discs) drag a little just because of just ONE old/contaminated/swollen seal or o-ring. I feel like in a smaller system like this a gunky o-ring could cause a bit of dragging.
Engineers like to solve problems. If there are no problems handily available, they will create their own problems.

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Offline MCRider

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Re: How much front brake drag is normal - CB750
« Reply #27 on: May 30, 2012, 05:43:02 AM »
Cleaning the groove: I used the Dremel tool with a black bristle brush attachment which came in the kit. The bristles appear to be a plastic, not wire. It shined up the groove nicely removing corrosion and discolortaion, without removing material I'm pretty sure, making me confident it was clean.

PS: My brakes (duallies) now work as good as ever, great snap back action.  You'll find your problem and be happy. It took me a while. The brakes had sat in a box nearly 17 years, fully assembled with all the crud from years of use acting as corrosive agents.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2012, 05:55:59 AM by MCRider »
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline HondanutRider

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Re: How much front brake drag is normal - CB750
« Reply #28 on: May 30, 2012, 05:51:16 AM »
The one problem/deficiency with the design of these disc brakes, is that unlike most modern designs, there are no seals to prevent ingress of moisture or dirt.  The O-ring (actually rectangular instead of circular in cross-section) is there to provide the piston pull-back and to isolate (ok seal) the hydraulic brake fluid chamber.  As previously described, any interference at this seal will cause it to hang-up, and the only aid to keeping it clean is to try and protect it with a bit of grease - which naturally has to be able to withstand very high temperature.

If you carefully look at the groove in the piston wall of the caliper, where the O-ring sits, you will see that one side is "rounded" and not a square shoulder.  This allows the O-ring to "flex" and roll when the piston is forced outwards under brake application, and then roll back as it pulls the piston in when the brake is released.  If there is any dirt or material hampering this action of "rolling back", then you have a dragging brake.

Offline MCRider

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Re: How much front brake drag is normal - CB750
« Reply #29 on: May 30, 2012, 05:58:01 AM »
HondaNut: I knew the square section ORing was involved in pulling the piston back, but i never knew the groove was specially shaped as well, till I read it here on a different thread years ago.

This is very good information to disseminate.
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline HondanutRider

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Re: How much front brake drag is normal - CB750
« Reply #30 on: May 30, 2012, 06:16:19 AM »
HondaNut: I knew the square section ORing was involved in pulling the piston back, but i never knew the groove was specially shaped as well, till I read it here on a different thread years ago.

This is very good information to disseminate.

This is illustrated and explained in the Honda Common Service Manual on page 17-4.  That's a good manual to consult for many topics regarding these (and other) bikes.  You can get a copy free...just Google Search for it.

Offline MCRider

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Re: How much front brake drag is normal - CB750
« Reply #31 on: May 30, 2012, 06:52:51 AM »
HR: That's a great reference!
http://www.vf750fd.com/vf750f/Honda_Common_Service_Manual.pdf
On my way to 17-4, I skimmed several other topics and am more educated already. I discovered i've been puttig the clutch hub nut on upside down. (11-25)

At 373 pages, Its a handfull.

(Not sure if i got the right one, but 17-4 discussed the ORing and groove.)
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."