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Author Topic: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...  (Read 1603 times)

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Offline Taylor

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Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« on: September 04, 2011, 03:21:24 PM »
I am having some problems shifting due to clutch dragging. I have checked my clutch and everything seems pretty good. No warping. People on here have recommend changing the counter-shaft O-ring... its apparently  a night and day difference. But I cant find my counter-shaft O-ring on a 73 CB500/4... the write ups are all for 750's and mine def doesn't look the same under the cover.  Any help would be appreciated!  ;)

-Thanks
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Offline WarwickE36

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2011, 03:34:18 PM »
Is yor oil in good shape? I.e. less than 1,500 miles old?  Also what kind is it.  I don't want to start an oil thread, but... I cant get neutral at a stop unless I use the proper oil.  I've tried a few but only a couple kinds work properly.  Also make sure your clutch cable is set properly.  I dont want to sound like you dont know what you're talking about but a lot of things can affect clutch drag.  Make sure you fix the easy things first.
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" Why does anyone get offended by what someone does to their own bike? I dont get it. "

You made me think about it after I cheered knowing someone else would like to know what these control freaks are up to.
 Every time any owner strips whatever precious Honda part the horrified purists parts go up in value. That's not the part that bothers them.
 What bothers them is they sat up late at night, their breast full of wonder and estrogen, unable to sleep, dreaming about their lovely darling and all her glory... and next thing you know someone else doesn't share their emotional deluge and their reaction is they must spread their mind museum as far as they possibly can, taking over as much of the real world as possible.

Drink fast, drive slow, but ride it like you stole it

1974 Cb550 with style
2004 SV650s

Offline Taylor

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #2 on: September 04, 2011, 03:42:55 PM »
Yeah. Oil is in good shape. I am using the honda 10-40. Should I be using something different? I have adjusted and adjusted and it still drags. I made sure to adjust it properly, starting from the clutch cover to the bit on top of the clutch cover then finally to the handle lever. Also I get the oil light at idle.... I heard that is a symptom the countershaft O-ring being worn out. Any other ideas?
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Offline WarwickE36

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #3 on: September 04, 2011, 03:47:33 PM »
Has the bike been sitting for a while or have you been riding it consistently?
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" Why does anyone get offended by what someone does to their own bike? I dont get it. "

You made me think about it after I cheered knowing someone else would like to know what these control freaks are up to.
 Every time any owner strips whatever precious Honda part the horrified purists parts go up in value. That's not the part that bothers them.
 What bothers them is they sat up late at night, their breast full of wonder and estrogen, unable to sleep, dreaming about their lovely darling and all her glory... and next thing you know someone else doesn't share their emotional deluge and their reaction is they must spread their mind museum as far as they possibly can, taking over as much of the real world as possible.

Drink fast, drive slow, but ride it like you stole it

1974 Cb550 with style
2004 SV650s

Offline Taylor

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #4 on: September 04, 2011, 03:49:08 PM »
I have been riding it consistently. Over a period of about the last 3 rides it became nearly impossible to get the bike in neutral with it running. The oil was a bit low but nothing too serious.
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Offline WarwickE36

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #5 on: September 04, 2011, 03:58:20 PM »
I ran some Rotella T (now motorcycle approved) in my bike and neutral became impossible.  I switched back to valvoline 20/50 for wet clutches, and within 20 - 30 miles neutral was a breeze again.  In your case I would say maybe oil isn't the case, but it never hurts to try.  My bike is a 550 so my clutch is a bit different than yours.  Were I you, I would try some less invasive testing with oil before tearing things apart.  I dont know about this countershaft o-ring fix.  I have heard drilling the oiling system of the clutch can help, as well as replacing o-rings in the oil pump.  Currently I am rebuilding my motor and amd replacing all O-rings, you'd be surprised how flat those O-rings can become over time.  I dont know about replacing oil pump o-rings on a 500, but on a 550 its not that hard.  I would maybe pull the clutch is an oil change fails.  Make sure the clutch discs are worn past spec.  If everything checks out ok, I would replace pump orings and make sure oil pressure is to spec (the light wont tell you that).
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" Why does anyone get offended by what someone does to their own bike? I dont get it. "

You made me think about it after I cheered knowing someone else would like to know what these control freaks are up to.
 Every time any owner strips whatever precious Honda part the horrified purists parts go up in value. That's not the part that bothers them.
 What bothers them is they sat up late at night, their breast full of wonder and estrogen, unable to sleep, dreaming about their lovely darling and all her glory... and next thing you know someone else doesn't share their emotional deluge and their reaction is they must spread their mind museum as far as they possibly can, taking over as much of the real world as possible.

Drink fast, drive slow, but ride it like you stole it

1974 Cb550 with style
2004 SV650s

Offline Taylor

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #6 on: September 04, 2011, 04:15:51 PM »
Where can I find what spec is for the clutch discs?
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Offline WarwickE36

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2011, 04:19:27 PM »
The manuals are available for download here on the forum.  If you look at the top of the page, right above the first thread, you will find the link.  I believe there is a min. spec. in the manual. 
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" Why does anyone get offended by what someone does to their own bike? I dont get it. "

You made me think about it after I cheered knowing someone else would like to know what these control freaks are up to.
 Every time any owner strips whatever precious Honda part the horrified purists parts go up in value. That's not the part that bothers them.
 What bothers them is they sat up late at night, their breast full of wonder and estrogen, unable to sleep, dreaming about their lovely darling and all her glory... and next thing you know someone else doesn't share their emotional deluge and their reaction is they must spread their mind museum as far as they possibly can, taking over as much of the real world as possible.

Drink fast, drive slow, but ride it like you stole it

1974 Cb550 with style
2004 SV650s

Offline Taylor

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2011, 04:26:12 PM »
thank you. Ill try the messing around with the oil. Do you know where the oil pump is located? Kinda point me in the general direction of where its hiding?
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Offline mjstone

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2011, 07:49:31 PM »
The oil pump on the CB500 is under the left side engine cover.  This is the cover that your clutch adjuster is part of and it also covers the front sprocket.  I would check to see if your clutch push rod is intact before you tear into your oil pump.  It is located under the same cover.  The rod comes out of the engine just in front of the front sprocket.  The rod goes from one side of the engine to the other.  Try pulling it out from the engine, if only about a 3" piece comes out its broken, a common problem on the 500.  If its broken you will have hard shifting and difficulty in adjusting the clutch.  There is a thread in the FAQ section about this.

MJ
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1972 CB500Four (Honda)
1973 CB500Four (Oliver)

Offline bryanj

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2011, 11:37:47 PM »
Where did you get the info about a countershaft "O" ring? 'cos i don't think the 500 has one!!
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Semi Geriatric ex-Honda mechanic and MOT tester (UK version of annual inspection). Garage full of "projects" mostly 500/4 from pre 73 (no road tax in UK).

Remember "Its always in the last place you look" COURSE IT IS YOU STOP LOOKIN THEN!

Offline Danno

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2011, 12:59:05 AM »
it is more likely that the actuator ramps for the clutch are worn or out of adjustment as far as the oil don't use 20/50 plain old castrol 10/40 works best but to be honest these bikes are always picky about neutral try shifting to neutral as you come to a stop not after you have stopped  usually works every time
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Offline bryanj

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2011, 08:11:09 AM »
What actuator ramps, thats the 750, 500 has a screw type mechanism
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Semi Geriatric ex-Honda mechanic and MOT tester (UK version of annual inspection). Garage full of "projects" mostly 500/4 from pre 73 (no road tax in UK).

Remember "Its always in the last place you look" COURSE IT IS YOU STOP LOOKIN THEN!

Offline Taylor

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2011, 08:18:10 AM »
The clutch push rod is still intact and looks fine.

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=78643.0 The article explaining the countershaft O-ring. Yeah I wasn't sure if it applied to the 500... after removing the side cover it looks nothing like that!

Hmm.. as for the actuator ramps I'm not sure what that is? As far as under the clutch cover goes its a screw type mechanism. I've adjusted that. When i had the clutch cover removed and I pulled the clutch it disengaged.. I think enough for them to move freely.... this leads me to believe that it must be an oil delivery problem. I am also going to drill some holes in the basket when my buddy gets his drill press moved over to his new house. I don't think thats the cure for this problem tho but I'm sure it will help with things.

As far as the oil pump goes.. I've taken off the side cover. There are 3 flush screws holding a small lid in place. Then there are another set of screws (not flush) that hold the previously mentioned assembly in place with a gear inside. Is that the pump? I'm about ready to put it all together and throw some fresh oil in it and just ride it for a few hours and see if it gets better.
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Offline bryanj

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2011, 09:07:15 AM »
Don't drill the basket that only works for the 750 and the complete lump with oil pressure switch on top is the oil pump
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Semi Geriatric ex-Honda mechanic and MOT tester (UK version of annual inspection). Garage full of "projects" mostly 500/4 from pre 73 (no road tax in UK).

Remember "Its always in the last place you look" COURSE IT IS YOU STOP LOOKIN THEN!

Offline Taylor

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #15 on: September 06, 2011, 09:19:39 AM »
Quote from: bryanj on September 06, 2011, 09:07:15 AM
Don't drill the basket that only works for the 750 and the complete lump with oil pressure switch on top is the oil pump

OK... Thanks. I will investigate.
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Offline Danno

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #16 on: September 06, 2011, 10:27:51 PM »
yeah sorry the actuator ramps are on the 750 you have just the screw and the rod I have too many bikes thanks bryanj
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when you own a motorcycle the wife does not have to find you handy she just has to find you

Offline Taylor

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Re: Counter shaft O-ring for CB-500...
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2011, 10:22:33 AM »
BACK RIDING! 8) Not even sure what I did. I replaced every O-ring I encountered. Took apart and re-assembled the clutch. Re-re-re adjusted everything. Shifts into neutral no problem now. Smooth as butter.... I'm thinking it might have been a few O-rings within the oil pump assembly that were the culprit. They looked pretty pancakeish.... just wanted to thank everyone for the help!  Now to get some riding in here in MN before it gets too cold!
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