Topic: really messed up...

[buffaloejon]

Well, I guess my dreams of riding this weekend just went down the loo.

I cross threaded the spark plug on cylinder 2, and I was going to get a thread chaser to fix it.

So as I was using the thread chaser to fix it, I apparently found a groove, that was NOT the right one. So I'm trying to put the plug back in, and it goes in a couple different ways, so I knew it wasn't right. Look down there with my camera phone, and I can clearly see the threads are all kinds of messed up, with some stuff hanging out in the open, lots of fresh metal.

So, impatience and I guess ignorance hit me pretty hard today. Where do I go from here?

Take the engine off obviously, do I have to disassemble the top end? I've never rebuilt an engine, so I'd rather not, but I guess if it's out, I might as well...

And I'm probably best to just take the head to a machine shop and let them rethread it right? Or get them to put in a helicoil?

[buffaloejon]

But doing it with the engine together is just asking for trouble I'd think, getting little metal bits in the cylinder. And I can't imagine helicoiling #2 still on the bike.

What all does taking the head off to repair this entail? Replacement of head gasket of course, but what else?

[Duanob]

My ford truck has a helicoiled plug hole. I've driven to Manitoba and to California from Seattle and back, and towed a 6000 boat from Portland to Seattle since, no problemo! I'd trust one on my bike. You don't have to pull the head but I think I would on the bike. just to make sure you don't get any shavings inside the cylinders to get hot and burn a hole in your piston. Chances are small it would happen but why take the chance.

[FuZZie]

You don't have to pull the head but I think I would on the bike. just to make sure you don't get any shavings inside the cylinders to get hot and burn a hole in your piston. Chances are small it would happen but why take the chance.

Me too good advice 

[buffaloejon]

That's what I'm thinking duanob. I'll try and get a guy to come out here that knows his engine stuff to help me get the engine out, sans center stand, lift etc. I just don't have the money to buy all the luxuries. But I guess this'll be my winter project now, no sense in trying to ride until the spring 

That way I can buy a gasket/oil seal set from cycle x and do a good rebuild, she's leaking anyway.

[burnoutking1971]

@ King

Indeed, that procedure works quite well I have had to do it once. I used a piece of vacuum hose taped to my shop vac to suck out anything that might have got into the cylinder.

[Lostboy Steve]

As king said there are repair kits for this very situation. They work well and as someone else said fords were known for this problem for years and they cane up with a simple cost effective solution.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Don R]

Too late to help but I always thread my plugs in with a piece of fuel hose over the end of the plug until I feel it thread in, then tighten with the socket. You can even push a plastic vacuum tee on the end of the hose for a handle to turn with. That way, if it cross threads, the hose will slip before any damage occurs.

Don't forget the anti sieze.

[MCRider]

Well, I guess my dreams of riding this weekend just went down the loo.

I cross threaded the spark plug on cylinder 2, and I was going to get a thread chaser to fix it.
So as I was using the thread chaser to fix it, I apparently found a groove, that was NOT the right one. So I'm trying to put the plug back in, and it goes in a couple different ways, so I knew it wasn't right. Look down there with my camera phone, and I can clearly see the threads are all kinds of messed up, with some stuff hanging out in the open, lots of fresh metal.

So, impatience and I guess ignorance hit me pretty hard today. Where do I go from here?

Take the engine off obviously, do I have to disassemble the top end? I've never rebuilt an engine, so I'd rather not, but I guess if it's out, I might as well...

And I'm probably best to just take the head to a machine shop and let them rethread it right? Or get them to put in a helicoil?

You have your choice of solutions. To the original problem.

One should never crossthread a plug if...
one always starts the plug by hand. Put a little antiseize, favorite lube on the first few threads and get the plug started 2 full turns by hand/fingertips. This guarantees no crossthreading. after a successful start, put your socket on it.

[nokrome]

i would recomend pulling the head and installing these http://www.timesert.com/ in all the  cylinders, its a bullet proof system and you wont have to worry about it anymore.

[Stev-o]

Don - good tip on using tubing on the plug. Thanks.

[Don R]

Don - good tip on using tubing on the plug. Thanks.

You're welcome, it always slips before hurting anything. Just a fail-safe, and it's easy too. I always use it on the BMF heads on the 567" race engine. Way too expensive to have to repair it.

[buffaloejon]

Thanks everyone for the reassuring advice, I feel a lot better about it now then I did when I realized I had messed it up.

How does this kit look?
http://www.amazon.com/M12-1-25-Perma-Coil-Thread-Repair/dp/B0002KL3ZO/ref=sr_1_1?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1318192059&sr=1-1

[754]

 Before you cut it, pop the tappet cap and watch the exhaust open fully.
 Then grease the tap, and cut thethreads.
 Then blow it all out.. the exhaust..

 Its tough though to line up the holes on 2 and 3 cylinders.. easier off the bike.. the other thing with a Heli-coil.. make sure the tang comes out, it aint soft.

[Duanob]

i would recomend pulling the head and installing these http://www.timesert.com/ in all the  cylinders, its a bullet proof system and you wont have to worry about it anymore.

helicoil is a tenth of the price and works just as well. Went through this with my Ford.

You can do the tapping with the head on the bike but getting the right angle on the #2 plug hole might be a challenge. And you don't have to remove the engine form the frame just remove the head. You can take the head in and have it cleaned up and have your valves lapped. And a new head gasket and seals all around will do wonders, while you have it off. Check the walls of your cylinders and clean the tops of your pistons, check the rings, etc. It will be like having a new engine when your done.

[MCRider]

i would recomend pulling the head and installing these http://www.timesert.com/ in all the  cylinders, its a bullet proof system and you wont have to worry about it anymore.

helicoil is a tenth of the price and works just as well. Went through this with my Ford.

You can do the tapping with the head on the bike but getting the right angle on the #2 plug hole might be a challenge. And you don't have to remove the engine form the frame just remove the head. You can take the head in and have it cleaned up and have your valves lapped. And a new head gasket and seals all around will do wonders, while you have it off. Check the walls of your cylinders and clean the tops of your pistons, check the rings, etc. It will be like having a new engine when your done.

He's got a 750. Engine must come out. Not like a 550.

[fmctm1sw]

There is also a back tap tool that you insert into the plug hole and screw back out toward the top.  I'll see if I can find a link to it....

Here's the first page that showed up....  http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS-Performance-Products/555/80595/10002/-1?parentProductId=954483

But yeah, I've heard of folks greasing it up as mentioned as well..

[buffaloejon]

Ahh thanks fmctm1sw, I thought I had heard of those. Has anybody had any experience with these? The threads are super messed up, I can see metal hanging out over the hole. So I'm probably actually better off in the long run for the sake of compression to just helicoil it and pray I suck all the metal out.

[Duanob]

i would recomend pulling the head and installing these http://www.timesert.com/ in all the  cylinders, its a bullet proof system and you wont have to worry about it anymore.

helicoil is a tenth of the price and works just as well. Went through this with my Ford.

You can do the tapping with the head on the bike but getting the right angle on the #2 plug hole might be a challenge. And you don't have to remove the engine form the frame just remove the head. You can take the head in and have it cleaned up and have your valves lapped. And a new head gasket and seals all around will do wonders, while you have it off. Check the walls of your cylinders and clean the tops of your pistons, check the rings, etc. It will be like having a new engine when your done.

He's got a 750. Engine must come out. Not like a 550.

Ah I thought I read 550 musta been another post.

[buffaloejon]

Ok to remove the tang on the inserts, would I have to take the head off? I just really want to avoid that...

[cyclepsycho]

To truly repair it properly, you should take the head to a machine shop, have them TIG weld the hole shut and re-drill and tap it.  I've done Heil-Coils on Harley's while they were still on the bike, but the plug holes are a lot easier to get to than the #2 on a 4 cylinder Honda.  Grease the tap so the shavings stick to it and use a shop vac to suck out any debris. You can break off the tang with a pair of long needlenose pliers or a hemostat.
It's risky trying to do it on the bike.
While you have the head off, you might as well do a valve job, but that could lead to taking off the cylinders and installing a big bore kit.  $1500 later, you'll still have to fix the plug hole.

Remember, every 20 minute job is one broken bolt from becoming a 3 day nightmare.

[mrjack55]

Remember, every 20 minute job is one broken bolt from becoming a 3 day nightmare.

Truer words have never been spoken on this forum!