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Author Topic: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.  (Read 24086 times)

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Offline Rigid

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #25 on: November 03, 2011, 05:25:11 am »
Was told these 4-2 were american made and rare.  Can't remember the name.  Thunder Pipes maybe?
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Offline Rigid

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #26 on: November 03, 2011, 05:30:25 am »
From an Amen Savior catalog:
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Offline Rigid

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #27 on: November 03, 2011, 05:34:48 am »
Scalloped MAC 4-2 on bike I googled, lots of pics there under CB750, Honda Bobber, etc......
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Offline 70CB750

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #28 on: November 03, 2011, 05:56:32 am »
I am playing with the idea of cutting them up and making 4-1 from it. I built more exhausts than i care to remember but none for motorcycle. Am I too naive?

Hinomaru

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #29 on: November 03, 2011, 06:02:28 am »
Another pic of the CB750 RC Engineering header:




Offline 754

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #30 on: November 03, 2011, 07:42:02 am »
 Post # 27 looks like a King Custom Cycles bike..
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
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My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline 754

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #31 on: November 03, 2011, 07:44:57 am »
 I remember a pipe on a 750 like in post 24, the muffler was more upswept and had the same end..I think it was called a Delta? and was fairly low priced.
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline gecko672

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2011, 09:27:05 am »
Gotta love the 70's that beard, cigar and leathers with a flared collar......classic.
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Offline Really?

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2011, 09:54:56 am »
If these two brackets come with your Mac 4-1, the straight one is to hold the baffle to the frame and the one with the bend is the stop for the center stand.  It mounts on the other side of the bike.  I was clueless when I first got it, showed another and it helped and posting to maybe help someone else.


Offline MCRider

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2011, 11:02:07 am »
This is the "Triple A" spaghetti pipe. The four headers were individual pipes. it was a bit of a puzzle to assemble as they wrapped around each other more than any other pipe. They were only available, best i know, from 1970 to 1972. They are on my 1971 K1 which i bought in April 1971. Totalled it, rebuilt it, rode it to Ft Lauderdale, worked in a shop (Burke's Honda, #3 in national sales) and rebuilt it as shown, rode back to Indiana, and it was stolen in July 1972. fast life. The picture was taken in April 1972.
 
It had a long straight megaphone, non-removable baffle, and a simply delicious sound. The short production run kept it from ever being a part of many Exhaust Pipe "shoot outs" written by the magazines of the time. The excessive wiggliness of the headers was to assure they were "equal length". All the rage back then.

Some one else on the forum scored a bike with one of these pipes on it within the last year or so. maybe he'll see this and post a more up to date picture with broken down details.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2011, 11:04:16 am by MCRider »
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1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
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Offline Tews19

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #35 on: November 03, 2011, 11:15:19 am »
Post # 27 looks like a King Custom Cycles bike..


LOL IT IS. I was thinking the same thing. Does Rigid/KCC/Hondawiggie or whatever know that people can see the same IP address attached to postings?
1978 550K with low miles
1970 Honda CB750 survivor.

Offline Jan187

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #36 on: November 03, 2011, 11:34:08 am »
Dear all,

This is my old marving exhaust we modified. It's for the CB650Z
It was in a very bad shape, I used the silenser and made me a nice short cone and fitted the silenser in it. I eliminated one of the bends by grinding out a wig and folding the pipe straight and than welded it.  The ori pipe was a little longer and swept from under the bike and a little upwards. It was all 3" tube with the silenser on it at the end. The 4-1 join point is very recognisable on the marving pipes.




Regards, Jan

Offline tjofle

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #37 on: November 03, 2011, 11:42:09 am »
Motad 4-1 Stainless Steel

Price: About £300 + shipping
Downpipes fit directly into the muffler.
Oil filter and drain bolt access is retained. I was also able to replace the entire oil pan without removing the exhaust set.
Center stand is retained (the set includes a bracket to stop the center stand from hitting the drive chain).
Pillion/passenger footrests can be retained (although I have yet to figure out how  ???)
This set prefers quietness over power, so it is more suited for road use than track use.
Fitting was fairly straight forward, although some struggling / coaxing was required. I have a feeling that if the downpipes had been built to finer tolerances, fitting would be a doddle.
All fixtures and fittings are (supposed to be) included.

Available for (all?) CB750's, CB550 and loads of other makes and models. (Apparently, in the UK Motad is the standard replacement option for when the original pipes rust to bits)

The set i bought had some issues, but this is probably an anomaly;
  • The downpipes could have been built with better precision. Mine where scratched when I slid over the head collars, and they did not line up properly
  • Not all fixtures and fittings where included. Not a big problem as such, but annoying when it's 9 o'clock and all the shops are closed :P
  • The bracket supporting the center stand was too short, so the stand rested on the drive chain. I ended up bolting an old piece of petrol tank mounting rubber to the bottom of the bracket.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2011, 12:15:49 pm by tjofle »

Offline bjatwood

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #38 on: November 15, 2011, 05:50:52 pm »
My 4 into 2 pipes. Thinking they might be a MAC not sure tho....
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Offline CB750K4

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #39 on: November 16, 2011, 12:11:57 pm »
bjatwood, Those are Jardine slip-on mufflers.
I have a set on my bike that are rusting out and would LOVE to find a new set. ::)
CB750 K4  (original owner)

Offline grcamna2

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #40 on: November 16, 2011, 04:40:56 pm »
Strynboen,
        I like those  Marchall deeptone exhaust header pipes...the way that they cross over like that is nice;are they simple to install & how is synchronizing your carbs w/ those ones, compared to other brands? I like how the pipes have cyls. #1 & 3  &  #2  &  4  connected together...those cylinders fire both at the same time,so it makes sense to me that they would connect them together.
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Offline bjatwood

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #41 on: November 16, 2011, 04:49:25 pm »
bjatwood, Those are Jardine slip-on mufflers.
I have a set on my bike that are rusting out and would LOVE to find a new set. ::)

Does anyone make new baffles for Jardine's?
Brian
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Offline toytuff

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #42 on: November 16, 2011, 05:35:05 pm »
bjatwood, Those are Jardine slip-on mufflers.
I have a set on my bike that are rusting out and would LOVE to find a new set. ::)

Are these Jardines? Looks kinda like bjatwood's exhaust.

tt


Offline MCRider

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #43 on: November 16, 2011, 05:38:00 pm »
Strynboen,
        I like those  Marchall deeptone exhaust header pipes...the way that they cross over like that is nice;are they simple to install & how is synchronizing your carbs w/ those ones, compared to other brands? I like how the pipes have cyls. #1 & 3  &  #2  &  4  connected together...those cylinders fire both at the same time,so it makes sense to me that they would connect them together.
I have the Marshall DT as well. To be clear, 1 & 3 & 2&4 are not connected together. Rather all 4 enter the same collector.

The firing order is 1,2,4,3. At 90° intervals. No 2 cylinders ever fire together. So the order into the collector appears random. (I'll double check that tomorrow.)



I think you misspoke. its 1&4 and 2&3 that have common ignitions, The pairs do not fire together, but alternately 180° out. The ignition fires the plugs together in the pairs, but one spark is always a "wasted spark", as only one cylinder of the pair is at compression. The other is at exhaust.
Back to the exhaust, i do like it and can't wait to get mine fired up.   ;D
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
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Offline strynboen

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #44 on: November 17, 2011, 06:43:21 am »
tur på honda film

syncro have taked the last ticking saunds...it runs perfekt now..have standart kaburating..and syncro vas easy
« Last Edit: November 17, 2011, 06:51:46 am by strynboen »
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #45 on: November 17, 2011, 07:34:45 am »
Thats actually done correctly. Its not about firing its about balance. 2-3 and 1-4 should be paired together for best results.
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Offline MCRider

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #46 on: November 17, 2011, 07:38:40 am »
Thats actually done correctly. Its not about firing its about balance. 2-3 and 1-4 should be paired together for best results.
Which/what are you referring to?
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline MCRider

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #47 on: November 17, 2011, 08:17:10 am »
I know enough to be dangerous, but pipes are a pet peeve of mine. To me the whole purpose of changing the pipe is for performance. So that's where I'm am. Included in that is ground clearance, at least for the pseudo ricky racers among us. (no ref to member of same name)

I'm working from memory here. Back in the day, there were several "shootouts", tests performed by magazines, about the CB750 pipes. Drag strip times and Dyno Runs. That's what we're lacking now. Several manufacturers had their pet designs. Few of which stood up to scrutiny.

The original 4-1 were pretty good. They could easily be made better by withdrawing the long baffle on the early pipes, and rejetting. Good for a couple of HP, at the expense of more noise. The later pipes had the short baffle, so pulling it didn't make as much difference. Ground clearance was pretty good but limited on both sides.

The real drawback to the stock pipes was weight. Double walled headers and 4 mufflers. A 4-1 could knock 20+ lbs off IIRC. Unlimited clearance on the left, about the same on the right +/-. The rt side exit was chosen to appease dragsters, usually lower bikes that always turn left, and to keep the chain goo off the pipe.

The RC Eng pipe was likely the most popular thanks to Russ Collins and his high performance profile. His claim was that the 4 pipes entered the collector in the order of firing, 1,2,4,3 circular making a swirl. His pipe was always #1 or tied for #1 in the tests. The Jardine 4-1 was always the competition. Not nearly as pretty, had a weird sound, didn't have the swirl design, they just entered 1,2,3,4. Made the same HP, IIRC. Kerker was always in the hunt. They eventually bought out Jardine.

All the rest were after. The Triple AAA hung its hat on equal length headers, hence the wiggly. This was a car guy fad. I'm pretty sire it died out. At least it didn't help Triple AAA any.

A few of the 2-1 set ups would match the pairs: 1-4 and 2-3. This was expensive to do, over the 1-2 and 3-4 pairs. But overall 2-1 set ups were the poorest performers, (worse than stock IIRC) and poor ground clearance. So matching the pairs never proved out either.  They did allow the use of saddlebags.

The Yosh pipes were seldom included in the tests as they weren't even pretending to be street legal, way too loud. Probably the best performer though. Still, "Where's Beel?" dynorun?
I see now that CycleX has the 4-2-1 where he matches the pairs, and he has equal length headers. But, no dyno runs.  I would LOVE it if he would. He's got the situation, where he could just take one of his motors, and put his pipe on it, run it, then put someone else's pipe (the Yosh, though without a baffle its not apples to apples) on that same motor, run it and let the results speak.  But that sort of disclosure opens one up for the "wars", my s--t is better than your s--t, and everyone should know no two dynos are alike. It would take more guts than its worth. His pipe tells a good story though.

My Marshall DT has squiggly pipes, but I've never seen them advertise that equal length was a selling point. In fact, visually the squigglies are not equal length. OCICBW  Also, the pipes are not paired in any fashion. They just run into the collector in numerical order. If they go to the effort of making the squigglies (gotta be hard) why not equal length and firing order? Anyway, they have a massive catalog and many of their pipes have dynoruns. But not the CB750. All were equal to or better than stock. Usually EU legal, though they must be louder than stock. It might be the DeepTone which holds the db down.

My choice was Kerker or Marshall, I wanted a new shiny pipe. The Kerker interferes with luggage. So it was the Marshall for me as the Meg has a low exit. It may suffer on clearance though. I'm taking a chance that it doesn't DETRACT from performance.

Maybe this should be a new thread? If anyone has those old Pipe tests (Hinomaru) I'd love to see them.
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Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline MCRider

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #48 on: November 17, 2011, 08:19:42 am »
Another pic of the CB750 RC Engineering header:
snip

I have that same poster, signed by Russ, on my shop wall. Along with the "fire burnout" one.
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Hinomaru

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Re: Exhaust Photo Reference Library.
« Reply #49 on: November 17, 2011, 09:09:59 am »
If anyone has those old Pipe tests (Hinomaru) I'd love to see them.
MCRider, Is this the pipe test article you are thinking of?
 
http://www.hondachopper.com/garage/articles/exhaust_testing/page1.html
 
Honda 4 into 1 headers and scanned from my RC catalog dated 1980:

(click on pics for a larger view)
 

 

 


 

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