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Author Topic: Vintage sidecar rebuild - new video  (Read 46622 times)

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Offline Tintop

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Vintage sidecar rebuild - new video
« on: February 26, 2012, 08:07:09 PM »
Decided it was time to start a thread on the rebuild of the vintage sidecar I plan to race this coming season.

I've been looking for a way to get back racing for a while.  Having raced karts & cars, I gave serious thought to a bike, but decided unlike bwaller, the skill set wasn't there.  So I have to thank Bear (Brian) for opening my eyes to the possibility of sidecars.  The class that offered the most appeal was P2, a 750 twin class.  While I really wanted to use a Honda, there just isn't anything that is suitable.  So, after much searching I purchased a GBR replica, with a Yamaha XS.  And yes, I spoke to Sam, and he agreed to my posting this here, rather than 'Other Bikes'.  For two reasons - that it was Bear's Honda powered Windle that got me going, and I've also purchased a 2nd chassis (next winter's project). A P3 that will use a 900cc Honda, and 13" slicks.

So this is what I'm starting with.  The frame was built in 2002, and has won at least one VRRA Championship.  It hasn't raced in 3 years, and wasn't exactly stored in prime quarters (a car tent, on dirt ::) ).



the missing dustbin fairing


The first thing I decided to modify was the fairing.  So paint was stripped, and off it went to have the right side extended for better aero.  While it was away, the frame was stripped down, and parts inspected.  The 'needs rebuild, or replace' list got very long. :(

Stripped to the frame -

Parts shelf, and all the other stuff -



Trial fit of the modified fairing, and new clip-ons -

New ducting for the relocated oil cooler.  I was going to do it in alloy, but will 'glas' the front part, and use alloy for the removeable back part of the duct work.  The alloy piece is actually the foot brace that belongs beside the chair wheel.  I'm going to make a similar one to house the battery, solinoid, Boyer ignition box, and fuel pump -

Refinished the hubs, which are 48 spoke Kaw KZ's.  The rims are 16" alloy DID's (next polish job), and very short SS spokes.  Front brake is a Suzuki GT750 caliper & iron rotor, rear is KZ750/900, also with an iron rotor.
 

Tomorrow I start the engine tear down.  Currently it's a full race 650, but will be getting a Mike's XS 750 kit, and a few other tweeks. ;) :)
« Last Edit: August 28, 2013, 03:49:11 PM by Tintop »
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline FuZZie

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2012, 10:07:58 PM »
This looks like it's going to be a fun, what's the rules for building it can you give a link?

Offline Jim F

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2012, 05:15:02 AM »
This will be fun to watch
Who is the mike that is going to build the motor?
Mike Rieck?

Jim
2002 RC51 1000 (SP2)
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Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2012, 06:25:30 AM »
Here's the link to the VRRA Rule Book (pdf), AHRMA use the same classes.  The sidecar stuff is on page 30.  As mentioned this rig is running as a P2.  If there are enough funds available, I'm going to try and run a couple of US races.

http://www.vrra.ca/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/VRRA-Rules-May-2011.pdf

Mike's XS is a distributor of street & racing parts for the XS series of engines.  They sell a complete 750 upgrade kit.  New barrel with larger fins, forged/coated pistons, head and base gaskets.  The head has already been ported by Pro6, and it has a race cam.  Not sure until I open it up who's though, but am hoping it is a Webcam.

http://www.xs650direct.com/products-25.html
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline FuZZie

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2012, 06:57:59 AM »
Rules Look pretty strait forward and it's always good if the parts guy is close. That 750 big bore kit looks well done and the extra cooling should be a asset especially behind a faring with it boxed in underneath to catch any oil leaks.   

Online Sam Green Racing

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2012, 07:08:28 AM »
It's strange that they don't specify who makes the big cylinder block, MORGO perhaps ?

They do make them for Triumphs.  http://www.morgo.co.uk/bigbore.html

Sam. ;)
C95 sprint bike.
CB95 hybrid race bike
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Offline Flying J

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2012, 08:04:47 AM »
Well, Ill add this to my list of bikes to follow. Here is another sidecar rig i have been watching. Its a little less threatening.

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2012, 03:04:46 PM »
It's strange that they don't specify who makes the big cylinder block, MORGO perhaps ?

They do make them for Triumphs.  http://www.morgo.co.uk/bigbore.html

Sam. ;)

I've only seen them referred to as either 'Mike's XS', or 'XS Performance' 750 Big Bore kits.  They sure do look similar to the Morgo ones though.  I'll get the kit here from XS Direct.  Heiden in Holland also offers the same kit, as well as an 880cc kit for the later motor.
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2012, 03:18:24 PM »
Rules Look pretty strait forward and it's always good if the parts guy is close. That 750 big bore kit looks well done and the extra cooling should be a asset especially behind a faring with it boxed in underneath to catch any oil leaks.   

There's a mandated belly pan, that attaches under the engine for 'unintended oil evacuation'.  The engine is checked by scrut's before you get to go on track.  Any oil leaks, and you don't go. ;)

Here's a picture of an other VRRA member's GBR replica.  It has the 750 kit, and is probably one of the nicest on the grid currently.
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Online Sam Green Racing

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2012, 03:51:15 PM »
Untill yours hits it. ;D ;D ;D

Sam. ;)
C95 sprint bike.
CB95 hybrid race bike
CB95 race bike
CB92
RS 175. sprint/land speed bike
JMR Racing CB750A street ET drag bike

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2012, 04:54:28 PM »
Untill yours hits it. ;D ;D ;D

Sam. ;)

 ::) shush, don't want to scare them yet.  I was thinking of doing the 1st track day in primer. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Brian
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline jaguar

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2012, 12:07:18 PM »
Old side cars are great
Loved seeing them run at Mid O
if you say to someone "penny for your thoughts" and then they give you there 2 cents......whats with the other penny?
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Offline bwaller

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2012, 04:12:02 PM »
I'm not sure who manufactures those kits but I have seen them and it's good quality. Those engines are stout as hell, way over built for 650cc, no wonder guys use them for this purpose.

I drove by yesterday afternoon Brian, kind of a last minute thing, of course I didn't bring contact #'s. I'll just have to see it at Shannonville, unless you want to go to Loudon in May.

Good luck with the preparation, looking good.

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #13 on: February 29, 2012, 04:14:40 PM »
Thanks bw, sorry we did get a chance to connect.  I should have the rims ready late next week for relacing.  Have to call Mr. Henderson, and make sure he still has time to do them.  If I decide to deliver them, maybe we can meet up somewhere in your neck of the woods.  Are you coming up for the Belleville show?  VRRA has a booth, and I'll be there Friday, and maybe one other day.

Finally got the bead blaster working, yeah.  Will certainly cut done on the hand stripping of the small parts.  Also got a call from the 'glass' guy, the chair wheel cowl mod is done.  Pictures tomorrow. :)
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2012, 01:09:45 PM »
My short trip over to the 'glass' guy was even better than expected.  Came home with some extra goodies. ;D ;D ;D ;D

My passenger asked for an additional handle on the chair wheel fairing.  This will make it easier for him to look back over his shoulder, and let me know what happening behind.  Time to strip the old paint, and get it ready for it's new colours.


I traded the GL front end I had for a the new handle, a new glassed in duct for the oil cooler, & an other XS that will become the spare.  Bonus was it came in a stand that can be used for building, and transport.  As we were talking I mentioned I needed to get a grinder.  He reach in a cupboard, and handed me an old one.  Needs new wheels, but runs nice and smooth. 8)



Also took some pictures of next winter's project - it's a Fiddaman Sam, not an Ireson.  The S/N is 'MGFRS / 616003', not sure how I can get any info on it.

1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Online Sam Green Racing

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #15 on: March 01, 2012, 01:50:52 PM »
Brian, Mike Fiddaman was a respected sidecar chassi builder, please don't think you've been done because it's not one of Trevors.
Mikes chassis won many races and championships.
A few weeks ago I was at a party with Simon#42 and met up with a guy I met some years ago.
His name was Derick Rumble, he was a chassi builder/tuner/racer and campaigned BSA powered outfits and later became a factory rider for Mitsui Yamaha before a big smash ended his career.
There were lots of good outfit builders in the UK but the main thing is RIDE SAFE.

Good luck mate.

Sam. ;)
C95 sprint bike.
CB95 hybrid race bike
CB95 race bike
CB92
RS 175. sprint/land speed bike
JMR Racing CB750A street ET drag bike

Offline brooze72

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #16 on: March 01, 2012, 02:12:47 PM »
Subscribed - Looking forward to following your build & adventures, Brian, hope to see you at a track sometime this summer  :D  Bruce
2011, 2012 & 2013 Godzilla Relay Rally Rider
"Hold on loosely...don't let go
 If you cling too tightly...you're gonna lose control"
1972 CB500K1 - restored rider
1981 CB650C - new project

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #17 on: March 01, 2012, 05:43:22 PM »
Brian, Mike Fiddaman was a respected sidecar chassi builder, please don't think you've been done because it's not one of Trevors.
Mikes chassis won many races and championships.
A few weeks ago I was at a party with Simon#42 and met up with a guy I met some years ago.
His name was Derick Rumble, he was a chassi builder/tuner/racer and campaigned BSA powered outfits and later became a factory rider for Mitsui Yamaha before a big smash ended his career.
There were lots of good outfit builders in the UK but the main thing is RIDE SAFE.

Good luck mate.

Sam. ;)

No worries Sam, I feel I got a great deal (all there except engine), and it will be a lot of fun in the end.  I did do a quick Google search, and really couldn't find much info, or period photos.  Hence my question regarding finding some info.  If any of your mates over there can 'fill in the blanks', it would be greatly appreciated.  I'll post something on 'Steve's Place' as well.  There are three engine options I could pursue - F2 with a 600cc CBR (not likely), or P3 with either a 900+cc SOHC, or CB900F twin cam.  As I already have a couple of SOHC 750 engines laying around that's the most likely route.  I wonder if one of Mike's billet barrel kits would be legal. ;) :)

Hey Brooze72, glad to have you aboard.  1st race is June 2nd @ Shannonville.
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline brooze72

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #18 on: March 01, 2012, 08:15:30 PM »
Great news Brian, guess that's your deadline for getting it all together!
2011, 2012 & 2013 Godzilla Relay Rally Rider
"Hold on loosely...don't let go
 If you cling too tightly...you're gonna lose control"
1972 CB500K1 - restored rider
1981 CB650C - new project

Offline NickO

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2012, 12:35:26 AM »
Go to this sidecar racing website in the UK:

"Steve's Place" www.steveenglish.com

Join the forum and post your photographs and questions in the "Classic/Vintage/Where are they now" section. You will definitely get some feedback.

Online Sam Green Racing

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #20 on: March 02, 2012, 02:39:48 AM »
Brian, as well as what Nick says, try sidecarracers.com forum.

Sam. ;)
C95 sprint bike.
CB95 hybrid race bike
CB95 race bike
CB92
RS 175. sprint/land speed bike
JMR Racing CB750A street ET drag bike

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #21 on: March 02, 2012, 05:49:40 AM »
Thanks for the quick fedback Nick & Sam.  I'm already signed onto www.steveenglish.com, and will add www.sidecarracers.com to my favourites as well.  Mainly looking for some period pictures (mid / late 70's) of the Fiddaman rigs, so I can bring it back to what it was, not what it became.

Actually Booze72, the deadline is April 21st.  RACE/SRA have a track day at Shannonville that weekend with a sidecar group.  The sidecar group is mainly for the F1's & F2's, but they will let the vintage guys come to play as well. ;D  Other than the back straight, the P2's are quicker than the F1's through the twisties, and not that far behind the F2's.  There's also a track day at Cayuga in May that may have a sidecar group.  Hoping to get to both, so I get some seat time, before I take the VRRA school (June 1st), and 1st race on the 2nd.

1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2012, 01:03:37 PM »
Got a little more work done today.  Engine is stripped to the cases, tomorrow I'll flip it, and split them to check the crank, and tranny.  Also got the rims back today.  Kevin @ Perma Buff here in Kingston did a great job. 8)  Just waiting for the new rear spokes, and they can go back together.

1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #23 on: March 03, 2012, 12:14:22 PM »
Got some more work done stipping the engine down.  Good news is it has a regrind cam, that's in very good condition. ;D

Then the bad news.  The front cam chain guide is badly scored, which explains were the metal bits in the filter came from.  There was also sealer in the filter. :o  On removing the clutch cover it became apparent were that came from.  Some people should never be aloud to touch that stuff.  Last thing was to remove the oil pump.  Given what I had already found, I was not surprised to find it also scored.  One more thing to add to the 'needed' list.

Chain guide, and yes the rubbing surface should go all the way to the bottom.  Figure the rest is in the sump.


Filter & clutch cover (notice the sealer on the inside of the sealing surface - not good) >:(



I'll split the cases tomorrow.  As the XS crank & rods ride on bearings, there's hope the rest is still OK.
1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

Offline Tintop

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Re: Vintage sidecar rebuild
« Reply #24 on: March 18, 2012, 05:03:38 PM »
The original floor was plywood, and rotting. :( Just finshed up a new alloy floor, and got the tank back from having 4 year old gas cleaned out.  The guy at the rad shop even polished it! 8)  I'll make up a template of the new passenger padding.  It will be 1/2" dense foam, covered with marine vinyl.


1977 CB550/4 Cafe - Speed Warrior / BOTM 03/11
Whittaker GBF Vintage Racing Sidecar (XS750 power) - ITG / 151's / CMR Racing Products
1976 CB400 SS - stock / BOTM 04/11 (SOLD)
1973 CB750 K - basket case
77 CB550 Cafe build
550/750 Filter Thread
Sidecar Rebuild Thread

 

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