Author Topic: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?  (Read 2012 times)

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Offline Adam_F

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Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« on: November 21, 2013, 01:44:43 PM »
Hey Everybody!  I'm completely reassembling the front brake on my 77 cb550F.  New SS hoses, new MC, new caliper (w piston and seal, etc), pads.  Even sending out the rotor to Tom @ truedisk.  I've read around the forum that folks have filled their system from the bottom (bleeder screw) using a syringe plunger.  Sounds like a smart and efficient way to do it as air naturally rises upward.  Didn't really see any other details in my searches other than it has been done.

Have any of you done it this way?  Is it that straight forward, or do you have any words of wisdom for me before I dive in?  Any tips would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!
'77 cb550F

Offline flybox1

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2013, 01:57:31 PM »
tip?  ok. two words
SPEED BLEEDER
 ;D
'78 750K (F3 engine) PD42b's, Modified airbox w/K&N  filter, 40/110 jets, 1 needle shim, IMS@ 1 turn out. Kerker + Cone 18" QuietCore

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2013, 02:42:58 PM »
I've done it that way before, and it worked great. But, i did have
access to an automotive type power bleeder, that actually injected
fluid into the entire system in reverse. That might not help you, but the principle IS the same. Very thorough and took me less than 5
minutes total. Lots of different ways as well, I'm sure...


ps......If you go this route, inject SLOWLY, or you risk the chance of getting brake fluid on the ceiling, and monitor the fluid level in the master cyl the entire time! From personal experience ;D
« Last Edit: November 21, 2013, 02:48:37 PM by DH »

Offline Adam_F

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2013, 03:47:21 PM »
ps......If you go this route, inject SLOWLY, or you risk the chance of getting brake fluid on the ceiling, and monitor the fluid level in the master cyl the entire time! From personal experience ;D
[/quote]

Good call.  Safety goggles for this one  8) ha!  I'm hoping I can get enough pressure from the syringe plunger that I have to get the fluid all the way to the MC. 
'77 cb550F

Offline Duanob

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2013, 06:41:30 PM »
I use a vacuum bleeder, fill fluid from the top down, works perfect.
"Just because you flush a boatload of money down the toilet, doesn't make the toilet worth more",  My Stepfather the Unknown Poet

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Offline Adam_F

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2013, 08:10:03 PM »
Thanks guys
'77 cb550F

Offline Airbusboy

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2013, 10:57:33 PM »
Guys I'm pretty new here so who is 'Tom@trudisk'?  I ask because when I rebuilt the disc system on my '74 CB550, I missed the blocked return hole in the MC and on the test drive overheated the disc and it turned blue. I've been unable to polish is out so does 'Tom' turn these discs? Thanks for the info!

Offline Bodi

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2013, 03:41:13 AM »
Pressure filling the brake system from the lowest point is a great idea, as Adam notes it carries the "I want to float upwards" air - upwards. I don't know anyone with a pressure brake filling tool; these are required to service many ABS systems but are hardly a normal home shop tool. Excepting Jay Leno's "home" shop maybe...
I had a great deal of trouble trying to bleed and de-air my own front brake lines, not happy with the spongy feel at the lever after installing braided lines that were supposed to get me a firm lever feel.
The speed bleeder is pretty neat, but assists only in traditional top-down bleeding. It's purpose is to prevent air being pulled back into the caliper when pumping fluid down using the M/C - it has a one-way valve so you don't need to do contortions to loosen and tighten the bleed nipple every lever squeeze. You put grease on the speed bleeder threads to stop air being sucked past them.
I tried a large syringe for brake filling from the caliper, it worked OK but fluid naturally leaked past the bleeder threads and made a mess - you can't use a speed bleeder (one-way valve is the wrong way for this) so it has to be swapped in after finishing and that process leaks more fluid.
As noted, brake fluid will squirt out of the M/C relief hole up to the ceiling easily when pumping it into the caliper , squirting the farthest when the reservoir is empty with no pool of fluid to squirt through.  It always manages to spray onto - and ruin - nicely painted surfaces. Hopefully forum readers have learned this the "easy way"!
My solution:
First I measured the caliper piston height at the point where it is just in over the cylinder seal, as I recall it is just shy of being level with the caliper face.
Then fill the system the usual way, from the M/C - but with the caliper piston fully pushed in and held with a C-clamp.
Then loosen the C-clamp and pump more fluid in until the piston is at the measured height for maximum volume of fluid in the caliper cylinder, and leave very little fluid in the M/C reservoir - put the reservoir cap back on to catch the squirting.
Then use the C-clamp to push the piston back in all the way, with quick twists on the clamp screw to hopefully shake bubbles loose.
I shake and tap the caliper (dismounted, obviously, to get the clamp on) with the brake line inlet upwards, dismount and orient the tee likewise and shake/tap it, hold  the flex lines so that any upward arcing bends that would collect bubbles are eliminated, watching the reservoir level to syringe out excess fluid before it overflows.
After a few repeats, the result was excellent: the brake lever feel is very solid. Brake operation is better as well, the initial brake drag after applying the brake is almost gone. I think that air in the system defeats the slight caliper piston pull-back effect as the M/C piston retracts before it uncovers the relief hole.
You get the de-airing benefit of a $$$$ pressurized brake system filling rig for the price of a C-clamp and a syringe.

Offline flybox1

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2013, 06:59:29 AM »
Guys I'm pretty new here so who is 'Tom@trudisk'?  I ask because when I rebuilt the disc system on my '74 CB550, I missed the blocked return hole in the MC and on the test drive overheated the disc and it turned blue. I've been unable to polish is out so does 'Tom' turn these discs? Thanks for the info!
dont hijack threads.  your topic derails the conversation form what the threads starter intended.
use the google search bar at the top left and/or start another thread if you cannot find the info you are looking for. ;)

on a side note, polishing wont help, grinding will.  check these apples out... 8)
http://www.vinmoto.org/gallery/v/VinMoto-Garage/album03/Godfferys-Garage-123/95/Brake+Rotors+_+Thinned+and+Drilled/HONDA+Front+brake+rotors+CB+450K-500T-500K-550K-550F/
« Last Edit: November 22, 2013, 07:04:06 AM by flybox1 »
'78 750K (F3 engine) PD42b's, Modified airbox w/K&N  filter, 40/110 jets, 1 needle shim, IMS@ 1 turn out. Kerker + Cone 18" QuietCore

Past Bikes
1974 550K0 (stock), 1973 CB350F (stock), 1983 Yamaha XS400K (POS)
77/78 cool 2 member #3
"Knowledge without mileage equals bullsh!t" - Henry Rollins

"This is my CB. There are many like it, but this one is mine…"

Offline evanphi

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2013, 07:01:35 AM »
I connect a piece of clear tubing to the catheter syringe and pump fluid up from the bleed nipple. I keep the MC cap on loosely as to avoid the geyser and check every few ml that goes out of the syringe. Works a charm.
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Offline bjatwood

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #10 on: November 22, 2013, 07:29:19 AM »
Also, make sure you cover the gas tank. Brake fluid is a #$%* on paint... ;)
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Offline bjbuchanan

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2013, 08:34:28 AM »
For a totally empty system I just work the MC to get something in there and then I open the bleeder down below just a bit and start pumping away. I use a tube to recover the fluid. It doesn't get air out per se but fills up the system pretty well. Then just regular old bleeding.

I'm all done in a half hour with a fresh system. I make sure to tap lightly all connections to hopefully loosen bubbles. I also bleed at all connection points, I think that is what really gives me a rock hard lever quickly. Fresh crush washers are great too
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Offline Xnavylfr

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Re: Filling dry brake lines from bleeder screw?
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2013, 09:16:11 AM »
If you fill from the top, I've done it this way without any problems.
Fill MC and remove line from it going down to caliper, hold thumb over the MC hole and pump till you get a squirt of fluid.
Hook hose up and disconnect from caliper end, make sure MC is full of fluid , cover both sides of hose end with finger and thumb and pump till you get squirt. Hook hose to caliper then bleed from your bleeder.


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