Author Topic: CB750 K6 - Step Step 12 - Now into some tweaking to get it right (Read 57792 times)

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #50 on:** July 27, 2014, 05:07:43 PM »

Take a look at these Pics.
It almost looks like there is a clear coat that is starting to separate.

edwardmorris · « **Reply #51 on:** July 27, 2014, 05:16:18 PM »

DID/NOS rims should just have chrome on them, no clear coat. I bought a set but its still boxed up, I can take a closer look if others don't reconfirm what I've said.

I don't drink, so the only cold ones I'll be grabbing will be pepsi max

All that caffeine hypes me up at times

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #52 on:** July 27, 2014, 05:35:43 PM »

Edward,
Thanks. Choice of Cold One is strictly up to the individual.

If you click on the picture it will expand and you can see the speckles. If you are standing up more than a foot or 2 away, it looks fine. Problem is that I'll know it isn't right. So the debate with myself starts. LOL

Charlie

SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan · « **Reply #53 on:** July 27, 2014, 09:40:44 PM »

Really nice polishing job on the hub. Definitely good enough.

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #54 on:** July 30, 2014, 06:58:05 PM »

Well, while I'm waiting for a few things to come in the mail, I decided to start work on replacing the Steering Stem Bearings (using the All Balls tapered bearings).
And for those that need a Good Laugh, read on.

Before starting, I read, re-read, and then read 2 more times, Hondamans book on the replacement process. So, I put a blanket on the floor, one of those nice filled type things that nothing should really bounce around on. Then I got a small plastic container to catch the balls. Then I loosened up the steering stem nut. Finished taking the steering stem nut off. Nothing moves and I figure this is good. Realize that I needed to loosen the clamp nut and then pull the top bridge off. Home free I sez to myself. Take 1/2 turn on the clamp nut and the triple tree slides right out the bottom hits the blanket and ball bearings raining from the sky bounce off the triple tree and roll all over the garage floor.

Ugh. So I do like Hondaman says and spend the next 15 minutes finding and picking up ball bearings. LOL Even though I'm not going to use them, except possibly to make a necklace or something for the wife, I think I found them all, and don't have to worry about the dogs finding and eating them. LOL

Tomorrow will be cleaning up the steering stem and hopefully removing the old races and put up some pictures. Also hope that I get the stuff I ordered. Decided to Clear coat the hub using the Eastwood Clear coat so waiting for that and their paint prep stuff.

Charlie.

edwardmorris · « **Reply #55 on:** July 30, 2014, 09:26:15 PM »

Steering stem races and swingarm bushings are the worst enemies of any 750 restorer. Here is a good pictorial

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=1516.msg291278#msg291278

give it a read a few times before getting to hammering out the old races. I didn't know these were tough to get out until I read it in Mark's book AFTER I drove them out with a piece of an old broom stick and my trusty hammer. Just got lucky on that one

some pix in my build thread (early on I think).

I bought the exact same set used in the pictorial above, hoping to get to it soon. I'm brainstorming ides for a home made bearing/race driver.

Stev-o · « **Reply #56 on:** July 31, 2014, 02:20:57 AM »

Quote from: edwardmorris on July 30, 2014, 09:26:15 PM

Steering stem races and swingarm bushings are the worst enemies of any 750 restorer. Here is a good pictorial

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=1516.msg291278#msg291278

give it a read a few times before getting to hammering out the old races. I didn't know these were tough to get out until I read it in Mark's book AFTER I drove them out with a piece of an old broom stick and my trusty hammer. Just got lucky on that one some pix in my build thread (early on I think).

I bought the exact same set used in the pictorial above, hoping to get to it soon. I'm brainstorming ides for a home made bearing/race driver.

A long drift punch makes removing the races simple.

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #57 on:** July 31, 2014, 07:22:20 PM »

Thanks Edward & Stev-o!
That thread you posted is a Super addition to Hondaman's book. In fact I created a document and have paper clipped it to the page in "The Book". Didn't have time to mess with it today. Hoping to do it tomorrow.

I know I have a long drift punch here somewhere, just have to find the darn thing.

Thanks Again Guys!

Charlie

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #58 on:** August 09, 2014, 01:16:45 PM »

So, now that my last weeks adventures are taken care of (and you really don't want to know - LOL) I got back to work on finishing up the hub and getting the steering stem ready. I also got my new el cheapo HF ultrasonic cleaner (on sale - that's one in a row. LOL).

Here are a couple of pictures of the Front Hub about 3-4 hours after clearcoating it.
I used the Eastwood Diamond Clear Gloss rattle can and the Eastwood Prep rattle can.
It seems to have dulled the finish, but that would be OK, since it was almost too shiny.

What do you think?

Tomorrow after the clearcoat is good and dry I'll take it outside and take another picture or 2 before I try clearcoating the rest of the axle parts. Just to see if it's what I really want.

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #59 on:** August 09, 2014, 01:39:09 PM »

After re-reading The Book and the pdf document of Kirkn's steering head rebuild thread while having lunch, I went out and removed the races. I did use the Dremel to cut a fairly deep notch in the stem race. Hit it with a drift and it popped right off. The upper neck race again was just a few taps and it came off. Figured I was Now in real trouble since the first 2 came off so easy. But, about a dozen taps and the lower race fell out. That's called "getting lucky once in a row".

Here is what the bare stem looks like now.

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #60 on:** August 09, 2014, 01:42:26 PM »

For anyone wanting a concise document on triple tree bearing replacement, I have attached it to this message with Kirkn's permission. I figured this way it can be downloaded and printed out relatively easy.

Thanks Ed for pointing me to the thread, and THANK YOU to Kirkn for Doing the Original Writing and giving me permission to post the document.

Charlie

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #61 on:** August 10, 2014, 06:47:06 AM »

Forgot to ask yesterday when I posted about the steering stem race removal.
Does anyone know what kind of grease Honda used on the steering stem bearings?
When I was cleaning up the parts the grease was Red and took a bit to clean off. After 38 years, it was (I assume) still pliable and performing its job. So, I was wondering what it was. If possible, I think I'd like to use it again.

Appreciate any and all help on this.
Thanks,
Charlie

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #62 on:** August 14, 2014, 07:21:32 PM »

Posted a thread in the SOHC forum and Thanks to Muckinfuss I believe the Grease originally used on the Steering Stem Bearings was Red Lithium Grease. For future reference for anyone wanting to know.

Today I started work on rebuilding the hub and replacing the bearings. First thing was to take a couple of pictures of the Finished Clear coated Hub and other hub parts. Looks pretty good I think. The Eastwood Diamond Clear clearcoat does seem to dull things down a little which is fine by me. Next thing was to get the old bearings out. It was easier to get the right (Speedo side) bearing out first. What I didn't realize was that the Collar inside the hub has 2 different size ends. This is not mentioned directly anywhere that I found. If you look at the picture below, the side with the blue tape is the Brake Side. It clearly has a smaller diameter than the Speedo Gear Box side. In order to get the collar out, without really bending the tabs too much, it has to come out on the Speedo Gear Box Side.
(slaps self up-side head). Got one of the new bearings in by using a cut in half 1 inch Sch 40 PVC "T" with a flat cap on the side I was hammering. Absolutely perfect fit. I did follow the (multiple) suggestion to Freeze the bearings to make them go in easier. It was fairly easy. Also followed the suggestion/direction to put in the Brake Side bearing first and drive it in to the seat. Tomorrow hopefully I will put the other bearing in and finish putting the hub back together. Maybe even start lacing the front wheel with the new stainless steel Buchanan Spokes. So, a little progress made. Hopefully more soon.

Charlie

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #63 on:** August 17, 2014, 08:53:35 AM »

Got a problem! I laced my Front wheel after reading and watching threads and videos.
All The Outer Spokes are Loose. Like just flopping in their holes.

First picture is the newly laced wheel. (Valve Stem is at 12 o'clock.)
Second picture is the Original Wheel before disassembly.

I measured the thickness of the Hub at the point where the spokes sit. The thickness is 6.43mm.

I then measured the length of the head of one of the New Outer spokes. It measures 15.81mm. The third picture shows the measurement of the new Outer spoke. I set the micrometer square to the stem.

The measurement of the Original Outer Spoke is 15.14mm. That's the 4th picture.

Just to make sure I didn't put the spokes in the wrong positions, the 5th picture shows the Original Outer, the Original Inner and the New Outer. The Old Inner Spoke is the one with the smaller bend. Hope I didn't get them wrong.

The New Parts I used are Buchanan Stainless Steel spokes and Nipples (HON711SS), a Brand New DID 19 inch Rim and my old cleaned up Hub.

Would appreciate some help if I screwed up in my lacing or

?

Thanks,

Charlie

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #64 on:** August 17, 2014, 08:57:14 AM »

Here are the other 3 pictures.

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #65 on:** August 17, 2014, 02:49:14 PM »

OK, I think I figured out the problem.
Here are a couple of pictures.
First Picture is the (what I think) Correct Lacing. (Red Arrow Indicates Valve Stem)
Second Picture is Definitely the WRONG Lacing. (Red Arrow Indicates Valve Stem)
The Next 2 pictures were taken from behind the Valve Stem and the first 2 spokes next to the Valve stem are Labeled.
Third picture is a side view of the Correctly (I think) Laced hub.
Fourth Picture is the Definitely Wrong Laced Hub.

Tell me the difference.

Give you a hint. It's kind of like sex.

Charlie

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #66 on:** August 18, 2014, 04:33:47 PM »

OK, only the first 2 pictures came through.
So here are pictures 3 & 4.
First picture is number 3 (Good Lacing)
Second is number 4 (incorrect lacing).
Both pictures are taken from right behind the Valve Stem hole.

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #67 on:** August 18, 2014, 04:43:08 PM »

Today I snugged down the Spokes and put on the Lube/Anti Seize that came in the package with the spokes from Buchanan. I called Buchanan to specifically ask if the "little bottle" was just lubricant or was it lube/anti seize. The lady that answered my call asked me to hold for a minute so she could ask and make sure it was the Lube/Anti Seize. When she came back she confirmed that it was indeed Lube/Anti Seize, so I used it.

After snugging down the wheel, all the spokes were into the nipples very close to the same amount. Will true and balance the wheel later this week.

But, in the meantime here is a picture of the completed wheel. Also, I used some red Lithium Grease on the axle when I stuck it in the hole and it spins pretty easily.

Oh, the Blue tape on the rim is the valve stem hole.

Charlie

edwardmorris · « **Reply #68 on:** August 18, 2014, 06:00:09 PM »

Just saw this thread. I didn't realize you were breaking off each step into a diff thread. I'd suggest you keep all your progress together in one project thread and just modify the subject of the original post at various stages. Had I known you were trying to lace the wheels, I'd have shared these before you started

Front
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135846.0

Rear
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=368.msg205745#msg205745

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #69 on:** August 18, 2014, 06:34:59 PM »

Edward,
Sorry about they apparent "Break Off". I didn't do it intentionally. This stupid computer did something weird when I hit "Post". I was wondering if there is some way to rejoin the 2 threads back together?

?

As far as the 2 threads you posted. After taking a look at them, You did send them to me. But I don't remember whether it was in another post or via pm. But thank you for the links!!!

There is a critical piece of information missing from both of those threads. And pretty much from the dozen or so You Tube Videos I watched and other internet "instructional posts".

As I asked in a previous post "Can You tell me the difference?" The hint refers to "it's kind of like sex."

Well for those still scratching their heads, the answer is The spokes got to go in the right holes. Doing what almost every does (in the videos & other posts) when they start the lacing, they start at the hole next to the Valve Stem Hole. That would be an Upper Inner Spoke. Then they kind of rotate the hub to maximum extension of the spoke. Then you count 4 holes and the Next Inner Spoke on that side goes in that (4th) hole, and so on around the wheel.

Now Here is the KEY Step that no one comes out and tells anyone.

When you took pictures of the old wheel, they never tell you to remove JUST the Inner Spoke on either side of the Valve Stem and Hold these 2 Spokes VERTICALLY, And then take a picture from at least 3 or 4 angles so that you see how many spoke holes + or - a "half hole" there are between the TOP inner Spoke and the Bottom Inner spoke you are holding vertically.
Once you know the number of holes between the Upper Inner and Lower Inner, you get the offset between sides correct.

On our 40 Spoke wheels, I had 6+ holes as the offset when I laced the wheel incorrectly the first time. Then I looked closely at my pictures and found that the offset was in reality only 5+ holes. That 1 hole difference had me going for a couple of hours until I finally figured it out. It is Such as Subtle Difference that you can walk past it a hundred times, throw your hands up (or throw the wheel across the garage - LOL) and not figure it out.

Now go back and look at the 2 pictures in my "Tell me the difference" post and the 2 pictures of the Hub in the following post.

And now I'll probably get thrown out of the Motorcycle Lacers Club for spilling the Secret to Wheel Lacing. Hahahahaha It could be like the "secret handshake"

Feel free to ask questions. I am willing to help anyone that asks.

Charlie

Stev-o · « **Reply #70 on:** August 18, 2014, 06:55:29 PM »

Glad you got it sorted, that seems to happen a lot. +1 keep your posts on one project thread.

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #71 on:** August 18, 2014, 06:59:32 PM »

Stev-O,

Thanks. It was definitely a Head Banger!
And I will contact the moderator and see if He (or She) can put the 2 threads together.
Hope it ain't like Humpty Dumpty. LOL

Thanks,

Charlie

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #72 on:** August 29, 2014, 03:04:44 PM »

So after getting a bunch of annoying stuff out of the way, I am working on getting the Steering Stem ready to do some rattle can spray touch up. Going the POR-15 route and then Rustoleum Gloss Black.
Doing some grinding of the little nubbies and sanding with 220 grit to provide some toothe for the POR and Rustoleum.

Also, while working on the steering stem I decided to get the Front Caliper apart. What a royal PITA!!! After several PBBlaster soaks and using my 8mm long handle allen wrench, I went out and got an 8mm hex socket and a 1/2 to 3/8 adapter and pulled out the Impact Driver and gave the bolts 3 or 4 Really Good Wallops and success! The bolts started coming out and changed to a 1/2 inch breaker bar and out they came. All I can say is THANK YOU Ilbikes/Gordon!!!! Without that Impact driver I would probably be going for hernia surgery. LOL
So here is a picture of the disassembled caliper. Question: How do I get the Pads out? Have read a couple of threads and one said to use air pressure. But that isn't going to get the fixed pad out. So, my question.
Thanks
Charlie

edwardmorris · « **Reply #73 on:** August 29, 2014, 10:42:09 PM »

The fixed one should fall out once you remove the cotter pin on the other side. For the piston side, I left the lines on the bike with fluid and no air gap. Then I just pumped the brake lever slowly till the piston started moving and fell out.

oldhatt45 · « **Reply #74 on:** August 31, 2014, 07:15:43 AM »

Yesterday I finally put up the new shop light, so I can see what I'm getting into before I do something stupid.
Then I started taking the caliper apart. Note to self. Read the instructions that come with the new parts BEFORE taking the old pieces apart.

Thanks Ed, puled the cotter pin and the fixed side pad fell right out.
The brake lever and pressure method probably would have worked, but, since I already had the brake system apart, I went to plan B. I used the compressor on my RV to pop the old piston out. Needed to use a hammer to free the piston up and wiggle it a bit, but air pressure worked and it came out.
Once it was out, I put the caliper in some Simple Green to soak over night. Hopefully it is cleaner than it started. Here are a couple of pictures after disassembly. Didn't look too bad to me. What do you guys think? (It sat for 25 years, so I expected it toe pretty bad.)
Will work on cleaning up the caliper today and possibly painting the frame neck.
Also waiting on the Dow Corning High Vacuum Grease for the caliper, so not in a hurry on putting the caliper back together. Wondering if I should clean up the old piston as a spare? Any thoughts?

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Author Topic: CB750 K6 - Step Step 12 - Now into some tweaking to get it right (Read 57792 times)